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Is American Television Dying -- Or Thriving?

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TropeDad Lost and Spaced from Pittsburgh Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: In denial
Lost and Spaced
#1: Jun 17th 2012 at 3:40:57 PM

So, first things first — I used to post on here as "Exterminator_Zed", but I have no idea what happened to my password, and now can no longer use that login, apparently, so now, I am "Tropedad".

Hey all.

Anyway, the point:

Let's have a discussion — is television worse than it's ever been? Or to quote Liz Lemon, are we "entering a new golden age of scripted television"?

I'm a bit divided on the topic, myself, and there certainly is plenty of evidence to prove both arguments, I think.

...and on and on and on

So, what do you think? Where is television these days on the ol' quality scale to you? What shows do you think represent the best and worst in television out there? Why do you think those show are working or don't, or why they're terrible and they still are on?

There's plenty of room for discussion here!

edited 17th Jun '12 4:08:06 PM by TropeDad

Just a dad into tropes. Not the father of tropes.
BorneAgain (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#2: Jun 17th 2012 at 4:26:04 PM

TV, specifically American television is in an adjustment phase because may people have still not completely adapted to modern reality of DV Rs, Netflix, and online programming. Cable its arguably in its best era ever, exploring avenues and for allowing for niche programming that was hard to imagine even 15 years ago. Its networks which are in the midst of a slow crisis because they're feeding into a model of 22 episodes a season which is argued as having a detrimental effect on quality; in addition to heavy costs for episodes and ratings that must be solid very early on thus many shows simply aren't allowed to find an audience.

johnnyfog Actual Wrestling Legend from the Zocalo Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Actual Wrestling Legend
#3: Jun 17th 2012 at 6:01:29 PM

They're re-airing Zen again tonight, reminding me that even Britain isn't immune to axeing good shit. sad

I think it's a problem with networks. We can easily stream Game of Thrones and catch up with the story, or look up a series wiki. But no one is going to beat NCIS in the ratings, so we have to keep aping NCIS to close the rating gap. This cycle has been going on since the time of Bonanza, and it's why I don't watch network TV unless forced.

I'm a skeptical squirrel
TropeDad Lost and Spaced from Pittsburgh Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: In denial
Lost and Spaced
#4: Jun 17th 2012 at 6:13:44 PM

Do you think that there are any good network TV shows that have the ability to turn the tide on the network model?

I have a few network shows that I still tune into, but admittedly, it's not many.

Just a dad into tropes. Not the father of tropes.
Ever9 from Europe Since: Jul, 2011
#5: Jun 18th 2012 at 1:31:39 AM

What is dead may never die, but rises again, harder and stronger.

0Emmanuel Author At Work from Between Elbe and Rhine Since: Nov, 2009
Author At Work
#6: Jun 18th 2012 at 4:22:08 AM

I don't think marking certain forms as good and others as bad is very useful. Season length is not an indicator of quality, neither is serialization. Furthermore, one has to differentiate between sitcoms and dramas when talking about quality differences between cable and network TV.

The network sitcom is as alive as ever and on par with its cable equivalent.

There is a bit of a dearth of quality dramas on network TV, however, that's true. Having to appeal to a broader audience seems to lead to more "safe" creative choices there.
Exceptions exist, though. The Good Wife is as critically acclaimed as any cable show. Stuff like Awake pops up regularly, even if only for a season or so. There are also occasional unexpectedly fun surprises, like REVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENGE. wink
Also, let's not forget that Friday Night Lights ended only a year ago.

In general, there is just a lot of stuff out there nowadays, whether network or cable, which means there is bound to be some good among it. It's just a bit difficult to find sometimes.

edited 18th Jun '12 4:22:51 AM by 0Emmanuel

Love truth, but pardon error. - Voltaire
Nicknacks Ding-ding! Going down... from Land Down Under Since: Oct, 2010
Ding-ding! Going down...
#7: Jun 18th 2012 at 4:39:57 AM

I'm not sure that I really know what the pre=90's tv landscape looked like. So I don't think I can comment.

But I have read articles that argue that the "new golden age of teleivion" arguments are complete bunkum.

This post has been powered by avenging fury and a balanced diet.
0Emmanuel Author At Work from Between Elbe and Rhine Since: Nov, 2009
Author At Work
#8: Jun 18th 2012 at 6:52:49 AM

[up] Do you have an article like that on hand to link? Was the tenor of these articles "TV is as terrible as it's ever been", or more "there were great shows before The Sopranos, you know"?

Love truth, but pardon error. - Voltaire
Nicknacks Ding-ding! Going down... from Land Down Under Since: Oct, 2010
Ding-ding! Going down...
#9: Jun 18th 2012 at 7:02:14 AM

The latter, though the view suggested the former as well.

And no, I unfortunately don't, though I really should. I do remember reading it on the av onion website, though it could easily have been on one of the various blogs I frequent.

