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thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#50726: Jun 13th 2017 at 4:21:32 PM

Steven's ability to resurrect the dead effectively takes the wind out of any heroic sacrifices in a finale showdown, unless it's either a gem or somebody gets straight up vaporized.
Or someone dies in a way where Steven won't be able to reach their body.

Or hell, just makes a sacrifice that doesn't involve dying

Sedorna Since: Apr, 2014
#50727: Jun 13th 2017 at 4:32:30 PM

[up][up]

Well, Lars' heartbeat wasn't slow until after he was resurrected. Before that, it was stopped.

xanderiskander Since: Mar, 2012
#50728: Jun 13th 2017 at 4:39:26 PM

His parents will probably be outraged that Steven got him into this mess and drastically altered his biology.
It seems kind of out of character for Lars' parents to be outraged about anything. Them being scared of Steven and the gems for putting him into that mess would be a new development though. None of the human characters in the show have ever really been scared of the Crystal Gems before.

Well I guess there was Connie's mom kind of, but that was more because of her using swords I think.

edited 13th Jun '17 4:40:47 PM by xanderiskander

PhiSat Planeswalker from Everywhere and Nowhere Since: Jan, 2011
Planeswalker
#50729: Jun 13th 2017 at 4:41:15 PM

I dunno, the Beach City residents seem to either have a Weirdness Censor or have been Conditioned to Accept Horror. They probably will just shrug it off and accept it like they do most other Gem strangeness.

... Except for Ronaldo.

Oissu!
xanderiskander Since: Mar, 2012
#50730: Jun 13th 2017 at 4:46:03 PM

I dunno, the Beach City residents seem to either have a Weirdness Censor or have been Conditioned to Accept Horror. They probably will just shrug it off and accept it like they do most other Gem strangeness.

... Except for Ronaldo.

Which is why I think it would be a new development. If more human characters start becoming afraid and suspicious of the Crystal Gems it would mean Cerebus Syndrome is starting to take effect.

edited 13th Jun '17 4:47:59 PM by xanderiskander

InAnOdderWay Since: Nov, 2013
#50731: Jun 13th 2017 at 4:52:34 PM

[up][up] ESPECIALLY RONALDO. You think at first that Ronaldo is interested in the Gems because they're literally thousand year old alien warriors, but it becomes clear over time that the one thing Ronaldo doesn't care about is, well, the Gems. He's straight up disappointed when Steven explains how all the oddities in Beach City are caused by the gems, and his various reactions to this (blaming the gems for everything, trying to join the Crystal Gems) seem to only further solidify the idea that Ronaldo straight up doesn't really understand how unusual the gems are.

It's the combination of Weirdness Censor and the show's viciously apolitical, well aeverything, standpoint when it comes to the human race (versus the hyperpolitical nature of gem society) that makes Townie episodes so unbearable. In any other show built around supernatural elements "filler" would mean maybe an episode that doesn't add to the lore or a side episode that doesn't focus on the story at hand, maybe occasionally an explicit joke episode that doesn't include any weirdness. In Steven Universe there's like a 30-40% chance that any given episode (after Season 1A when we stop going on regular missions) is just straight up not going to reference any gem stuff, at all. No corrupted monsters, no Crystal Gems, not even any references to past events in a way that acknowledges the nature of the show as existing within an evolving universe. Just... less-than-well-developed people just living their lives throughout frustratingly overplayed SOL plotlines.

edited 13th Jun '17 4:53:26 PM by InAnOdderWay

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#50732: Jun 13th 2017 at 6:44:33 PM

[up]I disagree, the reason the twonie episode were so need it is because it show Steven in civilian setting and why he is so need it and adverting the shinji syndrome, what I agree is that the town have outlived is purpose a this point, Steven should be deal with homeworld already and not wasting time with more civilian plot, specially now that Lars is homeworld.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
InAnOdderWay Since: Nov, 2013
#50733: Jun 13th 2017 at 7:04:58 PM

