I am now a shiny stone~
There should be a Gutenberg Project e-book of Journey to the West D:
I mean the silly tome predates Gutenberg himself.
The three finest things in life are to splat your enemies, drive them from their turf, and hear their lamentations as their rank falls!
cuter, cuddlier Edmond
Project Gutenberg does have it. Here
, but I hope you know Chinese...
I actually did find someone hosting an English version though (based on the W.J.F. Jenner translation and thus, probably in violation of Jenner's copyright).
Oddly enough, Saiyuki's sister novel Romance of the Three Kingdoms has an official online host, and a really good one to boot—I especially like how there's notes and mini-discussion forums right next to certain paragraphs. It makes me wonder why Journey to the West has nothing similar.
You seem to have got the makers wrong for the 1970's live-action adaptation of Monkey, or Saiyuki. Starring Natsume Masako, who died tragically young from acute leukaemia in 1985 as Tripitaka and Sakai Masaaki as Monkey, it was a Nippon Television/NHK/International Television co-production. (I knew since watching it as a boy that it was from Japan, yet the information that it was filmed mostly in China and Inner Mongolia by a Japanese crew - much like Suikoden, or in English, The Water Margin was, in roughly the same time - 70's, I have to confess I got from Wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monkey_%28TV_series%29 for further details.
It is available as a complete box-set from Amazon and Play.com and is brilliant, from what I remember of it.
I remember I tried to read Journey to the West the whole way through, and while I did like it, I only ever got up to the beginning of the fourth volume (I was using Jenner's translation). After a while, all the different stories just seemed too similar to each other, and I lost interest. I'll have to finish it one of these days...
I also remember that the only adaptation of Journey to the West that I ever saw was the first season of Dragon Ball (no, I don't consider anything after that to be even remotely connected to it), and even then only because I could say, "Oh, so this guy is supposed to take the place of this guy!"
edited 13th May '12 9:08:04 PM by IrishZombie
I am now a shiny stone~
Half the fun is having Wukong endure getting headaches from the Tang Priest because of his thoughtlessness.
The three finest things in life are to splat your enemies, drive them from their turf, and hear their lamentations as their rank falls!
Here's a link to it that I found through Wikipedia. I'm not sure which translation it is, but I enjoyed it.
edited 4th Jul '12 2:19:55 AM by Ghostninja109
cuter, cuddlier Edmond
That looks like the W.J.F. Jenner translation.
On a related note, I just finished watching the first season of Gensoumaden Saiyuki. I don't know about the rest, but it definitely has my favorite Genjo Sanzo of all time.
edited 4th Jul '12 4:32:07 AM by MoeDantes
visit my blog!
One thing I did not like about the original Journey to the West novel is that is said that it was okay to kill monsters, but not okay to kill humans. Most people think that the line is justified because those monsters are just plants and animals that have gain powerful forms, but plant and animals are living things and that thinking sounds anthropocentric as one day plants and animals (whom are not humans) might gain sapient intelligent. Also note that not all humans in Chinese Mythology are oridinary even though the ones that Wukong kill where as some humans come into possess of magical powers from special trinaing. In one chapter the author contradict himself on the value of human and monster life by having the Tathagata Buddha sympathsizing with Wukong killing six-eared macaque not to mention all a way up to chapter eight the author show us how monsters had emotional thought patterns and people whom they cared about like family and friends and we see this clearly doing the Wukong time at Flower Fruit Mountain, but has the protagonist slaughtering monsters and committing genocide against them although some of the monsters in the cave did not really attack them and where just mere servant of the chief monster and even if the chief monster was spared because they were runaways from heaven or they have where taking to heaven to repent the protagonists still kill off the whatever monsters was still there in the cave instead of reasoning with them. Now if Guanyin said that Wukong should not kill normal individuals then that would have The fact that Wukong ordered Bajie and Wujing to kill two innocent half-monster/half-human not to mention they were of divine origin, but the celestial being did not anything about it most likely because the Yellow Robe Monster (who was actually the God of Wood Wolf of Legs) went down there went to earth and marry a mortal and if you read Chinese Myths such as the Lotus Lantern and the Cowherd and Weaver Girl you would see that it is against heavens rules for an immortal to marry an immortal although that still does not justified the protagonist killing them not to mention they got away with it. Also Princess of Elephentia's (whom Yellow Robe monster kidnapped) previous incarnation agreed to the marrying the God Wood Wolf of Legs as she was a immortal in the celestial palace, but they did not want to make . Wukong also got away with steal rice from some humans when he simply could have disguise himself as a human in order to bring the rice back to Xuanzang, and also gets away with this. Also many adaptations of the Journey to the West also suggest that monster life is just as important as human life. I have watch the Gensomaden Saiyuki series and it does not treat the slaughter of monsters as a good thing unlike the original Journey to the West, which is why the protagonist are call anti-heroes instead of heroes. In this other animated series Monkey, Monk, and the Monsters Go West it shows that the protagonists just give the mosnters a good beating and reason with them afterwards, which does work instead of killing them although they did kill Immortal Zheng Ying (whom is not a monster by the way) and an victim of adaptational villainy in that adaptation and the monsters whom they sealed in the Daoist bag where eventually freed by the end of the series. Also getting back to Gensomaden Saiyuki its Saiyuki Gaiden also have some adaptational villainy taking place as well as Nezha's (who is known by his Japanese name Nataku in this series) father is geninuely sinister whereas in the Chinese Mythology he was no worse than the other celestial beings, but despite the adaptational villainy that take place in Journey to the West adaptatons I continue to watch them. Basically what is going on in the Gensomaden Red Boy ( who is called by his Japanese name Kougaiji and is an adult in Gensomaden Saiyuki)'s parents the Bull King (Gyumaoh) and Princess Iron Fan/Raksasi (Tessen Koushu/Rasetsunyo) have been sealed up by the divinities because of some crimed that was said to be committed although there is no solid proof of this crime or do not know the whole story behind this and Red Boy himself was sealed up, but broken free somehow, and Red Boy has yet to tell his side of the story of the event. Princess Jade Face (Gyoukumen Koushu) is working on an experiment with Dr. Nii (who is based off of the 'Crow's Nest Zen Priest also known as the Rook Nest Hermit' in the original Journey to the West novel was not evil in the source material), but he and Princess Jade Face along with this female monster named Professor Hwang created the minus wave causing the monsters to go completely berserk in order to revive the Bull King although I do not know how the minus wave have a part in the revival as they may want to get recruits to help them seeing as everyone or the majority of the people in Houtou Castle was said to be sealed up by the celestial beings, but she refuses to have Princess Iron Fan participate in the revival experiment because she has a resentment and she does seem although she blackmail Red Boy into helping her retrieve the Five Sutras and said told him that she would revives Princess Iron Fan him so Red Boy is working hard to save his mother, but I think Princess Jade Face is lying to Red Boy and going to attempt to dispose of Princess Iron Fan later on. The protagonists of the manga were sent to stop the Bull King's resurrection under the orders of the celestial beings. The Bull King and Princess Iron Fan have not made an official appearance in the Saiyuki anime/manga series as they are in a petrified state and we do not see the battle between Nezha and the Bull King that was mentioned in this the Saiyuki Gaiden manga although author the Saiyuki manga Minekura Kazuya provided an explanation why she sealed the two away. I would give the link to the Comparative Analysis since I am a new user I am not allowed to add links yet.
