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Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#45526: Dec 13th 2016 at 5:06:23 PM

Probably not

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#45527: Dec 13th 2016 at 5:10:44 PM

She shouldn't be able to control water temperature...

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
SalFishFin Since: Jan, 2001
#45528: Dec 13th 2016 at 5:19:41 PM

Malachite being able to form ice out of water probably didn't come from Jasper...

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#45529: Dec 13th 2016 at 5:20:36 PM

Dang it...

Amplified fusion power....

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#45530: Dec 13th 2016 at 5:29:47 PM

Considering Lapis knows what flirting is, I imagine she knows what snow is.

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randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#45531: Dec 13th 2016 at 5:31:07 PM

That doesn't make sense...

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#45532: Dec 13th 2016 at 6:59:07 PM

Eh, sorry. What I meant was that because Lapis knows about stuff she logically shouldn't know about (like flirting), she might know what snow is.

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shigmiya64 Somebody get this freaking duck away from me! from a settlement that needs our help, General Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Somebody get this freaking duck away from me!
#45533: Dec 13th 2016 at 7:15:49 PM

Why wouldn't she know about flirting?

Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#45534: Dec 13th 2016 at 7:39:09 PM

Eh, true.

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Cailleach Studious Girl from Purgatory Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
Studious Girl
#45535: Dec 13th 2016 at 7:44:18 PM

I refuse to believe there are no romantic relationships of any kind on Homeworld. Maybe they're kept in secret but I refuse to believe there are none. I mean look at human history. No regime, no disaster, no war, no anything, has ever stopped people from hooking up in secret.

So Lapis could certainly know what flirting is

edited 13th Dec '16 7:44:51 PM by Cailleach

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#45536: Dec 13th 2016 at 7:51:58 PM

Malachite being able to form ice out of water probably didn't come from Jasper...
That doesn't necessarily mean she's seen ice in the form of snow. You might look at large salt crystals and finely powdered salt without realizing they're the same substance.

Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#45537: Dec 13th 2016 at 7:59:16 PM

Forgetting my last three posts, I'd like to mention that the water clone Crystal Gems' weapons are made out of ice.

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KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#45538: Dec 13th 2016 at 8:37:16 PM

I refuse to believe there are no romantic relationships of any kind on Homeworld. Maybe they're kept in secret but I refuse to believe there are none. I mean look at human history. No regime, no disaster, no war, no anything, has ever stopped people from hooking up in secret.

For argument's sake, the reason we place so much importance on love and caring about people nowadays is that we're a species that needs to hook up in order to continue, and has relied on family groups to survive since long before human history was even a thing.

A perfect reason for why Homeworld doesn't have that kind of relationship is because they don't need those things, and never have: children are grown, fully "adult," in what are essentially factories. The entire system from the moment they awake is about rigidly falling into the role you're given, and not thinking of yourself or others in any way that doesn't pertain to that. We don't have any reason yet to think that this isn't the way it's always been in their species' history, since they're obviously all artificial life forms in the first place.

Homeworld's problem is more than simply not caring about other people (Peridot, for example, cares about Yellow Diamond, and grief over her failure to protect someone she cared about is arguably Jasper's Start of Darkness - she was a brutal soldier before, but the person she is now is a very different kind of broken), it's about appreciating others in the same way you appreciate and understand yourself. Homeworld doesn't do that. There's no reason to. On Homeworld, the Other is not you - by design. And if the Other is you, all that means is that the both of you are less individually important.

This was also Rose's problem with Greg - she cared about him, but didn't realize she needed to appreciate and understand him. Pearl, arguably, had that same problem with Rose herself - her devotion is very informed by the relationship they had back in the day, and Pearl could never get over that subservient devotion. It explains why Garnet is a Love Freak, and the quickest to understand matters of love of all of them - not just because she's in a romantic relationship herself, but because fusion by necessity causes people to appreciate each other in ways nothing else can and Garnet is the one who was most affected and shaped by that epiphany. And it explains why Amethyst never felt the need to grow up until Steven came along.

In fact, it explains why all of them are much better now thanks to Steven. They're probably the first of their kind to actually raise another sentient being while caring about it as one of their own, since Gem children aren't raised.

edited 13th Dec '16 8:43:32 PM by KnownUnknown

darkabomination Since: Mar, 2012
#45539: Dec 13th 2016 at 10:55:32 PM

That's a good point. With Rose's adoration of human change from watching baby Sour Cream, it's an incredible jump to want it so badly she's willing to undo everything that makes her a person so she can experience growing up as a human child.

And Steven's right, for all their talk of Gems not being able to change, they really did, and in such a short time too.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#45540: Dec 13th 2016 at 11:19:13 PM

They're confused about the type of change...

