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Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#51126: Jul 10th 2017 at 12:04:36 PM

primary source

edited 10th Jul '17 12:04:55 PM by Ultimatum

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51127: Jul 11th 2017 at 5:43:42 AM

Artbook is finally coming out today.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#51128: Jul 11th 2017 at 7:12:52 AM

On Kindle and hardback too,kindle is the cheaper option and means instant delivery but the hardback is more expensive,but a physical copy is always nicer to have

UK prices according to amazon

Kindle Edition £11.86

Hardcover £20.00

edited 11th Jul '17 8:27:43 AM by Ultimatum

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51129: Jul 11th 2017 at 12:09:27 PM

kindle is the cheaper option and means instant delivery
I preordered, so I'm still getting my physical copy today.

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51130: Jul 11th 2017 at 4:38:04 PM

In the foreword of the artbook, Rebecca Sugar notes much of the stuff is "totally raw and irrelevant to what the show became" ("You can't have a steak without mistakes.") She was not kidding. If you thought the actual pilot was different from the show, you haven't seen anything.

In the initial pitch for the pilot, Garnet (who was first named "Onyx", with Zircon as another possibly name), Amethyst, and Pearl seemingly only met Steven recently, when he became an intern for their team. They didn't know he was Rose Quartz's son, and even he didn't know he had magic power. The temple's shape was based on the creator of the Crystal Gemsnote , who made them in the past to protect humanity. Except then it turns out all the monsters came from her, because she decided modern humanity was corrupt and needed to be destroyed.

Yet despite this, there are recognizably similar concepts and characters. Though radically different, the show did use the idea that the gems' creator was malevolent. One of the earliest episode ideas included in the pitch is kind of like "Sadie's Song"... except instead of Steven finding out Sadie's could sing by overhearing her, he finds out because a pop star was actually a spirit from a cursed necklace possessing Sadie's body.

edited 11th Jul '17 4:38:44 PM by thatother1dude

Austin Since: Jan, 2001
#51131: Jul 11th 2017 at 5:35:54 PM

You can't have a steak without mistakes

She passed up a chance to do the porkchop thing? For shame.

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51132: Jul 11th 2017 at 6:15:23 PM

I can't tell if you're missing the point or just joking, but the next line after that was "Wait, which version of that line did we end up going with? Oh forgive me, it was the one about pork chops!"

edited 11th Jul '17 6:16:49 PM by thatother1dude

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#51133: Jul 11th 2017 at 6:19:35 PM

Huh. Interesting to see how the ideas for the show changed so much. It's quite intriguing.

edited 11th Jul '17 7:02:19 PM by AdricDePsycho

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Austin Since: Jan, 2001
#51134: Jul 11th 2017 at 7:00:09 PM

'Twas a joke. Glad she corrected herself afterwards.

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51135: Jul 11th 2017 at 8:07:09 PM

Interesting to see how the ideas for the show changed so much. It's quite intriguing.
When Sugar was getting advice for the pitch from Genndy Tartakovsky, she questioned Steven having magic powers at all.

Another idea from the pilot era, part of an episode that was scrapped after the storyboard stage, was that the gems covered their gemstones to disguise themselves as human when out in public.

Basically, Sugar had only a few things in mind from the very, very beginning: Steven's position as the youngest and weakest member on an otherwise-female team of magic warriors, Steven's basic personality, his relationship with the other three main characters, the general tone, and the mix of mundane and fantasy. I think that says a lot about the show's writing priorities.


Honestly, there's too much to talk about, including how a lot of the initial crew come on the show, and I'm only a quarter-way through. Buy the damn thing, it's great.

I'll just leave with some comments on the prototype Beach Citizen designs:

  • Buck had a forehead crease that makes him look old.
  • Sour Cream was angry-looking and had pink eyes.
  • Onion looked even more like his namesake, to the point that one drawing colors his hair tuft green, but less creepy because he had more facial expressions.
  • All the Frymans had bright red skin.
  • Peedee was really androgynous. In one drawing he has an oversized hand-me-down shirt tucked into his shorts, producing a silhouette strangely similar to Gumball Watterson's.
  • Ronaldo, then called "Franz", was fucking terrifying.

edited 11th Jul '17 8:07:35 PM by thatother1dude

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#51136: Jul 12th 2017 at 7:46:59 AM

Heh,interesting,the reason why the writers decided that Steven shouldn't be able to breathe inside Lion's Mane is so that he can't hide himself away from danger

edited 12th Jul '17 10:23:01 AM by Ultimatum

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
HextarVigar That guy from The Big House Since: Feb, 2015
That guy
#51137: Jul 12th 2017 at 8:57:19 AM

[up][up]

Ronaldo, then called "Franz", was fucking terrifying.

Yeah, but it was Ronaldo, so who cares?

edited 12th Jul '17 8:57:33 AM by HextarVigar

Your momma's so dumb she thinks oral sex means talking dirty.
PhiSat Planeswalker from Everywhere and Nowhere Since: Jan, 2011
Planeswalker
#51138: Jul 12th 2017 at 10:22:40 AM

I actually really like the original concept. While I like what they eventually stuck with it would have been nice to see the original as a different show.

Oissu!
thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51140: Jul 12th 2017 at 11:23:00 AM

the reason why the writers decided that Steven shouldn't be able to breathe inside Lion's Mane is so that he can't hide himself away from danger
Which is unnecessary and pointless on multiple levels: Steven doesn't consistently have Lion around, hiding in Lion's mane would only leave him safe so long as Lion was safe, and Lion can still make portals, which would be much more effective to run away with anyway.

They made a similar point about Steven's healing powers (essentially confirming that he never really lost them, they're just controlled by his emotions), even though there were few times it would have helped.

