I mean, "better than Lapis and Jasper" is Damning With Faint Praise if I've ever heard it. I'd like to set the bar for any potential relationship much higher than that.
Honestly, I think that it's not fair to tie together "get over depression" (which on its own carries a bunch of Unfortunate Implications - while I do want to see Lapis get more mentally sound, I think that makes it sound like she's deliberately wallowing and could just choose to be happier, when the actual truth is that she's had thousands of years of trauma that's she's dealing with the best she can) and "get into a relationship." She could become more emotionally secure without getting into a relationship... or, for that matter, get into a relationship without getting emotionally secure.
I like Lapis (she's probably my favorite character on the show), and I honestly think she'd be better served to show that you can have meaningful connections without them necessarily being romantic ones. I don't have problems with ships in general (I have a few); I just don't think that a character necessarily needs to be in one.
Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.I didn't say "get over" depression. I said overcoming. That means living with it and doing your best with the weight. And I would be happy to see someone with depression still having a relationship and that it doesn't just make you sad and broken.
Please do not put words in my mouth.
edited 22nd Feb '17 10:23:20 AM by Mr.Badguy
Blue and Green isn't the best color combination.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.I'll confess that I don't really ship here as much as I do some other stuff (though it's never been my primary focus). I guess I'm just glad that this show allows for so many lady ships.
Oh God! Natural light!I just ship Lapis, Peridot, and Amethyst as an OT3, but I'm not, like, overt about it or anything.
Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?I just can't see seriously shipping Amethyst because she seems like she'd be more interested in a "friends with benefits" setup rather than a relationship. That said, I guess, in retrospect, that Rose also seemed like that when they showed the flashback of when she met Greg. So I guess that I could see Amethyst eventually committing to a relationship... just not at the moment with anyone she's met thus far.
Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.The thing about Gems and shipping to me is that, with the exception of Garnet, Rose, and maybe Pearl, Gems in general don't really have a concept of romance as we know it. This would be especially true of Homeworld Gems like Peri and Lapis. Even Ruby and Sapphire didn't really get what was going in between them at first.
Ah, sorry folks, I didn't mean to kick anything off (though I should have thought it through, probably). I think whatever the endgame is, Lapis and Peridot are doing well for each other and are helping each other out. I'm not entirely fond of... whichever writer's Lapis is Sardonic Snarky Lapis, but she's been through a lot since Ocean Gem, so I guess I can see it. Panicky Pearl is a clear enough difference that it can be... well, not ignored in characterization, but just taken into consideration as part of her character and not strictly speaking how she actually is; but Lapis seems to have settled into her snark pretty solidly, unless she's talking to Steven. I'd still love to see an 'I live here' speech from her like we got from Peri, though.
It's been fun.![]()
I'd counter that nobody really has a grasp of what romance is until they're really in one. Observing and participating are completely different experiences.
Besides which, I've had my suspicions about just what kind of background Amethyst and Vidalia had. Not to mention what else has happened at shows Amethyst has attended. I don't think Amethyst is what anyone would call an ingenue. I suspect she does know what romance is; she's just not necessarily interested at the moment.
edited 22nd Feb '17 11:41:36 AM by 32_Footsteps
Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.
I didn't say "grasp", I said "concept". As in the idea literally never even occurred to them in any way.
Your average schmuck understands the idea of romance, even if they don't quite "get" it until that first-hand experience. That description might fit Rose Quartz before Greg, but Gems, in general, don't have even that.
Romance to Gems is like an automobile to a caveman. It's filled with things they have never once considered or, until that moment, had the capacity to consider. The ultimate embodiment of Gems' love, Fusion, is dismissed as a trick by Homeworld Gems like Jasper.
edited 22nd Feb '17 11:48:06 AM by sgamer82
I think "grasp" versus "concept" is a bit of hair-splitting in this context. Besides, Amethyst at this point certainly has enough second-hand observation (between Garnet, Rose and Greg, Vidalia and Yellowtail, and whoever else she may have had interactions with) that finding romance a completely unfathomable idea is unlikely. Maybe she hasn't felt it, and she might not really get it as a consequence, but it's not completely alien to Amethyst.
For basically the entire population of Homeworld, sure, I agree with you that romance as a concept just doesn't exist for them (unless there are secret underground rebelling societies in Homeworld that dabble in that sort of thing, but that's unlikely to come up in the show itself, so fanfic away on that concept). But I think all of the core Crystal Gems get it (with Garnet naturally getting it the best), and I think there's a reasonable chance that Peridot kind of gets it. Depending on just how much Lapis has gotten into Camp Pining Hearts, maybe she's starting to get it, too.
Of course, that said, it wouldn't surprise me if Bismuth did not get it; her comments throughout her episode suggest a much more utilitarian worldview, one that might see romance as more of a distraction than anything else.
Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.But that comes down to their society, not their physiology or anything. Ruby and Sapphire got it pretty quickly after they fell to Earth, for instance, and if it was an inherent trait of their species they wouldn't understand ever. It's clear that the Crystal Gems have learned quite a lot from being around humans like Greg and Steven, but I think that's more indicative that rather than not understanding romance or love, they were just never given the words for it in Homeworld society.
It's been fun.Well, that moves into Language Equals Thought and other aspects of linguistic theory. Though I think the whole "meepmorps" thing in "Beta" went more towards the more common theory that a concept will quickly get named when discovered even if language is controlled to direct the population away from certain concepts. It doesn't matter if the gem language lacks a word for "romance" inherently - it can still be discovered and dealt with even if the society discourages it. Tangentially, I do get the giggles from the idea that Garnet came up with a word a la "meepmorps" to describe "romance" before she became familiar with the term.
Also, I kinda got the impression from "The Answer" that Ruby and Sapphire didn't get it very quickly, which is why Garnet peppered Rose with those questions when the two met on Earth. For obvious reasons, though, Garnet glossed that and it isn't exactly clear just how quickly she understood it. It could have been a day; it could have been a century.
EDIT: I just had a Fridge Logic moment... Homeworld wasn't completely without a concept of "art," as there are multiple examples (most prominently, the murals of the Diamonds on the moon base) of gem art throughout the series. Where did "meepmorps" even come from if they already have art?
edited 22nd Feb '17 12:11:31 PM by 32_Footsteps
Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.Ah, my bad - I meant less that the words specifically didn't exist and more that the concept wasn't emphasized at all. The Gems are clearly capable of feelings of love (Blue Diamond clearly loved Pink Diamond, presumably as her daughter), but it seems like what Gem society in general doesn't care about is individuality. Pearls are Pearls, Rubies are Rubies. It seems like individuality is more tolerated in the higher echelons, but only because lower-rank Gems are terrified to speak against their superiors.
^I imagine those are for historical purposes or memorials, whereas Lapis and Peridot's meepmorps are closer to art for the sake of self-expression, or modern art.
edited 22nd Feb '17 12:15:23 PM by RedSavant
It's been fun.I think, ideally from Homeworld's perspective, lower caste gems are built to direct all of their love towards their Diamond, and that the Diamonds then return that love in a sort of Noblesse Oblige. That's what I got from how Yellow Diamond reacted towards Blue Diamond in "That Will Be All." Romance would thus be verboten because that would be "misdirected" love that should belong to the Diamonds.
For memorials/historical renderings versus meepmorps... I guess it's reasonable that Lapis and Peridot just didn't see the connection between what they did and what previous artisans did (other examples I can think of include statuary and some of the architectural flourishes on gem productions), It's also possible that the word for "art" in the gem language is or very similar to "meepmorps," and Lapis and Peridot just didn't know that the two were synonymous. I would say that it's strange that neither knew what "art" was, but then again, Peridot and "touch stumps." I probably should chalk this one up to Lapis being more-or-less out of touch with language development and Peridot being kept more or less ignorant outside of anything she'd need for her original job.
Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.Don't really care for any Peri ships, her having a temporary interest in Amethyst but it never going anywhere beyond that is fine because most people in real life have crushes like that all the time. And I Lapidot is alright but I'm not feeling it enough to ship it in earnest. Especially since I'm not that big on shipping in the first place.
I'm beginning to think that concepts like this either existed or weren't as strictly banned on Homeworld before Pink's shattering, but with Blue too broken up about this (pun not intended) and Yellow scrapping any symbols, discussion, or facts about Pink's existence at large, ever since her death Gem society's gone sterile. Lapis expressed shock and dismay at what Homeworld had become since she was last there.
In a way we were right that Pink was being unpersoned, but the motives and that Yellow specifically is behind it changes the context significantly. Jury's still out on White however.
I've seen a theory that Pearl may be a White Pearl who used to serve White Diamond; both Yellow Pearl and Blue Pearl have their gems in the same place as their Diamonds, and White Diamond's Gem is in her forehead, like Pearl's. Pearl also hesitates on the Zoo when she says 'back when I served... Homeworld'.
I think that Yellow Diamond will eventually end up the main Big Bad, honestly. There's an old theory that White Diamond was essentially imprisoned on Earth in the upside-down Pyramid (either after being betrayed or being defeated by Rose), which would take some political power to pull off. Pink Diamond was shattered, and Blue Diamond is so overcome with grief right now that she can barely function, thousands of years after the fact. Yellow Diamond rules the Diamond Authority right now more or less unchallenged.
(It occurs to me that maybe Rose didn't shatter Pink... maybe someone else did, and Rose took the blame on Homeworld for something Yellow Diamond ordered. I'm also still not convinced that Rose isn't Pink Diamond herself.)
Oh well; we have another Ronaldo-looks-for-rock-people episode soon, and if I remember right the last time he mentioned them he basically explained the Diamond Authority, so maybe we'll get some new info soon.
It's been fun.

they never used them in the first place
i guess you can watch me shitpost i guess