Runners keeping Recon down is fine. I planned for him to get hurt a lot anyway. Just don't kill him. That would seriously ruin the rest of this RP for me as I try to find a replacement. The adrenaline rush I pulled in because...that's what would logically happen in the real world.
Recon does have above average strangth. As in "above the average American", because most Americans haven't spent most of their lives fighting for survival. Then again, the same could be said for literally every single other character in the RP. But unless it's someone like Jerry who has military training and real war experience, Recon will likely have the upper hand in due to training and fighting for 18 years instead of 5. This is one of those "I thought it'd be obvious" things. If you're not cool with that, just say so.
edited 28th Oct '13 11:09:35 PM by gameknight102xx
... Now that I think about it, I think the first time I brought this up was before you joined. So I'll repeat for your sake: I don't consider myself a killer GM, and don't want to be one, but at the same time, I don't want to pull my punches. So while I probably wont drop any sudden bridges or rocks, I won't be handing you guys any real plot armor either. (I think that might be a record for how many tropes I felt like actually linking instead of just referencing...)
Generally, except in the cases of dumb/bad luck or unknown factors, bad decisions will be met with bad outcomes; and I want the consequences to be just as possibly bad, because I feel the RP would be a bit more believable and tense with death as an actual possibility. I want you guys to actually think about plans and do more than just all out attack all the time, even if the plans are eccentric or bizarre. Because to a GM like me, that's delicious candy. (I still laugh when I think back to plan, "let's seduce the sheriff because we think she's a succubus."
)
On a related note, I usually like to plan out my monster encounters before they start, and generally do little changing on the fly after that. Even if you guys are getting whooped on in the first room, that even worse monster I left hiding in the second room is still going to be there. (This is going to be relevant the next time I can actually get a main post up.) And on the flip side, if you guys easily (and perhaps anticlimactically) breeze through a fight that was the only one scheduled to happen there, I probably won't be warping in any other monsters; in this same sense, you guys can sometimes make later fights easier than they should've been if you take out things that were supposed to be involved in them early. (This is also going to be relevant at some point later.)
@Recon's strength: Not really okay with that, no. Recon would be stronger than the average real life American, but about the same as the average American of this setting. Gaining strength isn't like leveling up in an RPG, you can't keep fighting the small stuff forever and eventually become uber-tier; it's more like keeping up a balance depending on how hard your routine is. In that regard, five years is way more than enough time for people to catch up on a routine, so it really doesn't matter in the slightest that Recon has a thirteen year head start.
But even more importantly, surviving and fighting =/= getting/needing raw strength. It certainly helps, but it's neither guaranteed to happen just by doing so, nor is it necessary to do so. If anything, in terms of just raw strength, I'd put Recon as one of the weakest Player Characters currently in.
Anyway, this is all just a drop in before work post, and I'm expecting to have things to do after work, though I don't know if they'll be right away. Point is, it's definitely going to be late on my part for posting today; if I can get to posting today.
edited 29th Oct '13 3:41:11 PM by FirockFinion
You are reading this.@Fantasy: Minus the witch, the Human side of that portfolio wouldn't be all that uncommon. The gnome also starts getting them out of place; gnomes siding with Humans when they're encountered isn't too uncommon, but gnomes aren't encountered commonly in the first place. At least, not as much outside of Europe. As for witches... Well, given that even when one is around, usually nobody knows they're a witch, so it's actually hard to say just how common they are. But they seem to be rare.
The succubus though, takes it right out of the park. Literally every single previous instance of a succubus or incubus choosing to "side" with Humans has been a trick.
Anyway, I'm home from work now, which means I can make those check ins I talked about, but I don't know how soon I could post.
You are reading this.@Troy: You mean like, was it okay for her to do that, or was it written okay as opposed to written poorly?
Her action was fine; heck, I gave you permission to just go ahead and kill the skeleton. I suppose though while I have chance to talk about the subject, I'd like to remind you that her transformation either way still takes a full ten seconds. (Which with how fast paced the current fight is, is a lot of time.)