[up] I get that, but by disconnecting the town so much from Steven's real life it feels like we're watching two different shows, and one of the shows is a hell of a lot worse written than the storyboarders think it is. It's great when the two worlds crossover a little, like when a Gem's shenanigans force some nice beach fun bonding, or when the Cool Kids stumble upon Peridot's escape pod, or even when just a corrupted gem washes up on beach and everyone gets to kick ass for a few minutes, but when the show ignores all of that and it's just "Steven in Beach City"... Beach City isn't strong enough as a setting to support that. And it probably could never be because of how all the cool character segments are shoved into the Crystal Gems (and Lars, who is better but has a horrible case of Aesop Amnesia).

darkabomination Since: Mar, 2012
#50734: Jun 13th 2017 at 7:47:15 PM

AH, another debate. Nothing really to add, I like them well enough and enjoy the characters. The fact that Lars got a lot of development is fantastic, he and Sadie always were my favorites.

On the humans character page, the way Connie's tropes are going, she might need a page of her's, the list is up to 250 entries. Sure it needs editing, but Peridot's was somewhat smaller at the time she got her own.

The Crystal Gems should stay on their own page in spite of their trope lists, it's a convenient catch-all place to put them. Steven being the main character stands out a bit.

InAnOdderWay Since: Nov, 2013
#50735: Jun 13th 2017 at 8:36:00 PM

[up] I hate the way Lars's development was treated, but I do like him as a character. Weirdly enough the second we're actually allowed to see Lars take actual steps as a character (The New Lars and onwards), suddenly Lars becomes one of the most popular characters in the show. I feel like it's because he's more like the gems in how he's allowed to be a dick, but a three dimensional dick vs. Marty and Kevin. He actually reacts to societal pressure, which, "gasp", actually implies that there is indeed a human society to put pressure, real or imagined, on Lars.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#50736: Jun 13th 2017 at 9:37:53 PM

[up]I like the character, but I hate the passing it take with him because he was a dick so long it feel somewhat sudden.

Also, like I said the beach episode are needed to ground steven as charming protagonist who win people with words and being nices rather than by fighting, avoding the same problem with anime protagonist who are too emocional, the whole "get in damn robot" problem.

But like I said by now things have change, Steven is a whole different person dealing with another stuff, they can just put beach town stuff anymore(even more with Lars in homeworld) unless is not related to the gems.

Or let me put it simple: THIS is the point of not return for show about stuff, they HAVE to deal with the homeworld stuff more because the way the status quo is set it feelling more annoying than everything else.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
xanderiskander Since: Mar, 2012
#50737: Jun 13th 2017 at 10:18:25 PM

I don't think Lars really even changed that much. He was still grumpy and sarcastic on the space ship so I don't really feel like his personality suddenly changed. He was still sarcastic after that too, so it's not like it went away when they got to homeworld either. It's just more excusable given the situation they were in is already stressful, and because he's acknowledging for the first time that he was being a jerk. The biggest difference I think is he's using sarcasm to lament the situation instead of using it to blame Steven (and other people) now.

edited 13th Jun '17 10:23:13 PM by xanderiskander

InAnOdderWay Since: Nov, 2013
#50738: Jun 14th 2017 at 6:16:40 AM

The biggest difference is just acknowledging the fact that Lars can, well, develop. He's a sarcastic ass still, we love him for it, but he's also capable of overcoming his fear, or of taking a stance, or of making tougher calls, without this worry if the next episode will just ignore all of it.

Victin Since: Dec, 2011
#50739: Jun 14th 2017 at 7:12:14 AM

The reaction of the townsfolk to the gems reminds me very much of Ponyo on the Cliff by the Sea. The movie has a message of acceptance, so everyone's reaction to the eponymous fish/demigoddess turning into a child, walking on water, and bringing around the end of the world is, notably, a major lack of a reaction.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#50740: Jun 14th 2017 at 7:41:25 AM

There have also been corrupted gems roaming the Earth for thousands of years

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
32_Footsteps Think of the mooks! from Just north of Arkham Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Think of the mooks!
#50741: Jun 14th 2017 at 9:13:12 AM

As a side note, regarding whether or not Lars counts as a zombie... well, we can always split the difference and say that he's a Technically Living Zombie. Otherwise, well, we have the usual issue of whether anyone who is Back from the Dead counts as a zombie (personally, I like to reserve "zombie" specifically for beings with no life signs that are still somehow ambulatory, which would disqualify Lars, but I'm content to let that one go, as Internet arguments over zombies are pretty far down on the list of things that intrigue me).

