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Real Life section maintenance (including NRLEP and LRLEO) (New Crowner 9/20/25)

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Note: If a newly launched trope was already given a No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only designation while it was being drafted on the Trope Launch Pad, additions to the proper index do not need to go through this thread. Instead, simply ask the staff to add the trope via this thread.

This is the thread to report tropes with problematic Real Life sections.

Common problems include:

Real Life sections on the wiki are kept as long as they don't become a problem. If you find an article with such problems, report it here. Please note that the purpose of this thread is to clean up and maintain real life sections, not raze them. Cutting should be treated as a last resort, so please only suggest cutting RL sections or a subset thereof you think the examples in question are completely unsalvageable.

If historical RL examples are not causing any problems, consider whether it would be better to propose a No Recent Examples, Please! (via this forum thread) for RL instead of NRLEP. If RL examples are causing problems only for certain subjects, consider whether a Limited Real Life Examples Only restriction would be preferable to NRLEP.

If you think a trope should be No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only, then this thread is the place to discuss it. However, please check Keep Real Life Examples first to see if it has already been brought up in the past. If not, state the reasons and add it to the crowner.

Before adding to the crowner:

  • The trope should be proposed in the thread, along with reasons for why a crowner is necessary instead of a cleanup.
  • There must be support from others in thread.
  • Any objections should be addressed.
  • Allow a minimum of 24 hours for discussion.

When adding to the crowner:

  • Be sure to add the trope name, a link to where the discussion started, the reasons for crownering, whether the restriction being proposed is NRLEP or LRLEO (and in the latter case, which subject(s) the restriction would be for), and the date added.
  • Announce in thread that you are adding the item.
  • An ATT advert should be made as well (batch items together if more than one trope goes up in a day).

In order for a crowner to pass:

  • Must have been up for a minimum of a week
  • There must be a 2:1 ratio
  • If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple extra days to see if any more votes come in
  • Once passed, tropes must be indexed on the appropriate NRLEP or LRLEO index
  • Should the vote fail, the trope should be indexed on KRLE page

Sex Tropes, Rape and Sexual Harassment Tropes, and Morality Tropes are banned from having RL sections so tropes under those indexes don't need a crowner vote.

As per Real Life Troping, we never trope unscripted real life sports — so sports tropes where RL examples would only apply to those scenarios don't need a crowner vote.

Crowner entries that have already been called will have "(CLOSED)" appended to them — and are no longer open for discussion.

After bringing up a trope for discussion, please wait at least a day for feedback before adding it to the crowner.

NRLEP tag:

%% Trope was declared Administrivia/NoRealLifeExamplesPlease via crowner by the Real Life Maintenance thread: [crowner link]
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800

LRLEO tag:

%% Trope was declared Administrivia/LimitedRealLifeExamplesOnly via crowner by the Real Life Maintenance thread: [crowner link]
%%The following restrictions apply: [list restriction(s) here]
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800

Notes:
  • This thread is not for general discussion regarding policies for Real Life sections or crowners. Please take those conversations to this Wiki Talk thread.
  • Do not try to overturn previous No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only decisions without a convincing argument.
  • As mentioned here, the consensus is that NRLEP warnings in trope page descriptions can use bold text so that they stand out.
  • The [[noreallife]] tag no longer works. This is a deprecated tag that was introduced many years ago — originally, it would have displayed a NRLEP warning banner when you edited the page. Per word of admin as of 2025, any replacement for this system will not use markup, so these tags can be removed.
  • If a newly launched trope was already given a No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only designation while it was being drafted on the Trope Launch Pad, additions to the proper index do not need to go through this thread. Instead, simply ask the staff to add the trope via this thread.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 3rd 2025 at 6:31:00 AM

Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#10501: Nov 22nd 2021 at 8:20:13 PM

Should real-life extreme-right "news" channel One America News Network be added to Alphabet News Network? I am unsure if it would invoke ROCEJ, given the channel's controversial views.

Edited by Nen_desharu on Nov 22nd 2021 at 11:24:43 AM

Kirby is awesome.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#10502: Nov 22nd 2021 at 8:26:51 PM

I mean, referencing that something exists isn't ROCEJ...

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#10503: Nov 22nd 2021 at 8:36:06 PM

[up]Should I go ahead then? How should it be worded to be neutral, while noting that it has many controversial viewpoints?

Edited by Nen_desharu on Nov 22nd 2021 at 11:37:31 AM

Kirby is awesome.
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#10504: Nov 22nd 2021 at 8:40:57 PM

Why would you have to mention its viewpoints at all? The trope is about the naming scheme.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#10505: Nov 22nd 2021 at 8:42:14 PM

Yeah, their stances are completely irrelevant to the trope, however controversial they may be.

Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#10506: Nov 22nd 2021 at 8:45:47 PM

Is this good:

Kirby is awesome.
mightymewtron Word Up from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Word Up
#10507: Nov 22nd 2021 at 9:33:03 PM

I'd say just call it "Far-right news channel" (objectively true) instead of linking to The Moral Substitute.

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#10508: Nov 22nd 2021 at 9:39:52 PM

I’d say to cut real life examples without a citation that it’s deliberately modeled after CNN for whatever reason, otherwise it’s chairs.

Edited by TheLivingDrawing on Nov 23rd 2021 at 12:57:52 PM

Once Upon A Time.
Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#10509: Nov 22nd 2021 at 9:46:31 PM

[up][up]Added

Kirby is awesome.
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#10510: Nov 23rd 2021 at 2:36:55 AM

I have to agree with Drawing, actually.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Nov 23rd 2021 at 5:37:08 AM

Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
#10511: Nov 23rd 2021 at 9:28:29 PM

[up]That is a fair point.

I would like to have more opinions before we cull real-life examples from Alphabet News Network, especially without any explicit references to CNN.

Edited by Nen_desharu on Nov 23rd 2021 at 12:29:46 PM

Kirby is awesome.
GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#10512: Nov 28th 2021 at 2:22:19 AM

I agree with TheLivingDrawing that those "real life examples" are Chairs. "Abbreviations written in alphabet-based writing systems are written with letters" provides no meaningful information.

In contrast, Fun with Acronyms is about abbreviations whose letters spell out something catchy and/or funny

Edited by GastonRabbit on Nov 28th 2021 at 4:23:49 AM

I got a rock for Halloween.
GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#10513: Nov 30th 2021 at 8:58:11 AM

Has anyone compiled a list of proposed crowner entries?

I got a rock for Halloween.
nw09 Since: Apr, 2018
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#10515: Nov 30th 2021 at 1:43:26 PM

I think so.

Noting here that I removed Badass Beard and Badass Mustache from NoRealLife.Too Common since they're no longer tropes.

GastonRabbit C'est la vie. (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
C'est la vie. (he/him)
#10516: Dec 1st 2021 at 7:19:22 AM

So, this ATT query brought up an agenda-based edit on the main Hope Spot page in addition to a buttload of other questionable edits on other pages, and I'm starting to question whether Hope Spot should even allow real life examples. (At the very least, maybe a time limit for real life examples.)

Edited by GastonRabbit on Dec 1st 2021 at 9:20:39 AM

I got a rock for Halloween.
Albert3105 Since: Jun, 2013
#10517: Dec 1st 2021 at 8:44:18 AM

Hope Spot is a pre-scripted plot trope that must be deliberately used by an author for dramatic purposes. By definition, real-life examples are outside its scope. We've sacked the real-life section of Darkest Hour for similar reasons.

Edited by Albert3105 on Dec 1st 2021 at 11:45:15 AM

TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#10518: Dec 1st 2021 at 10:47:09 AM

Does anyone else ever get the impression that perhaps Real Life examples are more trouble than they’re worth and perhaps they should be cut entirely?

Once Upon A Time.
Cutegirl920fire Player 222 from the Squid Games (Five Long Years) Relationship Status: Paris holds the key to my heart
Player 222
#10519: Dec 1st 2021 at 10:51:07 AM

[up] Not entirely. There are numerous tropes with IRL examples that don't cause too much trouble like Nice Hat for example. I think negativity bias might be affecting your opinion.

CG for short
WarJay77 It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000) from My Writing Cave (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
It's NaNo, Bay-beeee! (8,356/50,000)
#10520: Dec 1st 2021 at 10:55:39 AM

The issue isn't the concept of RL examples so much as the people who try and shoehorn them everywhere.

Working on: Author Appeal | Sandbox | Troper Wall
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#10521: Dec 2nd 2021 at 2:45:13 PM

I have some ROCEJ concerns about the Sins of Our Fathers.