@Nman: Oh yeah, that too.
@TLGW: I thought I mentioned not to just go running into combat where Recon is yet. Because there's something in the way that nobody has specifically noticed yet.
You are reading this.@Fantasy: I've only really caught bits of like two episodes; I don't even know who those characters are.
@Gameknight: You need to explain how Recon sent the runner grabbing him "flying over [his] shoulder before rolling across the ground." Because just leaving it at that is not good enough.
Also, the only move I can think of that can even do that is A) Extremely hard to do when the person is basically hugging you tightly, and B) Definitely takes more than two seconds when combined with other moves.
edited 30th Oct '13 5:54:17 PM by FirockFinion
You are reading this.The runner's hugging Recon? Are Recon's arms inside or outside the hug? There are techniques for both, neither of them are that long to execute, and one of them could potentially just be an instant kill, because the victim lands with his full weight on his neck/head.
I assumed the runner just grabbed his shoulders.
Also, the throw distance I never really thought about. I was originally planning to have the flying runner trip up the ghoul, but since Anarchy jumped it, I left it ambiguous. I supposed it depends entirely on what throw Recon uses, which in turn depends on whether the runner had his arms or not.
edited 30th Oct '13 9:15:40 PM by gameknight102xx
I hope everyone had a happy Halloween. I wanted to get that list of half-monster stories done as a treat for Halloween... But that didn't happen yet, and I'm sorry.
In (sort of) good news though, that challenge thing I talked about is almost done. In fact, I'll probably be finished with it today...
But between hanging out with friends later, and work tomorrow and the day after, I'm probably still going to be out a lot until Monday. That and, I kind of just want a breather from this week in general, so yeah, until Monday things are probably gonna stay at a crawl.
Another factor that's been making this week stressing and that I'm gonna have to preemptively apologize for? Something just plain un-fun and a bit heavy, that I feel needs to be talked about because, well, sometimes problems don't just go away by really wishing that they'd go away. The rest of this post is not gonna be terribly fun to read, and it's not terribly fun for me writing it; I'll try to keep it as brief and painless as possible, but again, things need to be said. (And, unfortunately, a lot needs to be said.)
And yes, it's about, @Gameknight:
As you've probably already been able to guess Gameknight, I wasn't exactly happy about the recent string of your posts that contained Recon attempting to do things way past his ability, especially since they were written in such a way that was technically autohitting; and then that was added onto in the way you still behave when it's brought up OOC that your character shouldn't be able to do those things.
But there was more to it than just that. A few days ago I got a message from someone outside the RP, who shall remain unnamed, pointing out some things about you and your behavior to me. It made me rethink how much I'd let your characters have and how much I was willing to put up with from you; and not in a way that favored you.
I was angry and frustrated, and considered either just kicking you out of my games or at least hitting your characters here in BHoTA with the nerf bat a few times, but I restrained myself. I wanted to be absolutely certain there was actually a problem; that this wasn't all just my imagination running wild. I also wanted to know if anyone else actually cared, since I like to think of myself as a GM for my players first and foremost.note So, I asked the other players here that were still active: Troy, Fantasy, Nman, Mantle, and TLGW. I asked them whether they thought your characters were overpowered and if that affected their enjoyment at all. Their answers showed me it wasn't all just my imagination, but that the problem was something completely different than I initially thought.
Now, I won't say who said what, for obvious confidentiality. It's up to them to step forward and be honest openly if they choose to. Though I will use some quotes, since they put things better than I probably could.
Three of the five think that yes, your characters are overpowered; one doesn't think they are; another thinks that Recon isn't, but thinks that Paladin is. But four of them all had things and/or complaints to say. (And not the four you would think either. It was one of the three who said "yes I think they're OP" who leveled no complaints, saying they didn't let it bother them.)
