Five-Man Band cleanup

I looked through Anime and I don't see anything I'm familiar with that's not in the sandbox. I can say that Rose of Versailles is not an example as the characters listed don't make a consistent team.

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"

re princess and the frog, I could see the grounds to cut it. But I will say Charlotte is Tiana's sounding board and support in the the first part of the movie before she gets transformed. She just spends a lot of time removed from the rest of the core cast, which isn't unusual for The Chick who may otherwise be damseled, or the Token Human character, or Mission Control etc. See Hair of Gold, Heart of Gold on her character page: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Characters/ThePrincessAndTheFrog

Edited by acrobox on Jan 29th 2019 at 8:00:08 AM

So I'm going to expand the Ga'Hoole example, but I'm wondering if we should keep it under Film, or move it to Literature (as it was a book series first). It'd be overkill to have it under two namespaces, especially since the characters really don't change much. My vote is to move it to Literature under Guardians of Ga'Hoole.

Edited by WarJay77 on Jan 30th 2019 at 2:39:30 PM

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

yeah move it to the source material if the adaptation isnt radically different.

Edited by acrobox on Jan 30th 2019 at 10:33:00 AM

Yeah, but I feel like Charlotte only interacts with Tiana, not the other characters listed as members of the band. Usually The Chick ties the group together either by being friends will all of them, being a mediator, or by being romantically sought after by multiple characters, and I feel like Charlotte doesn't do really do this. Then again, it's been a while since I've seen the movie.

Saw this under literature, could also go under Anime, and I'm not sure if this counts:

• Haruhi Suzumiya: The story revolves around the adventures of the five members of the SOS brigade.
  • The Leader: Haruhi, who founded the club and is always the instigator of any antics that happen.
  • The Lancer: Kyon, whose cynicism and bored demeanor contrast with Haruhi's energy. Of all the members, he's closest to Haruhi and she values him the most.
  • The Smart Guy: Yuki, an alien computer with superhuman intelligence that is sometimes used to solve problems.
  • The Big Guy: Koizumi, a tall, quiet boy who goes along unquestionably with all of Haruhi's plans.
  • The Chick: Mikuru Asahina, a cute, emotional, and delicate girl whose sex appeal is frequently exploited by Haruhi for her plans. Kyon's crush on her creates a Love Triangle between him, her, and Haruhi.

Edited by naturalironist on Feb 10th 2019 at 3:52:51 PM

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"

Why do we have to outright cut some of these examples? Why can't we move them to The Team (as long as they actually have a team dynamic)?

^ We certainly can do that. I say we finish collecting all the valid examples on FMB first, and then go through and move any of the remaining examples to The Team, if they're actually a team.

I'm skeptical about the Johnny Test example, mainly because it's not five characters and the family rarely acts an actual team.

Edited by WarJay77 on Jan 31st 2019 at 8:55:23 AM

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

i've never actually watched johnny test, but the sisters seems like at least as much of, if not more of The Dividual /Those Two Guys as 3PO and R2 in Star Wars.

if they're just a family but don't really act as a team that often we can cut it too.

Alright, yeah, remove it on the grounds of them just being a family.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

I'm fine with moving things, but a lot of examples are Zero Context examples so you can't just directly move them.

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"

Right. I feel that for any we can find context for, but that doesn't fit the FMB, we can move. Of course they need to be an actual team and should be the team instead of a few randomly selected members.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

After Five Bad Band got cut, people are replacing it with Five Man Band. Is this okay? It doesn't seem right.

I don't think so— and not even because Five-Man Band is fundamentally heroic (as we've been discussing the fact that some villainous examples may actually fit the bill), but because the trope was cut in part because the Five Bad Band dynamic didn't even exist. If a team isn't a Five Bad Band, they wouldn't fit Five-Man Band either. They're just trying to shoehorn these examples into another trope and the examples should be cut.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Okay, I will nuke them when I see them.

