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randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#59226: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:08:43 PM

Is she toxic?

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Pachylad (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#59227: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:09:45 PM

Before the film: Maybe this will finally be the time we get an irredeemable villain!

After the film: uwu poor Spinel ;____;, gtfo Pink

or put more hilariously

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#59228: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:10:05 PM

I think it's because a lot of her other actions which had bad consequences were either made with good intentions, or were choices that were simply the best among many terrible ones.

Her abandoning Spinel, at least the way the movie framed it, seems to be based on nothing but her immaturity and contempt. She became a better person eventually, but this really was quite bad.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#59229: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:10:14 PM

She's way,way too possessive,thats fairly toxic

[up][up][up]

Edited by Ultimatum on Sep 12th 2019 at 12:11:54 PM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#59230: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:11:12 PM

Well she's hurting people to try to feel better about herself.

Also, her plan was to literally poison the planet.

So it works in layers.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#59231: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:13:06 PM

Yeah that's the thing. If Spinel was just trying to kill Steven and the Gems that would be one thing (unjustifiable still as it may be), but she was literally going to destroy all life on a planet which is basically the same thing the Diamonds were trying to do. In fact, Spinel got much farther than they did.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#59232: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:15:08 PM

RS: The thing about Spinel is that she’s a really toxic person. She’s so toxic that she’s literally trying to poison people. In my interactions with friends who have had a history difficult enough to make it hard for them to trust other people and sometimes even actively want to hurt others, it’s just a very difficult situation to navigate. In the case of Spinel and all of these characters, that’s extremely exaggerated because cartoons have the ability to be extreme exaggerations. I wanted to explore what it’s like when you’re trying to help someone who really doesn’t want to help themselves, who wants to embody the negative feelings that they have about themselves. I think that’s something really real. I hadn’t seen that in a cartoon before. Spinel, unlike many other characters, actually has the goal of hurting people, which is new territory for the show. She really wants to hurt Steven, and there’s a reason that she does—because she’s in so much pain. I just wanted to explore all the dimensions of that.

I also think Steven has his way of trying to handle and dissolve conflict. It’s not necessarily a good way for him to handle this situation. It really leaves him in a difficult state, and I think what I wanted to show in the way that they interact is that at a certain point, when you can’t help someone, you have to be able to protect yourself. Ultimately, he can’t really convince her to change. It’s something she’ll have to want for herself. But what he can do is protect himself from her, making it impossible for her to hurt him. It’s sort of up to you if you would like to love her. If you watch this movie and she, you know, frustrates you, that is totally fair. I want that to be a big part of who she is.

Hence why the entire final anime battle was him blocking while singing

Edited by Bocaj on Sep 12th 2019 at 8:17:05 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#59233: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:16:38 PM

Oh, okay...it's just after again.

[up][up]She would've won too, if it weren't for the plot.

Edited by randomness4 on Sep 12th 2019 at 5:16:50 AM

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Pachylad (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#59234: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:21:08 PM

One of the underrated (imo) parts of the film is also how Steven actually makes things worse when he does his usual "talking to the villains moment", ofc granted he wasn't in the best state of mind when trying to explain himself to Spinel at that point

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#59235: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:26:25 PM

He didn't make things worse by talking...

He made things worse by not doing "more" than just talking.

Also by not putting away the forgetful scythe.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#59236: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:30:08 PM

He was running on fumes by that point.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
MrSeyker Since: Apr, 2011
#59237: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:42:24 PM

TBH, I can't say I'm surprised at this new wave of demonization Pink has gotten because she hurt "baby Spinnel, cinnamon roll uwu".

This fandom has a long history of thinking purely in black and white terms and condemning characters for their mistakes, character development be damned.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#59238: Sep 12th 2019 at 5:48:07 PM

It's all backwards though...

Almost everything learned about Rose has been in reverse.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#59239: Sep 12th 2019 at 6:23:55 PM

And on top of that, there is still that unanswered question from years ago: if gems use light to form, what happens to a gem surrounded by endless darkness?

