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I got that his lack of fear of death was hindering him due to not having adrenaline or something. I just had no idea what the guy actually said - he was just so mumbly.
Unfortunately for me, most if not all of what I had heard from a site with leaks such as set photos was pretty much spot on, reaffirmed when Alfred first showed us his dream, as well as Talia's brand (since BB and TDK aired before the midnight release at my cinema, I remembered what fake!Ra's brand looked like)
edited 20th Jul '12 9:01:39 AM by absolclaw
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Ohh, sorry! I read your question wrong. I really don't remember what the guy said, hopefully someone else does.
There was a thread on Reddit yesterday that was almost completely blacked out with spoilers. It was so hard not to hover over them and see what would happen. I don't know how I managed to keep myself away from spoilers. I mean, I knew some details (Miranda Tate was Talia al Ghul, f'ex), but not enough to really spoil it.
edited 20th Jul '12 9:03:28 AM by Iulla
fortiter in re, suaviter in modoWell that was the best eight hours I've ever spent in a theater. It got confusing around the pit, but I went with it. The whole theater applauded at several points.
I think it was about a month that Bruce spent in the pit (without any sort of painkillers). Then, judging by the mention of Bruce's vertebrae protruding and how popping them back in fixed it, they were actually dislocated. Unusual, but recoverable and not outright paralyzing.
Also, I recall articles in which Marion Cotillard and Christian Bale assured us that Miranda Tate was not Talia al Ghul, and Robin would not be showing up in the franchise. Liars.
edited 20th Jul '12 9:12:22 AM by Leradny
I response to multiple posts:
It would be awesome to keep JGL as Batman for a Justice League movie because keeping with continuity is awesome. However, I have trouble imagining him as Batman rather than Robin (then again who could have imagined Heath Ledger as the Joker before it happened). The other problem is that of names. The Justice League movie would have names that you recognize as superheroes such as Clark Kent/Superman, Hal Jordan/Green Lantern, Diana /Wonder Woman, J'onn J'onzz/Martian Manhunter, etc. ... and Robin Blake/Batman? Still want it to happen though.
As for other villains, on top of ones previously listed) that could have fit in the Nolanverse of Batman as minor villains but didn't make it: The Mad Hatter, portrayed as a child molester who prays on young blonde girls, and The Ventriloquist, one of the more underrated of the insane crime lords, are two that I would have liked to see.
As for the ending, Nolan did something that the comics can never do but which many fans secretly wish Batman and Catwoman could do. Quit and spend their lives together as Bruce Wayne and Selina Kyle. This will forever be the way that Batman should end in my heart.
Ick. Enough of Mad Hatter as a child molester. It doesn't really add anything to his character. I don't mind the rumors of it, though. It's a nice shoutout to Lewis Carroll, who also wasn't a pedophile or drug user but gets accused of it all. the. time.
And, yeah, I find the revelation that Nolan is also a shipper completely fantastic, in the best of ways.
ophelia, you're breaking my heartI think Robin John Blake was Nolan's way of giving a tip of the hat to all the people who wanted Robin in the film (as well as establishing him as Bruce's successor) without including all the things about Robin that Nolan didn't like. Like the teenage acrobat sidekick fighting crime stuff.
Which is fair enough, since this version of Batman gets horribly fucked up for it, and doing that to a child is sort of horrific.
But Talia, yep that was all Lies, lies, lies.
And I know in pre-Crisis comics, there was an alternate universe where Bruce and Selina got together (I can't recall if they retired or not) - the original (and current) Huntress was their daughter, Helena Wayne.
...I expect there will be lots of fanfic about Nolanverse!Helena soon.
The owner of this account is temporarily unavailable. Please leave your number and call again later.Just because he wasn't going by that name doesn't mean he wasn't Robin.
Once Miranda revealed herself to be Talia, I knew John's first name would be related to SOMEONE young, so I yelled out "Tim" and then "Dick" and then "Terry" when he mentioned John was his middle name. But I see what Nolan did there. Edit: I forgot about Jason. Awww.
I have to give Nolan props for the love triangle. Batman's dynamic with Catwoman was more natural and fun to watch), but I wasn't really expecting them to get together due to Miranda, even if Miranda was kind of shallowly perfect. But then Bruce actually ended up with Selina. If that has ever happened in a film before, I haven't watched that film.