['Comparative Analysis'] ☆ In “Saiyuki” I dared to seal away Rasetsunyo and Gyuumaoh, and make Gyokumen Koushu the top of the enemy side. Because she was in the best position to express the “self-centered desires” often discussed in Saiyuki, and because I had decided to draw the Sanzo Ikkou side and the Gyuumaoh side as parallels, she fell into this sort of setting. [/quote]
We never know if Wukong (Goku) master Subhuti exist in this manga as his train was a very significant to how he obtain great magical power and gain super strength in the original Journey to the West life Saiyuki Gaiden show where he was born from a rock and how he was tricked into coming to heaven.
I am currently watching a series called Hong hai'er/Red Kid in Chinese and has been translated to many language in South Asia, but not not been subbed or dubbed in English and I had to watch it carefully to understand what it said as I know some Chinese, but I have a long way to go to be proficient at reading and speaking it, but so far I like this adaptation of the Journey to the West. Hong hai'er was a fictional version of the Sudhanakurama the from the Avatamsaka Sutra and Sudhana was not originally evil in the canon Buddhist Text as Wu Cheng'en exposed him to adaptational villainy although this was not because he despised Sudhana, but he wanted to create a backstory for him. Now getting back to the adaptation the first episode it is Red Boy's birthday and he has a paternal grandmother in this series who plays a significant role. There is a scene where Red Boy is causing mischief as he wants to bring some children (whom were monsters) back to celebrate his birthday with him and the Earth God Tu Di Gong ask Red Boy why is he causing michief and Red Boy tells him why. A White Bone Spirit, a spider spirit, and a a scorpion spirit appears at Fire Cloud Cave where the Bull King, Princess Iron Fan, Red Boy, and the Bull King's mother resided and tell them to go away from the cave and no one could be there without his wife's permission although the female monsters argue back and a fight took place although I am not sure what the Bull King did to them as he said somthing about giving a present to Red Boy. Red Boy's paternal grandmother and parents celebrate Red Boy's birthday and Princess Iron Fan said that Red Boy was nine years old, but Red Boy cannot become older than eight years old and Red Boy get angry with his mother for lying to him and his father the Bull King demands that he apologizes to her and he does eventually and is given a horse as he birthday present and goes to find this wise old tree spirit ask about his age and the tree spirit told him that he would for always be eight, and then Red Boy beat the Tree spirit up and calls him a liar and then a voice spoke to him which turn out to be the horse that he received from his birthday, and he tries to come Red Boy down and he told Red Boy that day was his birthday as well. The horse changed into a humanoid appearance and he lied at first and said to Red Boy that he is the Bimawen (which is translated as Protector of Horses in English and it is the title that Jade Emperor gave to Wukong when he first came to heaven), but when he learned of Red Boy's lie detector he told Red Boy he was Paimawen ('pai' mean's to beat or to hit in Chinese) and tells Red Boy that Paimawen is a ninth rank position in heaven while Bimawen is a seventh rank position in heaven and he also told Red Boy that he escape from the attack from a Dragon King and was brought to Fire Cloud Cave by the Bull King in horse form. Paiwamen calls Red Boy his Elder Brother even though Paiwamen he looks much older than him. There is a scene where we see Tang Sanzang, Wukong, Bajie, and Wujing traveling on a journey and Wukong jokes about there being a inn for them to spend the night in ahead and then said that they will have to said in a cave and Wujing compliants about insects crawling over him, but Wukong told him that they will stay in a clean cave and White Bone Spirit, the spider spirit, the scorpion spirit, and a fox spirit are watch them and fighting over who is going to eat Tang Sanzang. Anyway the scene go back to Red Boy and Paimawen and Paimawen see and mirror and ask Red Boy about it. Red Boy said that the mirror belonged to his grandmother and that it could predict the future and they took a look into the mirror. Red Boy's parents came into the room and hid Paimawen and they asked Red Boy what he was doing and what happen to the horse they gave him and Red Boy lies and said that he release him and they notice something suspicious Red Boy and talked about it after Red Boy leaves the room. In another scene Paiwamen talks to Red Boy about the birthday buns he received from last years (which still look good) and compliant about having only eight birthday buns and Paiwamen changes the eight buns into nine and Paiwamen said that Red Boy mother use to be the best chef in heaven. Red Boy makes a wish that he could grow older so his mother will not upset. Later he finds his mother in the hallway who apologize for lying to him and she past out, and the Bull King comes and takes her to his mother so they could help her regain consicous, but does not notice Paiwamen presents, and Red Boy curses heaven for the misfortunate. It seems that Princess Iron Fan has a distress illness and Red Boy goes to the Tree spirit and ask him for advice at first the Tree spirit pretended dead, Red Boy felt guilty because of it, but later the Tree Spirit tell Red Boy to Traquility Lake to find a cure, and Red Boy returns to tell his father and grandmother about the going to Traqulaity Lake and they were introduced to Paimawen, but his grandmother said that her father and her will not be able to go because they use up their strength to revive Princess Iron Fan, and the Bull King tells Red Boy to go to traquility lake to save Princess Iron Fan, but his grandmother was against the idead and said that it was to dangerous to go alone, but Paiwamen said that he would go with Hong hai'er. When they got to the lake they met a elderly looking female deity who told them to fell a gourd up to eight liters and gave it to Princess Iron Fan whom regrain conscious, and convesation between the female deity and Princess Iron Fan took place and the female deity ask Princess Iron Fan how could she have a distress disease if she have such a filial son and Princess Iron Fan told her that she could not grant Red Boy his wish to grow up, and the female deity then tell Red Boy and Paiwamen that they need to get the Braun grass to help with the distress illness further and episode ends.
