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TLP Crash Rescue - Fixing prematurely launched TLPs and pages

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Prematurely launched pages and pages that weren't fully fleshed out at the point of launching, are a big problem. Since these usually share several problems at once, this thread is aimed at re-running them through the TLP for fixing - the usual fix - or cutting them if they are too bad.

Problems this thread deals with include bad names, not enough/bad examples, unclear description, etc.

For the interested, here's a list of recently created pages. Launches

Note: Please do not request a mod to unlaunch drafts that don't have any issues besides lacking a launch notice/24hr launch notice. While 24hr launch notices are mandatory, there are a few exceptions to the rule. If you see a draft's sponsor launch a TLP without an announcement, it's best to remind them of our TLP Guidelines first. If they continue to repeatedly launch drafts without a launch notice, you can report them on Ask The Tropers or the TLP Community Issues thread.

Edited by MacronNotes on Jun 24th 2023 at 12:24:55 PM

Piterpicher Veteran Editor IV from Poland, for real (Series 2) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Veteran Editor IV
#8526: Jun 23rd 2020 at 1:57:33 PM

I've tried to help in the draft with the title, just in case. But yeah, people probably only thought about the locking part.

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8527: Jun 23rd 2020 at 2:14:53 PM

I've actually been asking for weeks for title advice and nobody came forward so I assumed it was fine. If I need to change it I might actually go insane. I'll do it, but I'll be bashing my head into the keyboard as I do so.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
4tell0life4 Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
#8528: Jun 23rd 2020 at 3:31:10 PM

[up] Maybe "Locked Out Of The Plan" could work?

We can never truly eradicate the coronavirus, but we can suppress its threat like influenza
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8529: Jun 23rd 2020 at 3:34:02 PM

No, that sounds more like Locked Out of the Loop.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
4tell0life4 Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
#8530: Jun 23rd 2020 at 8:13:04 PM

[up] maybe just "Got Locked To Advance A Plan".

Because a story that aims for imprisoning criminals is a thing.

We can never truly eradicate the coronavirus, but we can suppress its threat like influenza
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8531: Jun 23rd 2020 at 8:18:57 PM

Yes, but that's not the trope though. It's specifically for characters who lock/restrain other characters up specifically so they can complete a certain goal unhindered, whether it's just ruining the hero's life without their interference, or keeping someone from harm, or just getting rid of rivals for a job position. A "story that aims for imprisoning criminals" isn't the same trope at all.

Locked Out Of The Way is a title I personally think is a bit awkward but works as a pun ("Locked Out", "Out of the Way"). I'm not entirely opposed to changing it but it'd need to be good, not just a slightly shorter version of the laconic.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
4tell0life4 Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
#8532: Jun 24th 2020 at 1:56:57 AM

[up] "Yes, but that's not the trope though."

That's my point... it's because "that's not the trope" that I'm suggesting another title.

I do get the current title, but some other tropers evidently do not.

We can never truly eradicate the coronavirus, but we can suppress its threat like influenza
Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
ChloeJessica Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: Awaiting my mail-order bride
#8534: Jun 24th 2020 at 2:38:50 AM

that sounds more like someone interfered with someone *getting* locked up.

Locked Up, Can't Interfere?

Malady (X-Troper)
#8535: Jun 24th 2020 at 3:59:30 AM

So, people are putting jailed criminals in there because we don't have an Imprisoned Criminal trope?

Should we make that TLP for somewhere to move things to, or just call it Chairs?

Because, prisoners could just be immediately executed, so I don't think it's Chairs...

Disambig Needed: Help with those issues! tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13324299140A37493800&page=24#comment-576
4tell0life4 Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
#8536: Jun 24th 2020 at 4:07:37 AM

@ Constantly Changing Name

"Compare with I Have Many Names, where a character has many names, titles or monikers accumulated over time but is usually referred to by multiple at once."

If I get this right, Constantly Changing Name means that the older names are no longer used, while with I Have Many Names, the names are all still in use at the same time?

We can never truly eradicate the coronavirus, but we can suppress its threat like influenza
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8537: Jun 24th 2020 at 11:13:18 AM

Locked Up Cant Interfere might be alright...I'll bump the draft and see if people like it.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
HeavyMetalHermitCrab Since: Sep, 2018
#8538: Jun 24th 2020 at 1:50:55 PM

Locked Up, Can't Interfere is alright, as is Interference-Preventing Imprisonment/Detainment (the hyphen is important) or derivatives.

My personal preference would be something like Locked Away, but the shoehorners would have a field day with it.

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8539: Jun 24th 2020 at 5:55:05 PM

THE EXPERIMENT IS OVER

And let's talk about it!

I have a lot to say about it but I'd rather hear some feedback first. I just have a few things to say first:

  • The title attracted a lot of buzz but it was also so egregiously bad that the thing didn't really get any traction until I changed it. Unfortunately, the buzz was also the one thing keeping people posting, so once I changed it, the hype died down.
  • Most people played the role of example-givers, but some people gave me genuine criticisms I was forced to brush off. What I noticed though was that there were a few things nobody mentioned, like the empty folders, the ZCEs, the nonsensical randomly-generated 4th paragraph, or the silly image. Most people focused on the actual scope of the trope and how it was being used.
  • So many people gave me examples and most of them seemed like genuine examples, making me wonder how many people were just playing along and how many people were genuinely trying to help.
  • By the end of it, we got 9 hats, which isn't as much as I was expecting but still more than it should've had. It should've had no hats at all, ironically or otherwise.
  • 2 people admitted to giving me ironic hats, but both of those hats were retracted later, so I think the 9 hats we did have at the end were likely genuine.

So what does this mean? Well...