Gems glow, they produce their own light.

I like to think that Pink was fully intending to come back when she left Spinel there, but then Earth's life was so impressive that she completely forgot about her because she was too focused on running the Rebellion. If she ever did remember Spinel, it was after the war, and thus too late to go back for her.

Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#59240: Sep 12th 2019 at 6:32:35 PM

[up][up] Yeah, basically. Abandoning Spinel was terrible, of course, but the person Rose was when she died was very different to the person Pink was when she left Spinel behind.

Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢
SilentColossus (Don’t ask)
#59241: Sep 12th 2019 at 6:33:18 PM

[up][up]

Like in a Sitcom when they remember five hours too late to pick up their kid from school. Except it was 6000 years.

Edited by SilentColossus on Sep 12th 2019 at 6:33:35 AM

Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#59242: Sep 12th 2019 at 6:34:44 PM

Still, makes you ask how many more messes did Pink left for Steven to clean up.

Wake me up at your own risk.
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#59243: Sep 12th 2019 at 6:35:02 PM

We know why Pink/Rose did most of the stuff she did. We know she wanted a colony, but when she got it she realized it was hurting life there and she tried to stop it, first by talking to the other diamonds and then that rebellion. She made mistakes, but we knew why she started the rebellion. We don't know why she abandoned Spinel, and because of that it seems really mean. I'm not sure knowing her reasoning would make that seem less mean, but telling Spinel to just wait for her and then not come back, that seems bad. Possibly the most callous thing she's done.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#59244: Sep 12th 2019 at 6:43:15 PM

For me, while Pink/Rose did improve a lot but she had her biggest growth when Greg called her out on treating him like a toy.

So stuff like shoving Bismuth where nobody could ever find her AND never mentioning anything even up to the point she knew she'd die and nobody else would know about her shows that some of the same callousness that had her abandon Spinel stayed with her until the very end.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
MorningStar1337 The Encounter that ended the Dogma from 🤔 Since: Nov, 2012
The Encounter that ended the Dogma
#59245: Sep 12th 2019 at 6:46:05 PM

wild mass guessI'm gonna guess Pink thought she would be able to go the garden soon after she left, but the other Diamonds said "nope, running a colony is a full-time job". And then she rebelled, making it a little harder to go back (espeiclaly since she faked her death, Spinel knowing that presents a strategic risk as she could either blow the secret or be out for Rose's metaphorical blood like she was out for Steven's slightly less metaphorical blood)

Edited by MorningStar1337 on Sep 12th 2019 at 6:46:19 AM

SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#59246: Sep 12th 2019 at 11:56:41 PM

It's long but hoo boy it feels good.

My various fanfics.
DrDougsh Since: Jan, 2001
#59247: Sep 13th 2019 at 1:19:49 AM

Did people really expect Spinel to be irredeemable, though? I figured she'd be redeemed before we even knew anything about her.

I mean, at this point it'd feel off for a villain not to be redeemed. When you've already had the ultimate evil responsible for all things wrong in your setting turn good, having a character stay evil would just come off as unfair.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#59248: Sep 13th 2019 at 1:22:20 AM

They sure were hoping, despite how little sense it would've made.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#59249: Sep 13th 2019 at 1:37:20 AM

That was a fantastic clap-back to that stupid "critique" video that keeps getting circulated every now and then. The best part was probably when he revealed that one of the cited inspirations for the original video actually really dislikes how disingenuous it is and it's suspiciously copy-and-paste in sections from that video.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#59250: Sep 13th 2019 at 4:49:26 AM

It's long but hoo boy it feels good.
What is it?

The thumbnail makes it look like yet another "trash the show" video I generally have no interest in, but your post and [up] suggests it's not, and there's not enough of the title in the embed to go off either.

Also, more SU fanart by Mary Cagle, this time regular art of Spinel

https://twitter.com/cubewatermelon/status/1172357541143154688?s=19

https://twitter.com/cubewatermelon/status/1172408817318952961?s=19

Edited by sgamer82 on Sep 13th 2019 at 6:06:56 AM


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