Episode 2 starts out with Bajie meeting a fox spirit unknownly and tells Bajie she was attacked by a spider spirit, fox spirit, and other monsters. Bajie tells her about Wukong tremedous magical powers in battling monsters and takes her back to the cave they were staying in. The fox spirit made up a story about traveling from a town called Xianghe and her elder sister being killed by monsters and her mother been captured by them. Wukong is not fooled by this and pretends to live the cave. The fox spirit said that she was thirsty and Wujing said the water was gone and went to get some more. The fox spirit tease Bajie about his fear of doing anything and then it appear that she froze him place, but that does not seem to be the case and the fox spirit tries to eat Tang Sanzang and it reveal that he was Bajie transformed as a result of Wukong's magic and a battle took place with them and the fox spirit whom escaped and Tang Sanzang tell Wukong not to go after her and not to be so ruthless, but Wukong argues that leaving that fox spirit alive will cause the aftermath of the earth and Tang Sanzang tells him that his desire to kill the fox spirit makes him no better than her. The scene goes to Red Boy and Paimawen gather the Braun grass and meet the fox spirit who demands Red Boy to give her the Braun grass and they fought and the fox spirit was outmatched. The fox spirit tells Red Boy to stop the fight and said that she needed the Braun grass to recovery from an injury she received from her previous fight, but Red Boy still refuses saying that he needed the grass to recover his mother distress disease and then the fox spirit tells Red Boy about Tang Sanzang and how eating him could cure his mother distress illness and also told him that Tang Sanzang was an Immortal Peach Spirit and Paimawen tells Red Boy not to listen to her. Red Boy and Paiwamen returns to Tranquality Lake and gives Princess Iron Fan the Braun grass and the female deity tells Red Boy that his filial piety will minimize his mother distress illness. Red Boy, Princess Iron Fan, and Paiwamen headed back to Fire Cloud Cave to celebrate Princess Iron Fan's revival along with the Bull King and the Bull King's mother. The Bull King get a letter and tells them that his sworn brother Sun Wukong wants to stay at the cave and bring Tang Sanzang there to spend the night, but his mother Princess Iron Fan and protested as they held a grudge against Sun Wukong, which I will talk about later. Red Boy decides to leave Fire Cloud Cave to capture Tang Sanzang and cook him to cure his mother distress illness, and Paimawen tries to convince him to stop, but Red Boy refuse to listen and Paimawen was debating whether to tell the Bull King about this, but he then decides to go along with Red Boy. Red Boy uses the same trick in the original Journey to the West novel and the same story to get Tang Sanzang, Wukong, Bajie, and Wujing to free him from the tree and basically the same thing happen except Red Boy does have an independent cave for himself, but he goes into the woods and to escape from Wukong through a barrier and joins up with Paimawen whom congraluates him, and Wukong tries to lure Red Boy out by telling him that he found him and the fox spirit appears and said that she would help Red Boy to creat a diversion to escape Wukong and said to leave her Tang Sanzang arm to eat, but when Red Boy left the fox spirit froze Paimawen in place and said that he thought that they had an agreement and the fox spirit said that she does not want an arm, but the whole Tang Sanzang for herself and her sisters. Red Boy battles Wukong and outwits him and return to where Paimawen is and Paimawen explain who they have been tricked by the fox spirit and the two chases after the fox spirit and Red Boy defeats her causing her and her sisters to treat. Red Boy though still desires to cook Tang Sanzang and take him back to Fire Cloud Cave. The scene then switches to Sun Wukong and called on Tu Di Gong and asked him about Red Boy's origins and he tells him that he is the son of the Bull King and Princess Iron Fan. Next scene shows Red Boy tells Princess Iron Fan that he brought back Tang Sanzang for her to eat to cure her distress disease and Princess Iron Fan told Red Boy that she could not eat him as he was the disciple of the Tathagata Buddha and eating him is a crime against heaven. Sun Wukong comes to Fire Cloud Cave and Red Boy offers to battle him, but Princess Iron Fan said that she would handle Sun Wukong herself. Sun Wukong address Princess Iron Fan as his sister-in-law and tell her that Red Boy has captured his master Tang Sanzang and she pretends that she does not know what he is talking about and fights him. The Bull King stops the fight and Wukong also tells him about the matter and the Bull King invites him in ask Red Boy about it. The Bull King's mother who also knows about Tang Sanzang presents there tells Red Boy and Paimawen to hide Tang Sanzang. Wukong spent a while looking for Tang Sanzang and he and the Bull King tell him he could spend the night there, but the Bull King's mother protest and said that they had a lot of work to do talks about their friendship from five-hundred years ago when the Bull King went to visited the Water Curtain Cave. Wukong said in order to avoid discomforting the Bull King he would leave and come back tomorrow. Princess Iron Fan scolds the Bull King for being so friendly with Wukong, but of what happened to her five-hundred years ago when she was pregnant with Red Boy and she that Wukong was responsible for Red Boy not being able to grow up although it was an accident on Wukong part. The Bull King tells her that at least Red Boy is in good health. Red Boy said that he is happy with being eight and does not matter if he grows up, and he ask why did Wukong harm him five-hundred years ago, and then the story was told to Red Boy and a scene goes to a flashback at the Tusita Palace where the Bull King and Princess Iron Fan asked Taishang Laojun also known as Lord Laozi a favor, which was to make Hong hai'er not grow any older than eighteen (notice I said eighteen not eight, which is currently the age that Hong hai'er stopped at in the series)and Taishan Laojun that he would do it, but they would have to abided by his instructions, and the episode ended.