    Real Life 
  • Unfortunately common in the real world, as generations of Hatfields and McCoys and other families around the world who carried down feuds through generations can attest.
  • The effects of wars can last for quite a long time, sometime forming part of the justification for a later war, or leading to one or both sides continuing to nurse resentment long after combat ends. The American Civil War had economic effects that continue to linger. The South was already at a severe economic disadvantage by most metrics when the war began, but the Total War policies that brought it to a close devastated much of the existing industry and predatory practices after the war exacerbated the effects. To this day, former Confederate states are generally behind the rest of the country in economic and health statistics, though other factors have come into play by now, and there is considerable lingering resentment in the South at their situation. It's the proximate cause of the infamous Hatfield-McCoy feud, since the families fought on opposite sides in the war, with a legal dispute later sparking decades of bloodshed.
  • The Transatlantic Slave Trade. Quite often, an apology is made which goes something along the lines of "I'm sorry that my great-grandfather enslaved your great-grandfather." Understandably so, as this is the truth, though this practice has morphed in recent years to more about civil rights treatments, which many still feel aren't completely equal. Unfortunately, this has become Flame Bait because of differing opinions on whose fault everything seems to be.
    • One specific aspect of this that crops up from time to time is the idea of "reparations". It's a rather controversial topic, as trying to figure out who owes what to whom is an effectively impossible task.
  • The punishment for high treason in Imperial China is referred to as the "nine exterminations" — execution of the criminal along with all of his relatives down to the ninth degree (by Chinese reckoning).
    • Execution of relatives to the third, fifth, and seventh degree was eventually added (and taken up by some other East Asian countries as well, such as Vietnam, Korea, and Japan). There was even a case of tenth degree executions, the only officially designated example of such: Reportedly, Fang Xiaoru (the guilty party) indulged in Tempting Fate and Smite Me, O Mighty Smiter by saying he was fine with a tenth-degree execution. The Yongle Emperor Zhu Di (who charged Fang with lèse-majesté for calling him a usurper, which is a death-penalty crime) note  got pissed off and decided to grant the wish. In addition to Fang, his blood relations and their spouses were killed along with all of his students and peers as the 10th group. 873 people are said to have been executed in all.
    • Vietnam's most notable case only extended to the third degree: In 1442, Nguyễn Trãi (a founding father of the Lê dynasty who had fallen out of favor) was made an Un-person and executed with three generations of his family after he and his wife were charged with murdering Emperor Lê Thái Tông. It was revoked after Emperor Lê Thánh Tông absolved him. note  Nguyễn Thị Lộ, Nguyễn Trãi's wife, who stayed up all night with the Emperor on the night he died, was never officially pardoned by the court. She was painted as a Lady Macbeth by feudal historians. This lasted until 2004 when a comprehensive account of her position in the affair was published and completely exonerated her of murder.
  • Attainder is an old English legal concept where parliament passes a bill to execute a political enemy, as well as strip them of their titles and lands. Attainder also worked a corruption of blood, such that nothing could pass from the attained to their heirs or pass through the attained, such that later inheritances would skip their family. This was so abused in the English Civil War that the US Constitution specifically bans it. It's since also been abolished in both England and Wales.
  • Even 70 years after World War II ended, current German citizens still have to deal with their nation being mocked (and in some cases, hated) by other countries due to the actions of the Nazis, but fortunately it is fading out ever so slowly.
    • Perhaps worse if you're Japanese, which is why they tend to pretend the whole thing never happened. Sino-Japanese and Korean-Japanese relations still suffer from this, especially what the Japanese did in cities like Nanking (e.g. lined up the locals to see how many heads they could chop off before tiring). This is less prevalent in Southeast Asia, though, despite having suffered their own share of atrocities.
    • Italian relationships with Libya, Croatia, and Slovenia suffer from the war crimes of Fascist Italy against them...and the retaliation the Yugoslav Partisans took on Italian civilians when the tide turned.
    • After formerly occupied countries were liberated, people took to punishing children fathered by Germans with local women for their years of suffering during the war — children of the so-called "Lebensborn" program set up by the SS, for example, became especially popular targets, since all of the people who actually were responsible for their ordeals were already dead, incarcerated, or walking the streets of Germany as free men. Such children tended to be ostracized and heaped with absolutely horrific abuse, and this was openly encouraged by the governments of said countries, who remain largely unapologetic to this day. Understandably, many of these unfortunate children grew up very bitter and angry, over being punished for having the audacity to be born.
    • Also in formerly occupied countries, there's some bad blood between the descendants of locals who served in the German or Italian army or administration (or those of their puppet regimes) and those who joined resistance movements (and these are sometimes further divided — for example, some countries had both a communist and a monarchist resistance that fought each other as well as the Axis).
  • When it comes to the Red Terror and its atrocities (like Holodomor) many are aware of the Russians, and some claim that the Jews were a high percentage of the Communist revolutionaries (they were actually a small percentage, but anti-semitic theories then and now say differently).
  • In North Korea, an offense that results in exile to a prison camp means not only the offender being sent off but also their entire family. Not only that, but any children born in a prison camp remain there for life, as do their children. 60 Minutes interviewed a defector who had been born in a labor camp, to parents imprisoned there due to his grandfather's supposed offenses, which occurred in The Korean War.
  • When Norway wished to celebrate their bicentennial as a "free nation", the Norwegian government invited the Danish monarch, who gladly obliged, and the Swedish monarch, who refused to attend the celebration. Why? Because his great-great-great-great grandfather was the Swedish king-to-be who didn't quite get around to accepting the Norwegian constitution in the first place. The story shows that after six generations of Swedish kings, and a successful Scandinavian partnership, Sweden hadn't forgiven completely. When the Swedish king changed his mind, it was after some public pressure from forces in the Swedish society who decided that bygones -- after all -- were bygones.
  • Arnold Schwarzenegger received some harassment when it was revealed his father had been a member of the Nazi Party and SA. It ended when the Simon Wiesenthal Center did some research and showed there was no evidence of his father committing any atrocities (not that he would have any control over it either way).
  • Almost a thousand years on, Muslim extremists continue to use the Crusades as an excuse to hate Christians and the West, while radical atheists still harp on them as an example of Christian hypocrisy and wrongdoing, far, far past the point where the identities of the majority of people actually involved have already been lost to history. On the counter side, many Westerners aren't willing to forgive the Muslim world for the consecutive invasions and dominion of Europe prior to the crusades and for the Arab slave trade. Further, the Shiites still bear a grudge for their defeat at the hands of the Sunnis early in Islamic history, with annual holidays mourning them to this day, along with their martyred leaders being lionized.
  • A general rule of law is that children cannot be forced to pay the debts of their parents after their parent has died (although the children may be out of a portion, or all, of their parent's inheritance as a result). However, that doesn't stop creditors from coming after children and trying to convince the children that they do have to pay for their deceased parent's debts and convince the children to sign agreements that put them on the hook.
  • Children of stateless parents (i.e. people without citizenship) are usually themselves stateless, meaning they have difficulty getting any kind of visa to enter or leave countries. However, statelessness outside of birth is often due to discrimination, the dissolution of whatever nation the parent was a part of, some legal circumstance that disqualifies a person for citizen, or some other happenstance outside of the control of the stateless parents, although sometimes it is for their own acts (such as renouncing their original citizenship without having another citizenship lined up).
  • It is an ongoing controversy among the anti-abortion community whether an exception can be made to abort children when their conception is due to rape so as to spare the victim further trauma from being reminded of the harm done to her, or if doing so is unjustly punishing the innocent child for the father's undeniably heinous crime. (hidden text: It's never brought up that if a woman raped a man and got pregnant, she could claim the child was conceived due to rape.)
  • NASCAR driver Conor Daly was dropped by his sponsors in 2018 after it emerged that his father, himself a former NASCAR driver, had used a racial profanity three decades earlier.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 2nd 2021 at 7:28:56 AM