This post has been powered by avenging fury and a balanced diet.
Journeyman Overlording the Underworld from On a throne in a vault overlooking the Wasteland Since: Nov, 2010
Overlording the Underworld
#10: Jun 18th 2012 at 10:43:57 AM

So long as American TV can keep enough peoples' interest, it isn't going to die. It might fall into reality tv shit for a while (though I doubt that) but once the LCD gets tired of those shows, they'll look for better.

every108minutes from Sesame Street Since: Jun, 2012
#11: Jun 18th 2012 at 12:27:05 PM

This whole argument depends on what time period of tv you're comparing it to and what generation. For example, a Charlie Chaplin show should not be considered the same quality today as its premiere.

Also, the production quality has to be taken into affect. (Arguably,) the earlier episodes of The Simpsons were more cheaply animated than the ones today, but they had better writing.

OPEN DA DOOooOR!
OldManHoOh It's super effective. from England Since: Jul, 2010
It's super effective.
#12: Jun 18th 2012 at 1:49:12 PM

Not especially a fan, but I'm pretty sure that season 1 of The Simpsons (the clearly cheap looking one) is divisive on its writing quality and humour. I don't think anyone considers it part of its "golden age".

TropeDad Lost and Spaced from Pittsburgh Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: In denial
Lost and Spaced
#13: Jun 18th 2012 at 9:47:52 PM

once the LCD gets tired of those shows, they'll look for better.

No one ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public.

Edit

^ Early installment weirdness. It was still recovering from the Tracey Ullman show.

edited 18th Jun '12 9:49:11 PM by TropeDad

Just a dad into tropes. Not the father of tropes.
TheWanderer Student of Story from Somewhere in New England (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
Student of Story
#14: Jun 18th 2012 at 9:54:24 PM

Network TV is definitely dominated by LCD and crappy Reality TV shows right now.

Cable has probably never been as good as it is right now though. HBO, and other premium channels have been doing great work and regular cable channels such as F/X, AMC and others have been stepping up. Hell, USA network used to be known for being the absolute dumping ground of cable tv and it has been making quite serviceable shows for a few years now.

| Wandering, but not lost. | If people bring so much courage to this world...◊ |
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#15: Jun 18th 2012 at 10:31:18 PM

Dying.

I feel that TV is suffering from the economic downturn, and as a result, has to fill its slots with cheap reruns and cheap reality TV. Ugh.

Do not obey in advance.
PoochyEXE from 127.0.0.1 Since: Sep, 2010
#16: Jun 19th 2012 at 2:52:59 AM

I think the best of American TV has been improving, but the crappy stuff keeps getting worse. And the latter tends to overshadow the former, since per Sturgeon's Law, it makes up 90% of everything on TV.

I suspect the root cause of this is a combination of Follow the Leader and complacency. Every time a novel show is a hit, we get a bunch of imitators of it, which won't go away until the genre is mostly dead. After MythBusters proved to be a hit, every science-y cable channel tried its own attempt at Education Through Pyrotechnics. In the mid-2000's, there was a whole slew of The Daily Show ripoffs, and the only new entry in the genre which stuck was one actual spinoff. How I Met Your Mother is a hit? Bring out a parade of shows about people's hilarious misadventures trying to find love. And we even have our own trope just for imitators of Who Wants To Be A Millionaire. The other part of the problem is that ever since Survivor, the networks have figured out that most reality shows ("most" meaning "basically everything not titled The Amazing Race") can be filmed with No Budget, so even if it flops, it wasn't that big a risk or investment to begin with. So they've become the new B-movies.

But I'm sure that once this wave of crap dies out, people will try new things since there will be no familiar territory to stick to, and out of that will come a new hit or two. (If you want evidence of why I think this, it sort of happened during the 2007-2008 Writers' Strike. Although then the strike ended and everyone went back to producing the same old scripted dramas.) And then everyone will jump on that bandwagon and beat it to death until only the original groundbreaker and maybe a handful of other good ones remain. It's the TV Circle of Life. If I have my TV history right, American TV went through the same thing with variety and talk shows in the 70's, and around the same time the UK went through a phase of cheapskate game shows. We're just experiencing the same thing all over again with cheap reality shows.

edited 19th Jun '12 2:56:58 AM by PoochyEXE

Extra 1: Poochy Ain't Stupid
ATC Was Aliroz the Confused from The Library of Kiev Since: Sep, 2011
Was Aliroz the Confused
#17: Jun 25th 2012 at 3:14:10 PM

The few bright spots are growing brighter, but mostly everything is getting mores low-quality.

If you want any of my avatars, just Pm me I'd truly appreciate any avatar of a reptile sleeping in a Nice Hat Read Elmer Kelton books
Jhimmibhob Since: Dec, 2010
#18: Jun 26th 2012 at 10:33:49 AM

The shape of the quality bell curve hasn't changed, but thanks to cable the sample size has increased tremendously. That translates to far more great shows than before, far more bottom-of-the-barrel shows, and far more mediocre shows—but all in roughly the same proportions.

However, having a greater sample size increases the chance that statistical outliers will crop up. The more shows out there and the more networks, the more working room an occasional oddball innovator or visionary has to succeed astonishingly—or fail to an equally astonishing degree.

edited 26th Jun '12 10:36:52 AM by Jhimmibhob

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