I will provide summary of episode 3 of Hong hai'er when I finish watching it.
Also I wish someone could translate this manhua Chinese Comic Called 'Saint (manhua)' also known as 'Great Saint King', which is another adpataion of the Journey to the West. I mean a 'Betascript publisher' for Saint (manhua) is avaliable English for the manhua so why couldn't someone translate the manhua to English. There is information on wikipedia about the series and from reading the information sounds like a good series to read. Wouldn't company who made the 'Betascript publisher' is interest in comic, but they can not read it unless they learn Chinese.
edited 16th Aug '12 9:11:12 PM by Mika
The Final ECW Champion
Isn't that enslaved game for the X-box and adaptation of Journey to the west?(can you summarize the plots a little more next time too?)
edited 9th Sep '12 3:31:17 PM by Cider
Modified Ura-nage, Torture Rack
That story Saiyuki Reload Blast is slow at reviewing Wukong's backstory before he was captured in heaven, and I not sure whether the author will do it as I think that Wukong training to become an immortal and his early life is important in the story as to me Wukong does not seem to be getting an equal amount of focus as Sanzang, Bajie, and Wujing in the series. I think the idea of Sanzang being useful in battle, and Bajie and Wujing not being capture by monster so easily is a good thing, but still Wukong seems to be getting very little foscus in that series, and how he obtain his power has never been explain yet as in the original book Wukong trained by the Patriarch Subhuti to become power, and was not born with his strength. Even the Abbot Faming who took in Sanzang is getting much more focus than Wukong and has a entire manga centered around him called Saiyuki Ibun.
I did like the first manga Gensomaden Saiyuki, but the only unique foe in Saiyuki Reload was Zakuro and Hazel and the foes in the Sky Burial arc of Sayuki Reload Blast were random humanoid monsters who were killed off so easy, and had no names. There is no information on Hong hai'er backstory either. I guess I am going to have to be patient though, and see what Minekura Kazayki is going to do. I did started off read that Saiyuki manga first before I read the Journey to the West as I trying my best to find a way to read the original story and I did not know before that I did know that Wukong trained under a Patriach named Subhuti and that that Tieshan Gongzhu wield a Palm Leaf Fan from viewing his wikipedia page, but the other information I didn't know before such as Wukong and Niumowang were sworn brothers prior to Wukong and Guanyin defeating his son Hong hai'er, or that Heaven King Li was not as bad in the Chinese Myths like he was portayed in Saiyuki Gaiden because wikipedia did not post the information at the time, but since I read the original Journey to the West story I try to tell another people who read that manga about the source material, and about the 'Comparative Analysis' that the author wrote on the manga.
I have seen walkthrough of Saiyuki: Journey West video game on the internet and I like the video game story, as the plot is not similar to the original story, but the changes are not that drastic. In the Journey to the West (1986) was too close to the book, which is why I did not really enjoy it, and the Journey to the West (1996) was almost unique and the uniques arcs were very good and Tianpeng story was also enjoyable, but they copy that story arc straight about the Tiger Immortal, Elk Power Immortal, and Antelope Power Immortal. The Journey to the West (2010) was also more unique than the original story which was also good versions, but some arcs followed the original story to close. Monkey King: Quest for the Sutras deviates from the plot entirely, which I like. Although this other manga call Assobot Goku takes tons of liberties, but I still enjoy it.
Also I notice that most adaptation focus on Tianpeng not Jinchan and Jualian as the only one who focus on all three of them were Saiyuki Gaiden, which the side series of Gensomaden Saiyuki and they are called by their Japanese names, which are Tenpou, Kozen, and Kenren respectively, but no adaptation this far that I seen has taken the poem that Bajie and Wujing spoke about on how they became celestial beings in 'chapter 94) and expand on them. Also the Immortal Master called the Immortal of Wishes (As-You-Will Immortal) whom is Niumowang's brother and Hong hai'er's uncle is absent and never mentioned in most adaptations as I lot could be written about him as well.
edited 5th Nov '12 1:48:36 PM by Mika
Conceptually Frameworked
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Wow, Wall of Text much?
I did try to start reading Journey To The West but it seems really long.
Maybe I'll try the abridged version and see if it's easier to make headway with. Or I could watch Monkey I guess.
Weird how it's actually a Japanese show. I thought it'd be Chinese, but I noticed they were speaking Japanese.
edited 5th Nov '12 5:18:31 PM by UltimatelySubjective
"Nullius addictus iurare in verba magistri, quo me cumque rapit tempestas, deferor hospes."
I am now a shiny stone~
One of the stories that sticks out most is Wukong getting trolled by the Buddha and defeated.