But that was the thing; none of the complaints were really about your characters being OP. Nobody seemed to care about that part. No, they instead cared about what you were doing with your characters and the way you've behaved about it OOC. To quote them:
Because you can't just say "no" because I'm guessing you think that would seem rude, and that's a nice thing that you take the time to actually explain things in detail, but it also means that we're all wasting time reading his crap, you're burning hours of your time explaining basic physical laws and common sense, and it means that instead of just having fun and goofing off we're going "Oh Jesus, not GK again."
Those last two, especially the last, were what really got me. Look, you should already know I don't like our back and forth arguments; otherwise I wouldn't have threatened to kick you out of the RP over them on multiple occasions. But until they pointed it out, it didn't really occur to me that everyone else probably didn't like them either. It makes sense; if I'm arguing with you that's time I could instead be spending working on running the RP, or making things to supplement the RP like those half monster stories, or working on getting things out of the way that are preventing me from doing the first two things, like that challenge I've been working on this week.
Though, that brings me back to the thing I told you in our latest PM back and forth. Sometimes I don't want to just say nothing because not only is whatever your character is attempting to do almost guaranteed to fail/straight up impossible, but your character should know that. Just posting that it fails makes me feel like a jerk because it makes your character look like an idiot who doesn't know how to do what he is supposed to know how to do.
Considering those two points against each other, and after a lot of thinking, I've decided this is going to be my new policy with you Gameknight: (And I may just start doing this for everyone.) When you post something for your character(s) that is either practically guaranteed to fail or just straight up impossible, I will consider whether your character would know that. If they shouldn't know, I won't say anything, and instead just post their failure. If they should know, I will say so as simply as possible in the discussion thread. These won't be openings for you to try to defend your characters' ability to do what you tried to have them do; it will just be me saying, "Hey, that's pretty much not going to work and they would know that. Do you want to have them try anyway or have them do something else before I post?" If you do try to defend the actions and draw it out into a big argument? Then I'm going to have to seriously consider just kicking you out.
As for the other thing, Gameknight, you're a power gamer. I really don't know how else to say it. You claim you're not a power gamer and cite very good reasons not to be one, but then you turn right around and do exactly what a power gamer does. You try to make your characters as powerful as possible, you try to have them do improbable/impossible feats clearly just to make them look cooler, and then you defend them doing those feats very stubbornly. Sure, you're cooperative and give easily sometimes, but you also do one of the most dickish things possible by pointing out those instances and blatantly ignoring the instances where you did the exact opposite, thereby trying to make whoever's arguing with you (usually me) not only look like they're wrong, but look like a huge jerk for even suggesting that you're a power gamer.
Claiming you're not a power gamer and then acting exactly like one doesn't make you not a power gamer; it makes you one of two things: Either a power gamer who is in extreme denial, or a massive troll who behaves like a power gamer then only tries not to get kicked out so they can continue trolling. Now if I really thought you were the latter, I would just kick you out with nothing more to it. Just "you're done, get out." But right now, I'm going to assume, and hope, that you're just the former.
I could go on for days with advice on how not to be a power gamer, but as long as you insist that you're not, it's not going to stick. The first step to fixing a problem with yourself is admitting you have one; and until you do, the only thing I can do to help you is tell you that you do and hope you listen.
Okay, show's over. Now hopefully, once I'm no longer extremely busy (Read: Once it's Monday.) we can go back to having the RP moving normally and just have some fun.
edited 1st Nov '13 8:05:44 PM by FirockFinion
You are reading this.@Fantasy: I can try, but I can make no guarantee. What probably will happen tonight though is me posting those half-monster stories, because I'm actually pretty close to done with those too. (I was working on them late last night, wanting to finish and post them before bed, but I looked over at the clock and realized that it was either commit suicide on my sleeping schedule, or finish them another day.
Oh, and about your main post: The ghoul is inside the bowling alley. The whole fight is taking place in there currently.
You are reading this.Okay Firock.