Video Game section is done. took out anything i couldn't find context for easily, or that felt like a shoehorn.

An interesting, but not totally surprising, pattern emerged where The Chick is often the Deuteragonist, rather than ranger number 5, and is also usually second to join an RPG party (Stock anime hero meets girl and goes on adventure.) Makes sense that 'leading actress' is right up next to 'leading actor.'

I wasn't sure about Final Fantasy XIII which i put in, but felt like it may have been stretching a bit.

Also how do we feel about parties that grow to be more than 5, but the first 5 members (and therefore the full party for a time) fit the archetypes before the 6th, 7th, or 8th rangers show up?

Edited by acrobox on Feb 8th 2019 at 9:41:25 AM

I don't mind mentioning the excess in the pre-role description, however I don't feel that we can have any more than 5+sixth ranger or else they're just The Team.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Sounds like shoehorning to me. A six-man team doesn't become a Five-Man Band when one member goes to the bathroom and cease being a FMB when he comes back.

I more meant 5+1 as in the team of five is established and then the Sixth Ranger joins in afterward. Any team that was already 6+ members from the start is, yeah, a complete shoe-horn.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Right, but acrobox was making it sound more like "Can the first five characters to join The Team be a Five-Man Band even if three more characters join The Team later?"

And while I wouldn't categorically rule it out in all cases, I'd say that the fact that three more characters join The Team later makes me want to seriously examine whether it was actually a FMB in the first place.

Cloud, Tifa, Barret, Aeris, and Red XIII aren't a FMB that ceases to be an FMB once you recruit Yuffie and Cait Sith and Cid.

In that case, we agree.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Looking through the sandbox, the one piece of context that's still missing in a lot of cases is "the five characters have to work together and form a team." In the Half-Minute Hero entry, for example, the characters listed never work together as a team that I know of.

Something in the top-level bullet of each example that establishes that these five characters all actually work together as a team should be required, I think.

Edited by HighCrate on Feb 9th 2019 at 10:43:02 AM

That one was added by me. I don't know the game so I got all the info from the character page, with no real indication that they weren't actually a team. If this is the case, we can get rid of it.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

i dont know anything about that game either, but i just looked up this TAS of the game.

Looks like all five are party members by about the 2 minute mark, and there's a shot in the credits at about the 6:30 mark that shows them all standing side by side: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yFv9pqHNmg

Is something as simple as "these five characters are a traveling party on an adventure" enough context for being a team?

Edited by acrobox on Feb 9th 2019 at 12:55:14 PM

also went through the anime section surprisingly quickly. most were blatant shoehorns.

How do we feel about single gender examples like for instance Sailor Moon?

Edited by acrobox on Feb 10th 2019 at 12:12:38 PM

I'm of two minds. On the one hand, I don't see why not, as long as The Chick is The Heart and much girlier than the other characters. On the other hand, it seems unfair given male Chicks aren't allowed (which I don't totally agree with but that's the way it is), and an all-female group won't have the same gender dynamics as one with some male characters.

I'm not sure the Sailor Moon example counts regardless, since there are the outer soldiers making there be more than five characters.

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Entries from the sandbox that need more context on the "team" aspect:

• Chihaya Furu
• Combattler V
• Outlaw Star
• Rio
• The A-Team
• Conan the Destroyer
• Fantastic Voyage
• Flash Gordon (1980) (and the 6th character makes me question whether it's an example without more context)
• Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
• Geronimo Stilton
• Captain Power and the Soldiers of the Future
• Breath of Fire III
• Persona
• Tales of Phantasia
• Valkyria Chronicles
• The World Ends with You
• Daily Grind
• The Backyardigans
• Jelly Jamm
• RobotBoy
• Storm Hawks
• SilverHawks
• Thunder Cats 2011

Edited by naturalironist on Feb 10th 2019 at 3:52:26 PM

"It's just a show; I should really just relax"