In particular there's some Asian comic retellings where the Buddha disguises his palm as a platform with pillars, and Wukong goes and makes water and even draws graffiti. No wonder the Buddha stuck him under a rock for a few hundred years.
The three finest things in life are to splat your enemies, drive them from their turf, and hear their lamentations as their rank falls!
Okay I will try not to make my other posts too long. Anyway I also thought the Journey to the West was long when I read it, but I went on read it for four months. Although I will take a look at the 'Monkey' TV Series as well to see if I like it or not.
In a couple of adaptation I do not think there were enough justifications unlike in the orignal novel for imprison Wukong in the Five Finger Mountain such as Heavenly Legends and 'Monkey, Monk, and the Monsters Go West' as they just did this to go along with the original story not to mention the Chinese deities as if you read the original you would notice some difference in the situations as a lesser punishment could have been in place and 'Monkey, Monk, and the Monsters Go West' it seems to me that the deities are more at fault than Wukong. In Saiyuki Gaiden there really isn't any justifcations at all since Wukong was in a berserk state, which he had no control over and their were several alterative like train him to control he power as Guanyin stronger than him and should be able to train him.
Here are some Journey to the West adaptations with English subtitles. This are the movies Princess Iron Fan 1941, Havoc in Heaven, Monkey Go West,Princess Iron Fan 1966, Cave of the Silken Webs, The Land of Many Perfumes, Red Boy 1975,Heavenly Legends,A Chinese Tall Story, and The Fire Ball.
Here are the television adaptations, which are Journey to the West 1986 TV series Journey to the West 1986 TV series, Journey to the West 1996 TV series, Monkey Magic, Monkey King: Quest for Sutras Monkey King: Quest for the Sutras, Journey to the West: Legends of the Monkey King, Journey to the West 2010 TV series, The Lost Empire, Monkey, Monk, and the Monsters Go West. This Lostus Lantern adaptation has Wukong, Bajie, Niumowang, Tieshan Gongzhu, Yumian Gongzhu, and Hong hai'er in it although is focus more on the protagonist in that Chinese Myth, which is Erlang Shen's nephew Chenxiang.
There is also a short cartoon featuring Wukong, Sanzang, and Hong hai'er called the The Lost Boy, Hong hai'er.
I am interested in watching the older of the Journey to the West adaptations as well.
There are some Such as Son Goku of Enoken, Monkey King and the Imps, How Princess Iron Fan Burnt Down the Heavenly Gate, How Scarlet Boy Rescued His Mother from the Dragon King Palace, but it is hard to find the full movies on the internet. I only found a clip of Son Goku of Enoken, and How Princess Iron Fan Burnt Down the Heavenly Gate
There is also this manhua called The Great Saint King, which a comic book adaptation of the 'Journey to the West' I wanted to read, but I going to have to interpret it as I am still trying to master Chinese as it has not been translated to English.
I am sorry that some of the links do not work as the website blocked some of them and they have to be copy and paste to the URL instead.
Edit: I watched the first episode of 'Monkey' and it left out somethings at was at the beginning of the book so it should not be a replace series for someone to read instead of the book. None of the Journey to the West series I saw are identical to the book, which is a good thing to me. Even the Journey to the West (1986 TV series) was a near-identical adaptation.
edited 17th Nov '12 8:34:09 PM by Mika
The Journey to the West page assumes that all humans are powerless, when in other classic Chinese novels like 'Investiture of the Gods' have shown humans characters with magical powers. Also many of the human characters from the 'Investiture of the Gods' had magical power became gods at the end of the story.
Here is an example on the page that applied all humans are powerless.
There is also this on the character page.
. It is just that Xuanzang does not want to kill under any circumstances because he is an Actual Pacifist. Just like any other belief systems Buddhism has Martial Pacifists and Technical Pacifists who choose to use violence and even killing for justified means as well as and Actual Pacifist who refuse to resort to any sort of violence at all, and there are those who choose to disregard the teachings of there respective belief system.
edited 27th Nov '12 5:19:47 PM by Mika
teacher, interpreter, guide
It seems to have been over a year since the last posts on this topic, too bad. I'm on here to let anybody who see this know two things — one is that Hollywood guy Michael Wehrhahn and a couple of other Hollywood heavyweights have teamed up with some Chinese producers / artists to make what is looking to be a dynamite 3D movie version of Xi You Ji, to be released on January 31st 2014 (it is January 3rd 2014 here in Tokyo as of this writing).
This project seems impressive because Wehrhahn seems determined to make the authentic story based on the original book, he plans to do it with an all Chinese heritage cast and will make it a trilogy. No 'Forbidden Kingdom' style changes, and no cheap, inexperienced knock off effects — this is a hugely budgeted production that has some Hollywood experts supervising the CGI. Also, he plans to have two versions of each of the three movies — one in Mandarin for audiences familiar with the story and one in English for newbies to the story like so many Americans tend to be. This film has been delayed countless times over two years, no telling if it'll be delayed this time too but I doubt it as all the websites, Facebook pages and Twitter pages are live right now.
Wehrhahn says the delays are due to the complexities involved in making a great classic like this available to lots of countries with different sensibilities / cultural understandings. I totally understand this.
I have seen a number of adaptations, but I am a huge fan of the 1986 CCTV production with Liu Shao Ling Tong, the 1978 Japan production with Masaaki Sakai, and the 1996 TVB production with Dickie Cheung. Xi You Ji is a story that requires three things — good written adaptation, a well chosen main cast who are attractive and can deliver unique performances, and great music scoring. Finding all three in a visual production is rare even now, and there's no telling how Wehrhahn's movie trilogy will fare with Donnie Yen as Sun Wu Kung. I think it will have to at least stand up to the 1986 CCTV version, which I think is still the greatest in all three areas I mentioned.