1. Don't ever do this. This is exactly what made me leave so many other R Ps. Going behind my back and whispering while I'm oblivious and ignorant is not cool. And then coming around after everything's said and done and expecting me to just bow down to you and your superior whispering ways is just plain dumb.
If you have a problem. Say it. Post it publicly on the discussion and have everyone chip in. I'm not a 7 year old girl. I can take it. And you doing this is one of the biggest insults I can think of.
I didn't really peg you for someone who would go around me like this. Whatever. Fine.
2. Firock, I have been willing to compromise with you on everything. Even our last PM conversation which ended with you threatening to kick me out of the RP because of something I forgot to edit out.
Every single move I make Recon do is researched. I find links all over the place and bring them straight to you only for you to just bulldoze on saying it's impossible. Then I just shrug and say "it's just a game" and edit out whatever you want.
You accuse me of dragging on the conversations we have, when in almost every single case it's you that's constantly dragging them on. I showed you how to shut down a conversation back in the Mv M sign-up in case you just didn't know. I gave you a way to use your creative control to get what you want (giving runners increased strength). You simply just continued to argue.
I don't like our back and forth arguments either. I really, really hate them. I pretend to enjoy them because I was beginning to suspect maybe you were just perpetually bored and that's why you kept dragging them on.
My time between posts have gotten increasingly longer. This is because every time I look at that little button on my favorites toolbar I ask myself "Oh Christ do I really have the energy for this?"
Unlike you Firock, I can't shut you down, because you're the GM. I can post all the pictures, images, and scientific facts I want. If you don't want something, it's not going to happen. I guess it's just time I learned that.
You win. I just don't care anymore. Make Recon a bar of soap. Make every monster in a million mile radius home in on him like a guided missile. Make his gun shoot confetti. Do whatever you want. Just please make it stop.
edited 1st Nov '13 11:17:13 PM by gameknight102xx
No offense dude, but he kind of had a point, remember that time when Recon ended up backfliping onto the van? So, not to be a douche, but can you turn down the action heroing? I don't have anything against you, it's just it's a bit disconcerting when Recon is suddenly going Jet Li on zombies. Not to mention your justifications make it even more annoying, so, please can you stop doing backflips and judo throwing zombies?
edited 2nd Nov '13 12:09:24 AM by TroyandHawk
Good to be backDon't do what, ask everyone else for their opinion in a context where they won't feel obligated to hold back? You're saying I shouldn't consider my players' opinions?
That is exactly what I just did.
That is strictly their decision. If they don't want to get involved in the argument directly for whatever reason, you can't expect them to do so just as much as I can't expect them to.
You've also blatantly ignored common sense and physics when doing your "research". You ignore the position a martial artist's leg needs to be in in order for him to not awkwardly throw off his weight. You ignore the part about jump-flipping onto moving platform being a problem because it's moving on an uneven surface, so it doesn't matter how slow it's moving, just that it's moving.
No, it's you. This is how the order of events has been going pretty much, every. Single. Time: You post something that isn't possible; I tell you that; you defend yourself, thereby extending the argument because I have to respond to you again or else just completely disregard you. That's pretty much exactly what's happening now, in fact.
I can tell by your sarcasm that you must kind of hate me now; it's not entirely one sided there. Also, funny, and I thought you said at the start of your post that expecting you "to just bow down to [me] and [my] superior whispering ways" would be "just plain dumb", and yet here by your logic you're doing exactly that.
Look, Gameknight, I don't want to be rude, I don't want to have to kick someone out of my RPs, but even more than that I don't want those RPs being torn apart from the inside out by stupid arguments because of one player. I have to draw the line somewhere, and that's pretty much what I just did. Either step back so we can get back to having fun and maybe stop kind of hating each other, or leave.
edited 2nd Nov '13 1:29:04 AM by FirockFinion
You are reading this.I just want to comment on this
edited 2nd Nov '13 1:56:26 AM by nman

She's currently a bit freaked out that her pack member is dead/dying/brain damaged, I'll change it so she sends her wolves to help him out.
Good to be back