It's kind of bizarre that they put such effort into Holding Back the Phlebotinum in a few random cases, even though the gems have a lot of powers they don't use when it would be appropriate (Peridot's flight let her get away twice because the Crystal Gems didn't use shapeshifting or their ranged attacks) or have forgotten about entirely (Pearl's telekinesis, Steven's shield having some sort of Anti-Magic property).

I actually really like the original concept. While I like what they eventually stuck with it would have been nice to see the original as a different show.
"Young magic warrior intern" really is a pretty strong concept, just not the best for the kind of show Rebecca Sugar wanted. She wanted a bigger focus on family, so it was revised to be less Work Com and more Dom Com.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#51141: Jul 12th 2017 at 1:52:14 PM

It makes a lot of sense to me why there's no air in the pocket dimension,those things tend to operate on their rules of space and time,in this case it exists because Rose resurrected Lion,it's her own personal pocket dimension,ie. the perfect environment for a gem like her.

I agree however that their reasoning is flimsy,a better answer might be that if Lion's mane wasn't so hostile Steven would have a reason for spending more time inside it.and thus would uncover it's secrets more quickly,having it as hostile environment means he can only spend a limited time,so he's discouraged from more readily exploring it

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
RhymeBeat True colors from Eastern Standard Since: Aug, 2009 Relationship Status: In Lesbians with you
True colors
#51142: Jul 12th 2017 at 2:10:45 PM

The issue with that is that it's a pocket dimension with a tree in it... AKA an oxygen source. Yeah it's a magic tree, but still.

The Crystal Caverns A bird's gotta sing.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#51143: Jul 12th 2017 at 2:29:53 PM

It has some kind of atmosphere.

We see there's a breeze blowing. Hence air.

Just not air that Steven can breathe.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#51144: Jul 12th 2017 at 2:33:20 PM

When I first heard about the show I was expecting it to be like Sailor Moon, but with a male tagalong kid who somehow got powers that typically only women get.

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51145: Jul 12th 2017 at 2:43:14 PM

It makes a lot of sense to me why there's no air in the pocket dimension
That's an entirely different kind of "why".

a better answer might be that if Lion's mane wasn't so hostile Steven would have a reason for spending more time inside it.and thus would uncover it's secrets more quickly,having it as hostile environment means he can only spend a limited time,so he's discouraged from more readily exploring it
He was already using it as a storage bin by "Rose's Scabbard". There's so little to explore that Steven clearly saw everything there almost immediately, he just didn't know what the things are.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#51146: Jul 12th 2017 at 2:47:14 PM

Well there's one possibility that I've just thought of,the appearance of the dimension is an illusion,the trees aren't actual trees at all,but since Rose created the dimension it's based off how she wanted it to appear,in this case it's a living environment,kinda goes with how gems are illusion of light

Edit:One thing I'm surprised to learn is that Cartoon Network does no in house animation of it's own,but that's understandable due to the cost involved

edited 12th Jul '17 3:53:13 PM by Ultimatum

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
JBC31187 Since: Jan, 2015
#51147: Jul 12th 2017 at 4:51:23 PM

Maybe that isn't really grass blowing around. Maybe it's just the other end of Lion's mane?

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#51148: Jul 12th 2017 at 5:51:48 PM

Lion's mane presumably contains an inert gas (maybe nitrogen) plus a moderate amount of carbon dioxide; it's simple enough. If it were a vacuum, that would maim and/or kill Steven, and a purely inert atmosphere wouldn't produce the sensation of suffocation (and could very easily result in asphyxiation since you wouldn't notice anything wrong until you were in danger of passing out from oxygen starvation); that comes from excessive concentrations of CO2, not from low oxygen.

edited 12th Jul '17 5:55:02 PM by CaptainCapsase

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#51149: Jul 12th 2017 at 6:37:15 PM

If you ever write or see a scene where a couple of characters are trapped in an airtight room remember this conversation:

A: We're going to run out of oxygen!

B: No. That's not going to happen.

A: You mean you've found a way out?

B: No. What I mean is that we'll die of CO2 poisoning long before we run out of oxygen.

edited 12th Jul '17 6:37:24 PM by WillKeaton

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#51150: Jul 12th 2017 at 7:13:11 PM

One thing I'm surprised to learn is that Cartoon Network does no in house animation of it's own
Really? Production of traditional animation for TV had pretty much all moved overseas by the early 1990s. That the crew due bits of bespoke animation is the rarity.

If it were a vacuum, that would maim and/or kill Steven
Bismuth could talk fine in there, so it's definitely not a vacuum. (Her voice being unchanged would indicate density the same as Earth's atmosphere, though that's fact is obscure enough that I wouldn't expect the writers to have thought of it.)

Lion's mane presumably contains an inert gas (maybe nitrogen) plus a moderate amount of carbon dioxide; it's simple enough.
Well, the really weird thing is that Steven didn't breath in and realize there was no oxygen, but was unable to breath at all. It was as if he was being smothered by Lion's mane despite it not obstructing his mouth.

If I had to come up with a justification, it would be that whatever prevents gas exchange through the portals Steven makes somehow covers Steven in an airtight shield while inside the Pocket Dimension.

But, more likely, prevent breathing (just in Steven or other organic lifeforms?) is just an arbitrary magical property of the inside of the mane. Hell, maybe it's a safety feature Rose or Lion implemented, so when Steven first poked his head in, he knew to hold his breath instead of having the aforementioned problem of unaware oxygen deprivation.


All my future posts about the artbook will about what's possibly significance to the show's actual canon—after one more bit of clarification.

The sketch of the Cluster (along with another one on the opposite page) was from extremely early—it was literally made in the initial writing sessions where they came up with the whole concept.

edited 12th Jul '17 7:20:28 PM by thatother1dude


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