The other thing is Wehrhahn has a new social network dedicated to fans of The Monkey King and any versions of Xi You Ji people like, to get us fans more together in one place and energize this amazing story. It's not live yet, but surely will be once the movie release date gets nearer. The link: http://monkeykingsocial.com/ Hope to see you guys on this site or at the theater! <3
edited 3rd Jan '14 1:31:05 AM by Karrenola
Yo, reading / seeing 西遊記, who's afraid of that?!
Hm, just found the book while cleaning up the bookshelf. I don't remember anything from the book. It's been six years since I first read it and I remember I never finished it.
teacher, interpreter, guide
Hi Knightof NASA, so glad you found the book. Who is the translator, Arthur Waley maybe? That is the first version I read for my college graduation thesis. It is an excellent introduction to the story, but includes only the most famous chapters and with very few notes to help you understand the times and concepts.
If you are intrepid, and the fact that you appreciate NASA demonstrates you have some serious abilities, I think you would do well to buy or borrow the most recent translation from 1981 by Professor Anthony C. Yu. It's in four volumes with notes, it is the only complete English translation of Xi You Ji in existence today and is extremely well translated in my opinion.
If this is too daunting for now, please have a look at this 30 minute video which gives a great overview of the story and why it's so enduring. Professor Yu is also in it explaining the many significant points of the work. http://www.learner.org/courses/worldlit/journey-to-the-west/watch/
I hope it encourages you to either read it or see what I now think is the easiest to digest and funniest modern adaptation of the work, Hong Kong TV's Xi You Ji - Journey to the West starring Dicky Cheung, 1996. Here is the 1996 series, covering the first half of the adventures, uploaded for streaming by a group calling themselves Fansubs. These people have voluntarily, painstakingly subtitled all the dialogue in the best English they could, and even included notes to help viewers with the old Chinese concepts and modern Cantonese jokes, something the DV Ds (which I bought) do not have. They've done a super job. If this is your first time to see an adaptation, it's a great way to start, as the music scoring is boss, the writing veers off the original tale yet is superbly creative and well thought out, and the acting, especially Dicky, is awesome. http://www.gooddrama.net/hong-kong-drama/journey-to-the-west-1996
Happy exploring! <3
Yo, reading / seeing 西遊記, who's afraid of that?!
teacher, interpreter, guide
I've just seen all of the 2010 China production of 西遊記 Journey to the West, thanks to the You Tube upload by 電視劇. This is a gorgeous looking TV series with very expensive production values. There are 52 episodes, about 45 minutes each. This is unfortunately without English subs, but it does have subs in Mandarin for those who can understand. I cannot handle Chinese well, Japanese is my forte and that helped somewhat with all the Chinese characters. I also know the story well enough to get through without being lost, but I am sure I missed a lot of good original dialogue.
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I liked:
The actor Fei Zhenxiang (费振翔) as the Monkey King Sun Wu Kong (孙悟空) - VERY impressive, especially his face. VERY expressive, very moving performance. BUT. He doesn't have a lot of Kung Fu ability. He needed all the wires and production values to help him deliver.
All the actors. EVERYONE was good.
The PRODUCTION VALUES were AMAZING! This cost TONS of money I guess, loads of green screens, wires on cranes outside on location HIGH up. Locations included the Forbidden City in Beijing - beautiful! The COSTUMES were AWESOME! The limits on Sun Wu Kong's costumes was a good idea, just two basic costumes for him, his great military general gear/headdress and his monk's traveling clothes, showing how natural Fei's monkey suit was with hairy arms, hands and some chest and back exposed. Very good idea.
The opening and closing theme songs were GOOD. Very modern, fun to sing along and practice Mandarin if you aren't familiar with the language. The opening theme was varied a lot as BGM in some moving scenes.
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I didn't like:
Most of the BGM. It was too western style for my taste, kind of 'John Williams' sounding, like it should be backing up an Indy Jones film or something. It was nice at the end, but I didn't like most of it during the first 50 episodes.
The change in the White Bone Demoness (白骨精) story. They added two lady characters not from the book to the story in the very beginning, a White Bird Demoness (白鹏白翩翩) and a Blue Dragon Queen (青蛟青灵) who were with Sun Wu Kong at the Mountain of Flowers and Fruit. At times they made it seem like they were love interests for Sun Wu Kong, which is definitely not in keeping with his character. They both died in the first War with Heaven, then they each came back, the White Bird as the White Boned Demoness (白骨精) and the Blue Dragon as the Queen of the country of Women (女儿国国王), and they had it so Sun Wu Kong recognized them from their former lives. That was confusing and not well written. It looked like some popular actresses were demanding more screen time so that story arc ended up feeling forced and contrived.
![[awesome]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/minis/award_star_gold_3.png "[awesome]"){kind=small}
The 1986 CCTV China version with Liu Xiao Ling Tong (章金莱) was very lacking in SFX and had much lower production values, but the book-faithful adaptation, the performances AND kung fu abilities of the heavyweights are what carried this production to eternal glory. It and part 2 from 1999 with the original star Liu Xiao Ling Tong are REALLY hard to beat even with lots of big money production values these days. All the music scoring is original and heavenly. This one still rules in my opinon.
The 1996 and 98 Hong Kong TVB production with Dicky Cheung ('96) and Benny Chan ('98) has better production values than the '86 series, but not nearly as good as the 2010 version. The story has been greatly changed as well, I'd say it's the least faithful to the book I've seen so far. BUT. The WAY it was altered very much kept to the spirit of the original, updating it to modern sensitivities. I think the author of the 500 year old work, Wu Cheng'en, would be VERY pleased with this adaptation were he alive to see it. It's well written, VERY well acted especially by the four principal characters, and the music scoring is DYNAMITE. The opening and closing themes have strong hip hop flairs and are both sung by the Sun Wu Kong star Dicky Cheung. The incidental BGM is taken from both themes, from Japanese video game BG Ms by Japanese composers (unbelievable but true) and some pre-existing American compositions as well. Some music is original. All of it is very wonderfully Chinese in sound, Cantonese in attitude and fits the story like a glove. There are English subs available for this version, which are flawed at times but are good enough to really enjoy the tale.
