@LSBK: I believe that death is often preferable to an alternative of something else horrible happening, yes. I believe that trying to extend a lifespan is pointless, yes. However, I believe that trying to make the life we do have better is a good idea.
@Slimcoder: Yes. Part if my problem with it is stealing someone's consciousness.
EDIT:
@Crossover-Enthusiast: No. It is literally impossible for any object whatsoever to last an infinite amount of time. Eventually, every single thing in the Universe will be ripped apart. Even if that were not true, after an infinite amount of time, every possible thing is guaranteed to happen, so, as every gem is physically capable of shattering, it is physically impossible for it to not shatter. That is how eternity works.
edited 12th Jan '18 7:31:18 PM by Sereg
I'd also feel the need to point at that as far as we know most of the Gems bubbles are corrupted monsters and it's almost guaranteed that by the end of the series they're going to be able to reverse the corruption. That will inevitably make their lives better. Just shattering them all, in contrast, does nothing to help them and robs them of the chance to actually live a happy life afterwards.
Either way, regardless of personally philosophies, defining bubbling as torture is just categorically incorrect. They are in no pain, and subject to no suffering during the process.
edited 12th Jan '18 7:34:21 PM by LSBK
...What.
Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢Except there not. We're talking being in stasis here, not something like solitary confinement. Have we even seen any negative consequences of bubbling?
Shattered gems have been twisted into things against the will and given a fate several times worse than death.
edited 12th Jan '18 7:36:06 PM by Cross
@LSBK: The fact that the torture happens at the end of the bubbling process doesn't make it not torture.
@Crossover-Enthusiast: Yes. They had consciousness and then you took that away from them. After you have taken away that much of what someone has, it would be less cruel to kill them.
@Cross: I have no idea what you mean by "Except your mother", but yes, we have. We saw the panic and fight of Peridot escaping after bubbling. That turned out all right, but imagine if it was, for example, Jasper? Also, we have seen how horribly culture shock affected Lapis.
You're basically redefining what torture is for your argument at this point.
Also, you say you think attempts to extend life are ultimately pointless but attempts to make life more enjoyable aren't? Because for most people those two things tend to coincide.
And Lapis wasn't bubbled, she was fully conscious and aware of the things around her.
edited 12th Jan '18 7:42:01 PM by LSBK
Something went wrong when I was typing, corrected it.
Lapis wasn't bubbled from what I remember, she was kept in Pearl's Hammerspace. Also, her being culture shocked was a matter of Homeworld changing, which is something that could have happened to Pearl or Garnet as well. Notice that Bismuth seemed relatively fine after being released with her only real issues tying to the war. When Peridot was released by Steven she keep talking as if she didn't know something happened to her.
edited 12th Jan '18 7:45:41 PM by Cross
Anyway, bubbling a Gem isn't "stealing" their conscious. It just puts it into stasis.
Also, Peridot's panicked stated was because a) she was in a place she barely knew, b) she was without her limb enhancers, and c) three fourths of the people in that place wanted to capture her.
Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢I get it. Basically, if there is a chance of shattering, it will eventually happen. Even if it takes a billion years. Like, if you didn't age, or get sick, you'd eventually get hit by a car or something. Or stuck by lightning. Gems are tougher than humans, but something will eventually get them.
But bubbling isn't killing. It keeps them safe until a time it is possible to free them. Even if that takes a while. They probably don't plan to keep Bismuth there forever, for example.
edited 12th Jan '18 8:04:11 PM by SilentColossus
Things usually coinciding doesn’t make them the same thing.
Which means her culture shock would have been even worse if she was bubbled.
Addressed Lapis. The fact that she was not bubbled reduced her cu;ture shock to Earth. Also, Bismuth still had to deal with the trauma of the war stuffed into a short timespan.
Subjecting them to the knowledge that so much has changed around them in what seems to be an instant.
Stealing someone’s consciousness is what putting them in stasis ‘’is’’.
Which is a similar thing that would happen to every single enemy that unbubbles.
EDIT:
Yes. Except it isn't being used to keep them safe. It's used to imprison them. (This is why I believe that imprisoning someone for life is inherently immoral)
EDIT: I'd be much happier if they indicated they intend to release Bismuth, but they have not indicated that.
edited 12th Jan '18 8:06:47 PM by Sereg
... And?
Yes, they'd experience culture shock. Big deal. Many people experience that. Lapis was traumatized because she experienced it all. Every second of being in that mirror. That is torture. The experience, not what happened afterward, is the reason for her PTSD. The culture shock was only a secondary element that amplified her experience, not the core. Bubbling would skip that.
edited 12th Jan '18 8:08:29 PM by SilentColossus
I made an edit. The point isn't that the culture shock is one of the most horrifying tortures ever. It's that it is an unnecessary, extra form of torture that they would never have had to experience and shouldn't have had to. They are going to shatter anyway. Why are you being so cruel that you decide that that isn't punishment enough and they have to have another punishment on top of that?
No? It's not? Those are two very different things??
Also, I think Lapis getting bubbled would've actually been better for her. At least then she wouldn't of been alone with her thoughts for thousands of years, freedom just out of her reach.
Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢I don't really get the argument
They're going to shatter anyway but if corruption can be cured they can have more life and experiences before that
Forever liveblogging the AvengersI'm going to die anyway. If I had to choose between dying now, or being teleported into the future, I'd choose the latter. Yes, I'd miss my family and friends. Terribly. I'd cry more than I'd ever cried, but unless I die first, I'm going to experience that anyway.
But if I were a gem my friends and family (both foreign to gems) might still exist.
How are they different things? Someone in stasis has no consciousness. They had consciousness. Then, you deliberately did something so that they no longer have consciousness. ie. you took their consciousness away ie you stole it.
EDIT: I'm not talking about corruption I'm talking about enemies who you plan to never allow to have any pleasant experiences ever again.
And n. It is not torture to teach your grandmother skype. It is torture to stop her from learning Skype so that her life becomes more difficult later. That is what I'm complaining about.
edited 12th Jan '18 8:18:04 PM by Sereg
Sereg, a quick question - an argument being put forward here is that shattering isn't actually killing Gems, so much as putting them in a horrific state of pain, effectively breaking their consciousness. I understand that you dispute this? If that's the case, why is that?
Oh God! Natural light!

Shattering isn't something that eventually happens. A Gem's gem doesn't degrade, and they can't die from age. Under the right circumstances, a Gem could very well live to the end of time, maybe even afterward.
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