TheLivingDrawing Lucas the Dreamer from The Town of Clayton Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Lucas the Dreamer
#10522: Dec 2nd 2021 at 4:27:04 PM

[up] Burn it.

Edited by TheLivingDrawing on Dec 2nd 2021 at 7:27:13 AM

Once Upon A Time.
DialgaX Since: Jan, 2001
#10523: Dec 3rd 2021 at 2:27:15 PM

So, Look Ma, No Plane! got listed as NRLP stating that it is "Impossible in Real Life" but from what I see the basic trope is "someone flying alongside a plane using either a jetpack or superpowers".

I found these two examples of just that. Granted, they are performed as part of an airshow or a stunt promotion but it seems pretty close to the trope.

namra Since: Sep, 2021
#10524: Dec 3rd 2021 at 9:47:46 PM

I'm not sure if anyone has brought this up, but Would Be Rude to Say "Genocide" has some serious real life example issues. Namely some of the examples are either complaining or flat out bashing on other countries. It literally reeks of ROCEJ violations in my opinion.

Edited by namra on Dec 3rd 2021 at 9:48:38 AM

BoltDMC Since: May, 2020
#10525: Dec 4th 2021 at 1:46:41 AM

[up][up][up][up] Agreed. Torch it.

[up][up] This would need to be submitted as a crowner to have status changed. And the example as it stands is incorrectly indented.

[up] Agreed, that should be NRLEP. You might want to post this to the ROCEJ thread to get removal support. I say yes to get rid of the whole thing on that thinking alone.

Edited by BoltDMC on Dec 4th 2021 at 1:48:22 AM

Projects: Long Term/Perpetual: Real Life Section Maintenance
20th Sep '25 9:57:50 AM

Crown Description:

Vote UP to cut real life examples; vote DOWN to keep.

Anything marked DONE has been resolved.

In order for a crowner to pass:

  • Must have been up for a minimum of a week
  • There must be a 2:1 ratio
  • If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple extra days to see if any more votes come in
  • Once passed, tropes must be indexed on the appropriate NRLEP or LRLEO index
  • Should the vote fail, the trope should be indexed on KRLE page

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