If anybody out there feels like giving the 2010 Xi You Ji version a try, here it is, starting from episode 1. Remember it's only available in Mandarin with Mandarin subtitles. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVOLs8F8IYE
Thanks for reading guys! 谢谢您!
edited 8th Jan '14 6:52:02 AM by Karrenola
Yo, reading / seeing 西遊記, who's afraid of that?!
The Resilient One
I've seen the anime series, but I started off reading the manga.
I read up on Wikipedia about the original tale that inspired the Saiyuki manga, and I've always been a bit fascinated with it. But I never thought I could find an English translation anywhere!
I also heard there's a PS 1 strategy game featuring the story of Journey to the West. I know I'd love it because I'm a fan of Fire Emblem, Advance Wars and FF Tactics.
There's so many adaptations of this story. I always did want to read the original that inspired so many people. I'm even writing something that's very loosely based on Journey to the West.
Even when your hope is gone, move along, move along just to make it through
teacher, interpreter, guide
Interesting comments Misuki. Many newcomers start off like you, manga / animation adaptations here and there. Many Japanese people don't know how lucky they are to have one of the first and best adaptations for television made in their home country, Japan, in Japanese — Saiyuki, or Monkey Magic, starring Masaaki Sakai as Songoku (Sun Wu Kung). This production is from 1978-79, and is basically faithful to the original, with many slick, creative additions / references. It also has DYNAMITE music scoring mostly by the band Godeigo, which interestingly includes lots of English lyrics. It's got young Japanese performers who later became big stars in Japan like Toshiyuki Nishida as Pigsy (Zha Wu Jie) and Akiko Wada performing brilliantly as the White Bone Demoness. This version was dubbed in English and was / still is a big hit with UK audiences, though it never really came to the US.
Even so, the best way to really discover the greatness of this story is by reading the original. There is an excellent Japanese translation with notes. Everyone who takes the time to read the original is thoroughly and forever impressed. I hope you take the time to read it!
Yo, reading / seeing 西遊記, who's afraid of that?!
The Permanently Confused
How old is Journey to the West? It kind of irks me that there isn't a public domain translation of it. Kind of stupid, I know, but none of my local libraries have any of it and I can't afford to grab four volumes right now.
teacher, interpreter, guide
I just bought and saw all 42 episodes of the 1998 Hong Kong TVB series Sai Yau Gei, or Xi You Ji in Mandarin (西遊記 貳).
Internet comments on this series seem to vary from negative to one or two words mentioning the change in the star and nothing about anything else. Obviously something sad happened between the network, TVB, and their star performer Cheung Wai-kin (張衛健), popularly known as Dicky Cheung. It is also obvious that neither the network or the cast/crew were expecting the 1996 show to skyrocket to fame that fast and reach so many people in and outside Hong Kong. The 1996 production was TVB's first to be dubbed in English and to this day is their only one to be so treated. Most fans agree that Dicky carried that whole series almost single-handedly, not only with his trained handling of the monkey king basics but with his soul, expressed though his unique, fantastic face and body expressions. It's too bad TVB didn't offer Dicky the moon, stars and a billion dollars to continue, but at the end of the day it was not to be for series 2 aired two years later.
The second series features Chan Hou-min (陳浩民), popularly known as Benny Chan, in the Sun Wu Kung main role. All the other main stars from '96 returned to reprise their roles in '98. It picks up where '96 left off and goes to the end. So let's start with what's GOOD about this series.
The opening theme, sung by Benny, is TOPS. Very uplifting with traditional and modern elements, including some excellent modulation and complex syncopation. The ending theme, sung by Hung Gin-wa in two versions, is very moving and elicits the feelings of pathos many have when reading about the transparent bottomed boat in the original work. A lot of the excellent incidental BGM comes from this new material and from '96, with Dicky's voice sometimes.
The writing, except for a few spots, is very clever. The Bare Armed Monkey King arc is brilliantly written, very suspenseful and thrilling.
The SFX are much improved from the '96 version.
All actors did their best to carry on despite the gaping hole left by Dicky's departure, but particularly noteworthy were Kingdom Yuen (苑瓊丹) as the Crow Demoness, Joey Leung (梁榮忠) as the Bear Demon, Kwong Wah as the priest Tang Sanzang and Derek Kwok as the fame/ego obsessed Bare Armed Ape in the Serpent Demon Queen arc.
Ms Yuen was HILARIOUS!! Really good, convincing 'mad as hell other woman' performance.
Mr Leung played the pious, misguided Bear Demon with serious STYLE. You really believed nobody could win any kind of argument with him. He was ferocious without ever having to lift a finger. Great performance.
In both the '96 and '98 versions, Kwong played Sanzang with incredible grace and believable blindness. If eyes could kill I would've been very dead after seeing his '96 performance — he has an angry stare that could cut through a bank vault. His awesome performance was the glue that held the whole '98 production together in my opinion.
The thunder-stealer was Kwok Chi-kin (郭子健), or Derek Kwok, as one of the Four Extraordinary Monkeys gone bad. The writer, obviously well versed in the original work, mixed some stories and added original segments to create this long arc, which went through the last 12 episodes at least. Derek was properly trained by TVB experts and displayed the kind of natural ability that Dicky became famed for. His face and body language spoke volumes, he had all the emotions at his fingertips. He could be LMAO hilarious or scare the chilly hell out of you. His Kung Fu ability is real and rarely needed a stunt double, Benny was always far away when Derek was swinging on the scene. He's taller than most of the other heavies and his handsome face shows through all the layers of makeup. This guy, together with the very able actress who played the Serpent Queen who loved him no limit, was the life of the '98 party. If you watch this version just to see Derek it's totally worth it.