  • People do seem extremely forgiving, but major errors will turn off even the most hat-happy people. Besides that though, most people did react correctly and gave me bombs. Seeing a draft of mine get 16 bombs was bittersweet, because while it was entirely deserved, it's still a weird feeling for me.
  • Besides that though, I have no idea what makes people hat things. Seriously; I went out of my way to make this draft look superficially perfect and only got 9 hats for it, but a draft that'll have 3 examples and a one-paragraph description will get 5 hats in a single day. Maybe those are socks, but you never know. "The Good Unfavorite" has like, 16 hats, and that one is absurdly undeserving of them. Maybe if I'd tried harder to make it look legit it would've squeaked under the radar? Oh well. My mission wasn't to get as many hats as possible but to see how forgiving and lazy people on the TLP can actually be, and I did get 9 people to hat the damn thing, so that's something.

Edit: Actually, should I make a post-experiment discussion thread?

Edited by WarJay77 on Jun 24th 2020 at 9:08:46 AM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#8540: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:09:14 PM

I found the experiment draft at like 4AM a few days ago, read the examples before the title, and the first thing I noticed was the speculation under the iCarly example. I commented about it, but then edited it out of my comment because I was embarrassed I didn't notice it as an experiment. It's interesting that I caught that mistake out of all the other mistakes on that draft but I guess speculative examples are my personal pet peeve. tongue

I guess a lot of people who casually peruse the TLP don't have the specific knowledge of Administrivia rules and standards so all they can tell is whether a general trope idea is worth it? I've only been active enough in the TLP to pick up the lingo for the past few months, even though I've been using the TLP since 2013.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
wingedcatgirl mys. minty from the silly dimension from lurking (Holding A Herring) Relationship Status: Oh my word! I'm gay!
mys. minty from the silly dimension
#8541: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:09:41 PM

The hats and bombs thread did establish that a lot of people use hats to mean "this is a real trope", even though that's strictly speaking not what they're supposed to be for.

Suddenly I'm... still rotating Fallen London in my mind even though I've stopped actively playing it.
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#8542: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:13:36 PM

Do people ever use the "like" button on drafts? I see people liking the Trope Finder queries but on TLP it seems people misuse hats to signify just liking a trope idea.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#8543: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:14:14 PM

I use the Like/Thumbs up mostly as a bookmark more than anything.

WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8544: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:15:00 PM

[up][up][up][up] Interesting. I didn't consider the possibility of people only reading the (in-character) comments rather than the draft itself and getting mislead because of them. Well, there is a reason why I told people to not acknowledge the joke in the comments, though it was mostly so genuine hatters were continued to be kept in the dark by their own lack of reading skills, not to make the comments themselves misleading for people.

[up] Yeah, the Thumbs Up isn't an upvote feature; it's a bookmarking feature, at least for the TLP. It's confusing like that.

Edited by WarJay77 on Jun 24th 2020 at 9:17:01 AM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
wingedcatgirl mys. minty from the silly dimension from lurking (Holding A Herring) Relationship Status: Oh my word! I'm gay!
mys. minty from the silly dimension
#8545: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:20:08 PM

It used to be a flag icon — indeed, the URL to look at your saved drafts is still

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/tlp_activity.php?filter=flagged

I'm not sure why they changed it.

Suddenly I'm... still rotating Fallen London in my mind even though I've stopped actively playing it.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8546: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:23:41 PM

By the way, can I just acknowledge how hard it was for me to keep up my character? I had to fight against my own instincts to make the draft intentionally bad, even when people were giving me genuine advice. My favorite is when I claimed I've never made a draft before and didn't know how to do so.

I wonder if my role in this gave people an O.O.C. Is Serious Business vibe and give the game away? Because obviously I strive to make my drafts as good as possible and never do 90% of the things I did there.

Edited by WarJay77 on Jun 24th 2020 at 9:25:39 AM

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
naturalironist from The Information Superhighway Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
#8547: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:25:41 PM

I think a lot of people on the TLP go for things that look like stuff that's already on the wiki - both in terms of formatting, and in terms of trope content. We've been getting a lot of drafts that are minor variations on existing tropes, and I think people are risk averse and more willing to support minor splits.

As far as why people missed the garbage text paragraph, you would only notice that if you read the whole description, which would also mean you see the part about it being an experiment/troll draft. Anyone who actually read the whole thing would either play along and make comments that don't directly relate to the description to avoid revealing the ruse, or just ignore the draft altogether.

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#8548: Jun 24th 2020 at 6:28:53 PM

Makes sense. I mostly just added it as padding anyway.

And yeah, I specifically went for the trope-split idea to emulate other drafts I've seen that were just "This trope, but slightly different enough to claim a subtrope". They usually get a lot of traction. Maybe if I hadn't gone for outright parody it'd have fooled more people? I did at least aim for making it look perfect.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#8549: Jun 24th 2020 at 8:30:02 PM

Re the like button: Huh, I was confused why the likes never showed up like they do on the TF. Man, the TLP coding is confusing.

I was way too proud of myself for pitching an Everything's X With Y rename on the experiment draft, but those do seem to have died out nowadays so that would have probably been a giveaway.

Edited by mightymewtron on Jun 24th 2020 at 11:30:06 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
4tell0life4 Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
#8550: Jun 24th 2020 at 9:15:34 PM

@ Constantly Changing Name

"Compare with I Have Many Names, where a character has many names, titles or monikers accumulated over time but is usually referred to by multiple at once."

If I get this right, Constantly Changing Name means that the older names are no longer used, while with I Have Many Names, the names are all still in use at the same time?

We can never truly eradicate the coronavirus, but we can suppress its threat like influenza

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