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A Proposal For Constant Reboots

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VampireBuddha Calendar enthusiast from Ireland (Wise, aged troper) Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Calendar enthusiast
#151: Oct 11th 2012 at 12:40:02 PM

[up][up]You're not entirely correct.

For the longest time, American comics were sold the same way as in Japan - cheap, disposable pulp entertainment that you read and then threw away or gave to a friend. Sure, there were always collectors, but for the most part they were seen as isolated weirdos. To make an analogy, most comic readers were like people who happened to enjoy Star Trek, and collectors were like people who spoke fluent Klingon.

In the late 80s and early 90s, however, people started noticing that collectors were paying major dollars for Action Comics #1, and tried to get in on the act, which led to the situation you describe.

Price and accessibility have both been mentioned. Perhaps the solution is to create a two-tier system.

At the upper tier would be comics as they are currently printed - high priced, glossy paper, sold in comic shops. This tier is for the collectors and hardcore fans, and makes up maybe 10% of the total print run.

At the lower tier, the same comics would be printed on lower-quality, non-glossy paper and sold in newsagents at a lower price (though still enough to make a profit). This would make up the bulk of the print run, and be aimed at casual readers who just want a bit of entertainment.

Trade paperbacks would continue to be printed much as they are.

Ukrainian Red Cross
Jhimmibhob Since: Dec, 2010
#152: Oct 11th 2012 at 12:58:40 PM

There are no comic book stores in my town, though.

You're not alone, and that's an excellent point. Ever since comics stopped being sold in convenience-store racks, publishers have relied on comics shops to move their wares ... but not every town even has one. And only the very largest cities have more than a handful; elsewhere, the few available choices might be inconveniently located, poorly stocked, overpriced, or just plain creepy.

That's just one more market weakness to add to the pile for comics, and yet another reason to question the industry's sustainability in its current form.

KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#153: Oct 11th 2012 at 1:09:06 PM

[up][up] According to Wikipedia, it started way, way before that. Since about the 50s. Which would put it about the time of The Interregnum and the induction of the Comics Code.

VampireBuddha Calendar enthusiast from Ireland (Wise, aged troper) Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Calendar enthusiast
#154: Oct 11th 2012 at 3:36:51 PM

According to Wikipedia, the sort of collectors you describe were isolated weirdos before about 1981, and the idea of collecting comics with the intent of selling them for big bucks down the line only really took off in 1992.

Ukrainian Red Cross
KingZeal Since: Oct, 2009
#155: Oct 11th 2012 at 4:04:52 PM

But I wasn't talking about profitable trading. I brought up my original point talking about collecting as a hobby, something that you were either "into" or you weren't.

Robbery Since: Jul, 2012
#156: Oct 11th 2012 at 9:05:28 PM

There have always been collectors of comic books, but I don't think they were a significant portion of the readership until the early 80's.

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#157: Oct 11th 2012 at 9:24:05 PM

You know what I think DC and Marvel should do? Get into children's books. If they want to acquire new readers, they've got to start with people still at that age where reading books with pictures is not just accepted but encouraged by teachers and parents.

Robbery Since: Jul, 2012
#158: Oct 12th 2012 at 10:22:28 PM

[up] DC does have Tiny Titans, The Superman Family, and Billy Batson and the Power of Shazam. I haven;t seen them myself, but I hear they're very good.

Distortion00 Since: Nov, 2011
#159: Oct 13th 2012 at 7:53:37 AM

I think the main difference between America and Japan is that Japan is far more creator driven. Their animated adaptions are also much more consistent.

Naruto, for example, has been running for 13 years. It's been animated for 11 years and has been on TV pretty continuously through that time. (A lot of that is "filler", but the Japan philosophy seems to be its better to keep a show on air with 'Meh' episodes than have it be forgotten.)

Robbery Since: Jul, 2012
#160: Oct 13th 2012 at 3:54:54 PM

[up] I think you've hit the nail on the head. The manga publishers in Japan behave a lot more like comic strip syndicates in the US with the amount of creative control and ownership they allow their artists.

VampireBuddha Calendar enthusiast from Ireland (Wise, aged troper) Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Calendar enthusiast
#161: Oct 13th 2012 at 4:22:02 PM

France is the same, which partially accounts for why reading comics has no social stigma in France. Italy also works like France, but with annoyingly large amounts of misogyny.

British comics, as it happens, have traditionally been corporate driven a la America, but lately seem to be moving towards a more French-style system. And, if I may take a moment to promote my own country, Irish comics basically became a thing about five years ago, and have pretty much been French-style from the beginning, but have yet to overcome the stigma.

Ukrainian Red Cross
Robbery Since: Jul, 2012
#162: Oct 13th 2012 at 6:13:45 PM

From what I've heard, there IS something of a stigma attached to reading comics in Japan, even if they are extremely popular across a wide spectrum of readers.

I personally don't care about social stigmas, I'd just like the industry to thrive.

BigMadDraco Since: Mar, 2010 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#163: Oct 13th 2012 at 6:21:37 PM

Not so much on comics, but there is on watching animation. There might be a stigma on reading comics from a younger age bracket.

SuperLurkerGuy Since: May, 2011
#164: Oct 13th 2012 at 7:29:12 PM

I don't think that Japanese comics are any more "creator driven" than American comics, rather, the shame factor towards firing employees or employees quitting their job leads to less turnover. There's certainly many accounts about Japanese media companies sticking their hands (or feet) into the creative process of respected authors.

That being said, the notion of a work that lives and dies with its original creator is appealing. Most of the issues with American superhero comics that seem to drive people away come from the "multi-author, Shared Universe" nature of the works. Creators want to use established characters and settings because they'll actually sell, but they don't want to have to refer to the history that "established" them because that's, like, hard or something. So they keep rebooting to find the right formula, while conveniently not rebooting the money they made bilking people like me into following their "non-canon" storylines.

DrFurball Since: Jan, 2001
#165: Oct 18th 2012 at 12:41:08 PM

Sorry for bringing up something that was posted a few pages ago, but...

Another thing that would help is if Marvel or DC occasionally remade their relevant, but outdated comics. I'm talking about stuff like The Infinity Gauntlet or The Night Gwen Stacy Died or Crisis on Infinite Earths. These are comics which are extremely culturally significant, but have not aged well.

They should NOT, however, do anything more than redraw/recolor/reink it. I'm talking about taking something like this◊ and turning it into this◊.

If they have a good writer, maybe they can try changing a few lines here and there that are outdated. (Taking EXTREME caution, however)

I completely agree on this (well, the coloring, anyway). Let's face it, the coloring on those old books weren't all that great. But when they're reprinted, the coloring just looks flat. Personally, I think the guys like Steve Ditko and Jack Kirby deserve to have their lineart colored with modern means. I know Marvel recolored Walt Simonson's Thor run, and it looks fantastic! I'd personally love to see a recolored version of the original Doctor Strange vs Dormammu story, for example. And for those fans that prefer the flat coloring, that's what Marvel Masterworks (and DC's equivalent) are for.

edited 18th Oct '12 12:41:37 PM by DrFurball

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