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Austin Since: Jan, 2001
#45541: Dec 14th 2016 at 4:59:11 AM

On the subject, I was surprised to find out that Rose was created on Earth. I had always pegged her as someone who traveled the galaxy doing Homeworld things, and not learning to appreciate other species until she came to Earth.

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#45542: Dec 14th 2016 at 5:20:14 AM

I was surprised to find out that Rose was created on Earth.
I still don't think that's what Bismuth meant by "made right here in the dirt". For one thing, that would make Pearl older than Rose, despite her describing herself as relative young when she joined her in "Sworn to the Sword".

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#45543: Dec 14th 2016 at 5:24:45 AM

Doesn't have to mean that...necessarily.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#45544: Dec 14th 2016 at 5:35:05 AM

Maybe Earth was under Homeworld control for a long time before Rose kicked off her rebellion?

Austin Since: Jan, 2001
#45545: Dec 14th 2016 at 7:24:21 AM

I've honestly never been sure if Bismuth was being literal, but I thought it'd be safer to assume the simpler explanation.

thatother1dude from Land of the Ill, Annoyin' Since: Jan, 2001
#45546: Dec 14th 2016 at 7:32:17 AM

I think the biggest conclusion to reach, from how such a vague comment didn't get any response, is that it doesn't matter.

Yinyang107 from the True North (Decatroper) Relationship Status: Tongue-tied
#45547: Dec 14th 2016 at 8:20:42 AM

[up]Don't be silly. This is fandom; everything matters. tongue

32_Footsteps Think of the mooks! from Just north of Arkham Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Think of the mooks!
#45548: Dec 14th 2016 at 10:39:38 AM

Re: Pearl and speciesism... well, I don't know. Pearl might be the most condescending about it, but in some ways, I find her the least prejudiced against humans - she seems to be the one most ready to dismiss things humans have done, but she also seems to be the least cavalier about human lives. She seems to be the one most likely to make sure a given person lives, even if she thinks little of them.

I don't condone her attitude (or at least early attitude - I'm hoping that she's changing in this regard, and the evidence is hopeful), but I don't think it's as bad as some people paint it.

Re: Lapis and snow... well, I don't want to put too much stock into what Malachite did, between fusions being more powerful and the fact that Japser might have had temperature powers that weren't really explored. I don't recall Lapis ever changing water into ice or controlling it on her own, but that could be because she never tried. As for whether or not she knows about snow, I guess it depends where in the world the Homeworld Warp is. If it was in the tropics, she might not have seen it before.

Re: Where Rose was formed... personally, I like the idea that Rose was formed on Homeworld, because that would make Rose and Japser excellent Foils of each other - Rose was the Homeworld quartz that grew to love the beauty of Earth and even defied her Diamond to protect it, while Japser was the Earth-grown quartz that hated everything about Earth and grew fanatical about both Homeworld and her Diamond. Sure, it still works if Rose is from Earth, but I like the symmetry.

Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.
smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#45549: Dec 14th 2016 at 11:01:17 AM

Another thing to note about Pearl's view of humans is that out of all the gems, she's currently the second closest to human culture. Amethyst is closer, and fits in well, but Pearl is getting there. She drives, talks to humans when they come to the temple, and she had Last One Out Of Beach City. Compare that to Garnet, who seems to just ignore humans and their grievances as often as possible, and Lapis and Peri, who have so far reacted to humans with violence more often than not.

32_Footsteps Think of the mooks! from Just north of Arkham Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Think of the mooks!
#45550: Dec 14th 2016 at 11:54:43 AM

I think you could make that argument even before "Last One Out of Beach City" - go way back to the first episode. Pearl is the one who made sure they paid for the Cookie Cats. Beyond that, she's the one who actually likes to bake (as per the splitting-the-hairs Retcon about why she'd be concerned about pie), and that's not something she was just going to pick up from daily life pre-Steven (and despite it being just as apt for any of the Gems post-Steven, Garnet hasn't and it seems like Amethyst at best half-asses it). And even beyond just the driving, note that Pearl knows a bit about the DMV and human bureaucracy (but not everything; I have a mini-monologue about why her worry about driver's licensing in "Last One Out of Beach City" was a classic Pearl overdramatization).

I think the way to look at it best is that Pearl is best at the macrocosmic interactions with humanity - the general skills and institutions one needs to interact with regarding humans as a species. Amethyst is the one who's best at interactions with humanity on a microcosmic scale - actual one-on-one dealings with people. In academic terms, it's like Pearl specialized in sociology and Amethyst specialized in psychology.

And knowing of the academic rivalry between the two disciplines, I fully realized that I may have just stuck my foot in my mouth regarding the issue.

Reminder: Offscreen Villainy does not count towards Complete Monster.

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