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The initial OP posted below covers it well enough: the premise of this thread is that men's issues exist. Don't bother posting if you don't believe there is such a thing.
Here's hoping this isn't considered too redundant. I've noticed that our existing threads about sexism tend to get bogged down in Oppression Olympics or else wildly derailed, so I thought I'd make a thread specifically to talk about discrimination issues that disproportionately affect men.
No Oppression Olympics here, okay? No saying "But that's not important because women suffer X which is worse!" And no discussing these issues purely in terms of how much better women have it. Okay? If the discussion cannot meaningfully proceed without making a comparison to male and female treatment, that's fine, but on the whole I want this thread to be about how men are harmed by society and how we can fix it. Issues like:
- The male-only draft (in countries that have one)
- Circumcision
- Cavalier attitudes toward men's pain and sickness, AKA "Walk it off!"
- The Success Myth, which defines a man's desirability by his material success. Also The Myth of Men Not Being Hot, which denies that men can be sexually attractive as male beings.
- Sexual abuse of men.
- Family law.
- General attitudes that men are dangerous or untrustworthy.
I could go on making the list, but I think you get the idea.
Despite what you might have heard about feminists not caring about men, it's not true. I care about men. Patriarchy sucks for them as much as it sucks for women, in a lot of ways. So I'm putting my keyboard where my mouth is and making a thread for us to all care about men.
Also? If you're male and think of something as a men's issue, by golly that makes it a men's issue fit for inclusion in this thread. I might disagree with you as to the solution, but as a woman I'm not going to tell you you have no right to be concerned about it. No "womansplaining" here.
Edited by nombretomado on Dec 15th 2019 at 5:19:34 AM
Indeed. We should hold all underage sexualization on the same ground and stop holding men as "greater bad". So, how do we fix this problem?
Solution one: Make it Okay for men to act like this. Not my favorite idea, due to chance it can make real pedos crimes easier to commit.
Solution two: Make it not Okay for women to act like this. A lot more easier and should not be that hard, since we can just ramp up the perceived creepy factor, by using media to constantly portray these women as "creepy".
Of course, this means that we should put woman-on-underaged-boy sex equally criminal to man-on-underaged-girl.
That's because, societally speaking, nothing is creepy if you're attractive enough. This is true of both genders.
- Ugly man sneaking into a woman's bedroom to watch her sleep - Restraining order.
- Sexy man sneaking into a woman's bedroom to watch her sleep - Marry me now.
- Sexy woman walking up to a stranger and making out with him - hot.
- Ugly woman walking up to a stranger and making out with him - oh god, stop touching me.
How attracted the victimized party is to the offender can make a world of difference.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.I agree we need to get rid of "Get a woman! NOW!" attitude towards men.
I mean, is it really that hard to wrap your mind around a concept that I might be a friend with a woman without wanting to date or have sex with her? Really? People are constantly telling me to make a move or I "lose her"...
Why can't I just be a friend? Do I really need to push for something neither of us is wanting? I mean, if she wanted to date me, then she should tell me so. She has not made any indication that she wants us to be anything else than friends and this is perfectly fine by me.
So why do everyone else, men and women, insist me that I must make a move?
edited 9th Aug '13 9:49:51 AM by Mandemo
D. Dancer: And nothing of value was lost. Good on you.
Share it so that people can get into this conversation, 'cause we're not the only ones who think like this.I think it's more reflective of this whole gender sectioning that happens when you're younger. Boys play with boys and hang out with boys and do things that boys do. Lest they grow up and catch "Teh Gay".
For girls, there's kind of a simultaneous acceptance and rejection of girls doing things that boys do. Those who reject usually do it either on the grounds of pure misogyny (girls just shouldn't do it, period) or on the grounds of attractiveness (sure, doing boys stuff is just fine so long as it increases your chances of landing a boyfriend, otherwise, forget it).
But in either case, it starts with the separation of the genders and what they "should" and "shouldn't" have an interest or aptitude in while young.
One thing I kinda wish to address is the lack of real role models for boys. All they got is either this ultra macho soldier guy or... yeah, I think that's about it. It's the only "accepted" role model. You must always be the hero, always ready for action, etc.
Girls get all kinds of role models to follow, but boys still get this one role model.
Really?
How about an astronaut, a secret agent like James Bond, the president, even a geek hero like Einstein or Edison. You're saying those aren't acceptable role models for boys?
She of Short Stature & Impeccable Logic My Skating LiveblogWhereas female role models consist of Barbie and...that other Barbie with the different skirt.
It's really hard to claim that girls have tons of role models they can choose from, while boys don't.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Bullied, hyperintelligent teenager gets superpowers, is suddenly jaw-droppingly good-looking and immensely strong, gets to deliver justice to evildoers, date the hottest girl in school, and be the smartest, funniest guy in the room at any given moment. Hard to argue there isn't a certain fantasy element there, despite all the soap-opera angst the guy's associated with.
The same is true of magic-users in storytelling; wizards are quadratic because they play to the idea that all those years spent locked in your room reading books will give you the power to destroy entire cities with the sheer power of your mind. They turn intelligence into explosive, unbeatable raw force that puts those bullies and jocks to shame.
All those guys that spent the last ten years lifting weights? They're just there to soak up damage for you, until your book-reading unlocks the secrets to conquering the universe, destroying all who oppose you, and saving the day with the Power of Intelligence. Pure nerd power fantasy.
edited 9th Aug '13 3:21:42 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.ok, on the role models thing. I don't get why anyone needs a role model. just never made sense to me.
also this:
am I the only who sees how ridiculous this is, from a logical standpoint I mean. there are a lot of ways this line of thinking is ridiculous. but assuming sexuality even worked this way, what kind of logic is it to have boys only connect and relate to others of the same gender in most of their formative years, and assume that they'd be straight? or the opposite, a boy connecting and relating to exclusively the opposite gender, oops they must turn out gay. I mean what?
that illogic aside, I do think this bizarre notion of keeping the genders rather separate in a persons early years (along with the insane notion that a guy and girl cannot have a purely platonic friendship) are some of the most detrimental. especially when you look at media and how Most Writers are Male plus these concepts, the best understanding they'll have of the other gender is basically just sterotypes
edited 9th Aug '13 5:18:04 PM by Jetyl
I'm afraid I can't explain myself, sir. Because I am not myself, you see?There's some reasoning behind the idea that girls and boys keep apart in earlier parts of their development so they can "rediscover" the other gender when they enter puberty. It's similar but not identical to the way individual girls and boys growing up aside each other and then being unable to see the other as sexual partners, viewing them as siblings even if they aren't.

Twilight Moms creep me the fuck out, yo.
Edit: Aaaaaaaaand of course I top the page.
edited 8th Aug '13 7:05:27 PM by somerandomdude
ok boomer