For where portals can come from on a revived creature... hmm... I take it that there has to be a minimum hair length involved... otherwise, Steven could enter a portal anywhere on Lion (I'm presuming that Lion, like most lions, has a thin coat of fur over most of his body). For what would happen if someone who lacked hair got revived and turned pink... I'll just go with a WMG that says that the revival process would grant someone with alopecia universalis or the like with a brand new tuft of pink hair to make the portal work. I mean, if magic can revive someone, change their color, give them access to extradimensional space, and slow down their metabolic processes to a ridiculous degree, I'm going to go onto a pretty sturdy limb and say that follicular stimulation is also within its capabilities.

Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#50742: Jun 14th 2017 at 10:42:38 AM

Maybe Lion and Lars' skin isn't actually pink, and it's just that their body hair looks like it is.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#50743: Jun 14th 2017 at 10:50:15 AM

I wasn't aware that Lars was so hairy then...

Austin Since: Jan, 2001
#50744: Jun 14th 2017 at 1:23:08 PM

I'm of the opinion that Lars isn't necessarily undead, just...different.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#50745: Jun 14th 2017 at 1:43:08 PM

Undead would mean no heartbeat but still moving,plus being kinda pale..like ghost white

A slower heart beat and being pink says he's alive,but it's more of a second life for him

edited 14th Jun '17 1:44:01 PM by Ultimatum

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
xanderiskander Since: Mar, 2012
#50746: Jun 14th 2017 at 2:17:48 PM

He was dead. Now he's pink and moving around. I'm still calling him a Pink Zombie.

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#50747: Jun 14th 2017 at 2:33:51 PM

regarding whether or not Lars counts as a zombie... well, we can always split the difference and say that he's a Technically Living Zombie.
It's just semantics anyway. Voodoo Zombie (person brought from death to undeath by magic, usually to be a slave) is closest trope to the original meaning of "zombie", but even that's too specific—the original meaning even including people enchanted by mind-control magic while they were still alive.

Maybe Lion and Lars' skin isn't actually pink, and it's just that their body hair looks like it is.
It's pink skin. Lars has a scene where pinching it made it change color briefly, then it changed back as blood flowed into it.

Undead would mean no heartbeat but still moving,
Just like "zombie", "undead" has no clear definition, because "alive/life" has no clear definition. One could theoretically being alive while still lacking a heartbeat—there are already designs for artificial hearts that pump blood continuously, thus producing neither a heartbeat nor pulse.

plus being kinda pale..like ghost white
They are pale, relatively speaking—paler than Lars's original skin and hair color, what one assumes was Lion's original fur and mane color, and the color of Rose/Steven's powers.

He was dead.
Depending on his other injuries, Lars may not have been dead yet—which again relates to what you consider "alive". His heart stopped, but for less than a minute (I timed it at 45 seconds from injury to being splashed by Steven's tears, then 15 more seconds until he started moving again). Even in real life, one can survive having their heart stop for several minutes without permanent brain damage—just ask Nikki Sixx.

I'm still calling him a Pink Zombie.
So am I, mostly because it's a convenient descriptor of what Lars and Lion are. And it amuses me.

edited 14th Jun '17 2:39:00 PM by thatother1dude

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#50748: Jun 14th 2017 at 2:57:25 PM

I'm wondering now if there's a catch to Lars coming back,not necessarily a bad catch,but a catch none the less

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
PhiSat Planeswalker from Everywhere and Nowhere Since: Jan, 2011
Planeswalker
#50749: Jun 14th 2017 at 3:00:45 PM

Is being a Pink Zombie not enough of a catch?

Oissu!
xanderiskander Since: Mar, 2012
#50750: Jun 14th 2017 at 3:03:16 PM

Being stuck on homeworld is a big catch too. Unless you mean "coming back" to earth?

edited 14th Jun '17 3:11:03 PM by xanderiskander


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