Also, I like how Catwoman didn't help Batman out of love (any kisses were just distractions, they didn't sleep together at all), but because he gave her a second chance after her actions dislocated several vertebrae and landed him miles away from Gotham in a pit.
edited 20th Jul '12 9:41:06 AM by Leradny
I still don't see how people thought it was perfectly clear Bruce survived the ending, and just happened to be in the exact same bar as Alfred had imagined, doing exactly what he imagined. It felt extremely Final Fantasy Tactics like with the ending in that regard, to the point I wonder if Nolan or someone who worked with him on the script played that game.
Same thing with the Final Fantasy Tactics ending. The guy didn't even know what Ramza's sister looked like, yet he saw her there. Besides, Alfred and Lucius were just happy for Bruce to be with anyone.
Alfred does mention that they 'should exchange notes', or coming from Alfred that they would be great for each other. To actually believe that happens completely and utterly undermines the pain of Alfred's character and the sacrifices Wayne made for the city.
edited 20th Jul '12 9:37:49 AM by absolclaw
Do you mean the recent movies or the general legacy? Because I haven't actually partaken in either.
Alfred tends to make jokes, but he's usually serious about them at the same time. Seriously, Alfred would have learned of Talia's death somehow, (same way he found out so much on Bane), and who is the other woman in Wayne's life? That ending was just so obviously set up for ambiguous hallucination and undermining the sacrifice it couldn't have actually happened.
edited 20th Jul '12 9:43:13 AM by absolclaw
I took the pit scene involving the "fear of death" to be less about adrenaline and more about not being a Death Seeker. Alfred warned him not to throw his life away playing Batman. He had nothing to live for believing that Rachel was his only life beyond Batman. He needs to find something to live for to defeat Bane, rather then going into battle half-hoping to get killed trying.
Amazing movie. Saw a marathon with the previous films. I expect there would have been a reference to the Joker had Ledger lived but he probably wouldn't have been on the streets. He's far too dangerous and chaotic for the game Bane and Talia were playing.
Also, Knightfall was an obvious source for this movie, but did it also take from The Dark Knight Returns? Haven't read either, but I know Bane came from Knightfall' and wasn't the plot of TDKR'' Batman returning from retirement older and less-capable?
edited 20th Jul '12 9:53:12 AM by Rotpar
But don't give up hope. Everyone is cured sooner or later. In the end we shall shoot you.OK, can someone with the ability to do so edit Bane out of the Complete Monster film page? I already edited Talia out of The Dark Knight Rises page. While the trope is in much better shape than the mess it used to be in, there are still some who don't understand that Complete Monster is all about who or what the character is, not just the terrible acts they commit. A villain can cross the Moral Event Horizon, but that alone can't qualify them for CM status. The three CM rules:
•The character is truly heinous by the standards of the story, which makes no attempt to present the character in any positive way.
•The character's terribleness is played seriously at all times, evoking fear, revulsion and hatred from the other characters in the story.
•They are completely devoid of altruistic qualities. They show no regret for their crimes.
Bane and Talia pass the first two, but that third is a biggie. Their sincere love for each other and extreme belief that what they're doing is for the world's benefit are altruistic qualities. Not to mention their terrible childhood together guaranteed they'd be messed up psychologically. It doesn't excuse them or give them any chance of redemption (which neither get), but it does mean they're not Complete Monsters.
Bottom line: only Joker and possibly Scarecrow qualify for that status in this film series.
edited 20th Jul '12 10:16:57 AM by ManwiththePlan
@ Alfred seeing things. Obviously that scene takes place 3-4 years after the end of the movie. Racked with grief and the beginnings of dementia Alfred has begun to see things. Upon arriving in the bar Alfred ordered a drink, had it delivered, and the suffered a massive stroke/heartattack. Seeing Bruce with Selina was his dieing hallucination, a combination of grief and senility.
You will never love a women as much as George Lucas hates his fans.

I loved it (The movie that is, not the back breaking scene). I do think it had some pacing problems in the beginning, but I thought it was a great movie. The movie theater had the entire trilogy for $25, so I got to see all the movies at once. While I will say that I still think that The Dark Knight is the best of all of the movies, to me this one had more mystery. Like with TDK, I knew who the villain would be (The Joker) before I saw the movie, the only question was how bad would it be. But with this one, I literally did not know what to expect.