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ShirowShirow Dinosaur Hunter from Land of Maple Syrup (Old as dirt)
Dinosaur Hunter
#276: Dec 2nd 2012 at 6:57:36 PM

Well, yeah. The industry is pretty sexist. I don't believe it's full of sexists, however.

You are not alone.
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#277: Dec 2nd 2012 at 6:58:05 PM

My head hurts.

CorrTerek The Permanently Confused from The Bland Line Since: Jul, 2009
The Permanently Confused
#278: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:02:15 PM

The concept has been explained to you several times, you know.

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#279: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:03:30 PM

Probably because I still hold firm to the belief that sexism and racism, to fit the term, have to be an overt conscious thought.

ShirowShirow Dinosaur Hunter from Land of Maple Syrup (Old as dirt)
Dinosaur Hunter
#280: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:09:17 PM

They don't. They really, really don't.

Ignoring subconscious bigotry is pretty idiotic. Concious bigotry against race and sex (Although not sexualities... yet) will get you on the fast track to social pariahdom in today's society. Which is a good thing.

The vast majority of the racism and sexism we see today is done without people even noticing they're doing it. We need to point it out and get it to stop. It's the next step.

Which is why we have threads like this.

You are not alone.
Karalora Since: Jan, 2001
#281: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:09:19 PM

That's your Personal Dictionary, then, Thorn. The overall consensus is that unconscious racism, sexism, etc. are definitely things.

edited 2nd Dec '12 7:09:35 PM by Karalora

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#282: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:10:14 PM

Its pretty fucking hard to fight the subconcious.

ShirowShirow Dinosaur Hunter from Land of Maple Syrup (Old as dirt)
Dinosaur Hunter
#283: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:13:34 PM

1. Doesn't matter we'll do it anyway.

2. Not as hard as you think.

4. We'll attack the symptoms first.

5. My three key is broken.

You are not alone.
JotunofBoredom Left Eye from Noatun Since: Dec, 2009
Left Eye
#284: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:13:43 PM

Someone is sexist if they foster sexist views.

Intent does not matter. Those commercials I talked about weren't made with the intent of putting men down; they just wanna sell them stuff in intellectually dishonest ways. That doesn't make them not-sexist though.

For a non-gender related example, the Magical Negro and Mighty Whitey tropes are usually intended to be progressive, but they actually end up marginalizing their subject of focus(the latter ends up being doubly bad as it also tends to smack of white guilt while it also marginalizes non-whites).

Someone is misogynist/misandrist if they actively hate women/men.

Intent does matter.

edited 2nd Dec '12 7:15:12 PM by JotunofBoredom

Umbran Climax
Karalora Since: Jan, 2001
#285: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:14:22 PM

You're not supposed to fight it. You're supposed to train it. Using methods similar to those that trained it into the current, undesirable state.

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#286: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:15:30 PM

Well screaming that the entire industry is racist and I should feel bad for being a white heterosexual male isn't exactly my idea of good training.

Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#287: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:18:40 PM

[up]Hasn't been much screaming Thorn. Just pointing it out.

JotunofBoredom Left Eye from Noatun Since: Dec, 2009
Left Eye
#288: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:19:06 PM

[up][up]Nobody is saying you have to feel bad though(at least, not in any of these threads). That's something you've assumed on your own.

edited 2nd Dec '12 7:20:02 PM by JotunofBoredom

Umbran Climax
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#289: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:19:57 PM

Maybe not here but if I try to bring up counter arguments I'm constantly labeled as sexist and "part of the problem"

KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#290: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:23:44 PM

Because you keep putting up counterarguments. You're being overly-defensive rather than making an effort to understand it.

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#291: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:43:17 PM

I understand it. I just don't agree with the fervor of it. Or the methods.

edited 2nd Dec '12 7:44:29 PM by Thorn14

KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#292: Dec 2nd 2012 at 7:59:56 PM

No you don't. Or else you wouldn't make comments like "sexism and racism needs to be conscious".

Having dealt with racism my whole life, I can tell you that's bullshit. A form of prejudice you don't seem willing to admit is the act of people thinking of themselves and their culture as the "default" without any consideration for anyone else. And then they fight like hell when you try to show them what they're doing

edited 2nd Dec '12 8:00:15 PM by KingZeal

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#293: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:07:57 PM

I can call the term prejudice, but I just feel the term racist is much more of a heavier term.

Its like "Dislike" and "Hate"

I admit if I saw 2 young "thuggish" looking black men walk near me, I'd get a little nervous.

I don't know if that makes me racist, I'd like to not think so, because being labeled a racist is an ugly thing. Because while I know its an ugly thought, I also accept its part of my subconcious.

Oroboro Since: Nov, 2011
#294: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:13:49 PM

[up] Isn't the key descriptor there "Thuggish? I mean, wouldn't you feel the same way if they were thuggish white guys?

Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#295: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:14:16 PM

Doesn't make it right though. Were not saying "feel bad for having these unconscious feelings" just try not to have them. Catch yourself having them and think about it.

Unless they have weapons and it's happening the dark, chances are they ain't much of a threat.

KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#296: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:14:45 PM

And again, that's bullshit. You're ignoring what you want to make yourself feel better. I don't know what you consider "thuggish" black men, but saying you "accept" something about yourself that disservices an entire group of people is petty. Period. It's not that you can't change it; people change all the time. In high school, I was a homophobe. But I realized it was wrong and worked at it, step by step, and I'd like to believe I've become a better person for it.

ShirowShirow Dinosaur Hunter from Land of Maple Syrup (Old as dirt)
Dinosaur Hunter
#297: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:16:31 PM

I used to hate on transgender people. Boy, was I a dink back then.

edited 2nd Dec '12 8:16:45 PM by ShirowShirow

You are not alone.
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#298: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:20:43 PM

[up][up]

I'm not accepting HATE, I'm accepting that there is subconcious parts in all of us that has us be afraid of the unknown and untrusting of something that isn't "us". I'll never find african american women physically attractive, does that make me racist?

I'm advocating we accept these parts, but also understand we don't need to be ruled by them.

Thats why I don't like this PC "Oh we're all just people" crap. We should accept our differences, and love ourselves for being different, and not be ruled by fear of these differences.

edited 2nd Dec '12 8:22:31 PM by Thorn14

Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#299: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:22:15 PM

We should really work to change that even if it is subconscious. We shouldn't just not trust somebody that isn't our definition of "us" for that one reason.

edited 2nd Dec '12 8:22:56 PM by Wildcard

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#300: Dec 2nd 2012 at 8:24:07 PM

Well lets start working on a way to turn off our hiccups. Or any other psychological impulse imbedded deep into our species (like the need to socialize)

We have subconcious parts of us that are afraid and ugly. But we shouldn't yell "YOU'RE NOT ME" and then fight against it futilely. We should accept we have these parts of us, understand them, and work to better ourselves as people because we understand them.

Persona 4 byatches.

edited 2nd Dec '12 8:25:07 PM by Thorn14


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