The costumes chosen for Sun Wu Kung were very nice, especially the classic colors of cuckoo feather green and eggplant purple. The costumes for the pig Zhu Ba Jie were in three lovely layers of wide flowing fabric, in at least three different combinations of very beautiful Chinese colors and patterns. The skilled actor playing him, Wayne Lai, really made you look when he sashayed off complaining somewhere raising his finger in disgust.
Now for the GOOD/BAD.
Benny as Sun Wu Kung. Yeah I know, he was coming after an impossible act to follow. The desperation of the network was very apparent. Benny also came with a lot less training than Dicky, he was slow with virtually no Kung Fu. He lacked a lot of the elements of 'monkey feel' such as the angry spitting and restless animal twitches. BUT. He wasn't bad, folks. If he hadn't had Dicky to follow he would've gotten a good amount of fame I think. Some of the writing really brought out Benny's ability to convey the character through his own, like in the scenes with the magic cow bell bracelet. The only reason I see for the lack in his dramatic ability (the scene after his release from the golden symbols where he reminisces with Sanzang)is that Dicky came first and set the bar way high. If you see '98 before '96 you'll be very happy with Benny I think.
Now for the BAD.
The script relied rather heavily on flashbacks using scenes from '96 with Dicky, from the back or cutting out the face of course.
The writing included scenes where demons already killed by Dicky's version of Sun Wu Kung came back to life to befriend Benny's version along with the other three pilgrims. The actors/actresses playing the Spider Demoness En En and her mother, the White Bone Demoness and a couple of others were like 'Hey, how ya doin', long time no see' for some segments that were senseless and stupid. There were a number of continuity errors too.
The series ended at seeing Thunderclap Temple in the Western Paradise across the river, nothing afterward. I guess anything more might've been too much drama for Benny.
This series, combined with the '96 version, makes a total of 72 episodes, which happens to be the total number of Sun Wu Kung's transformations. That's kind of nice. All in all, I think both versions are worth watching even if you've never read the original book before. Very enjoyable, very colorful with some really great moments. Both parts go down in history as two of the most cleverly created television adaptations of the original work ever made.
teacher, interpreter, guide
Hi Corr,
The original work by Wu Cheng'en is nearly 500 years old. I used to wonder why the much older Chinese classic Art of War is available for free in the public domain yet Xi You Ji (Journey to the West)is not, until I realized that Art of War was translated into English maybe over 100 years ago, putting that version squarely into public domain. The first accurate translation of Xi You Ji was done in 1942 by the late great Arthur Waley. This translation of the most famous parts of the work was my first exposure to this story in college. I was a Japan major, but this book so moved me I ended up doing my graduation thesis on it. It is just one volume called simply Monkey.
The Waley translation should be in the public library nearest you, it is of course available in paperback / ebook format http://www.amazon.com/Monkey-Novel-China-Wu-Cheng-en/dp/0802130860/ref=sr_sp-atf_title_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1390727727&sr=1-1&keywords=monkey+arthur+waley .
I doubt it will be in the public domain anytime soon as I believe the copyright hasn't yet expired on it. It is worth every penny you spend to buy it though. Waley was a scholar who had the gift of seeing both China and Japan with his heart more than with his eyes, his translation captures the spirit and soul of the original work in very fluent, beautiful prose. He took a hard, wooden English translation and made it almost as beautiful as the silk tapestry of the original Chinese work.
Yes, those four huge volumes that make up Dr. Anthony Yu's first complete translation of Xi You Ji set me back over $100 bucks, in paperback no less. That's one buck for each of the 100 chapters that make up the original work and this translation. But they are my treasures, as I specialize in this story. These beat Waley in the areas of completeness and in coverage of the Chinese meanings / cultural understandings of the day. They do not beat Waley in prose and delivery of the spirit of the story.
I think for your first experience with Xi You Ji you'll be very pleased with the Waley version.
@Karren: Thanks. What I have is the original Chinese book. I've seen the (not Saiyuki or Dragon Ball) animation adaption, which I think was very good.
This is a thread to discuss Journey to the West and related media, and also help introduce new readers.
And in the spirit of "introducing new readers," I've compiled this list of available English editions, as well as adaptations:
English Editions of the Original Novel
translated by Arthur Waley (this one is abridged, but a good read nonetheless). 
translated by W.J.F. Jenner (of the two complete translations, this is my favorite) 
by Anthony C. Yu
Monkey: Folk Novel of China
Journey to the West in Four Volumes
another four-volume Journey to the West
Video Game Adaptations
. Simple platform game whose main character is based on Sun Wukong 
. It's like Final Fantasy Tactics but with the plot and characters of Saiyuki.
Son Son by Capcom - Available on this
Saiyuki: Journey West by Koei - available on Playstation
Notable Live-Action Adaptations
, starring Jackie Chan, takes some elements from the story but isn't a direct adaptation. 
, which is Chinese in origin but was popular in Britain. I have never seen this series.
The Forbidden Kingdom
Monkey
Noteworthy Animated Adaptations
(Note: I will not include Dragon Ball)
Alakazam the Great
- An English dub of a Saiyuki movie. It's still pretty watchable, but not the best adaptation I've seen. Note that the DVD linked may be a bootleg, but there are plenty of legit VHS versions, and it sometimes plays on Showtime. 
- Basically covers the first eight or so chapters of the story (from Monkey's birth until his imprisonment). I remember liking this one in my late teens, but haven't seen it since. There's apparently also a Playstation game of this one. 
- The story reimagined with emo characters and a more sci-fi setting. I'm only just getting into this one so you all probably know more than I do.
Monkey Magic
Gensomaden Saiyuki
Hope this gives newcomers a leg-up.
Everyone else: Discuss!
edited 13th May '12 7:51:05 AM by MoeDantes
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