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Getting informed about Wiki events needs to be easier

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ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#26: Apr 18th 2012 at 3:15:32 PM

The other problem with the announcements thread is not everybody knows about it. If something big is going to happen that will effect everyone, then everyone should know, not just the people who read the fora.
Yeah, but it's a good place to leave large chunks of text (unlike headlines) and since it's locked, announcements won't get lost.

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#27: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:06:03 PM

It's been suggested before that notices about large wiki events be mass PMd to every editor before they happen.

I'm pro that idea, for the record.

edited 18th Apr '12 4:06:22 PM by polutropon

ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#28: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:13:55 PM

I'd rather have an up-to-date announcements thread. Easier to show to anybody who might be asking, and it will always be there.

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#29: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:15:30 PM

They ain't mutually exclusive.

ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#30: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:17:35 PM

If everybody gets unexpected PMs, I imagine a lot of people will make threads to ask about stuff. It happens. Will probably happen moreso if every single account gets a PM notification like that. It'll look out of the blue to some people, and those who don't know how to find anything will likely just tsart a thread to ask.

edited 18th Apr '12 4:19:28 PM by ThatHuman

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#31: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:21:50 PM

You're talking as if people knowing that something is happening is a bad thing.

We want people to know what's going on. People knowing what's going on is a good thing.

(As a practical matter, the hypothetical PM could include a link to an official thread for the topic.)

ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#32: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:36:32 PM

I don't like getting mass PMs about things I already know, or don't care to know. Seriously, there's probably a lot of people who only do minor stuff like spelling and grammar, whose editing won't be affected by policy change. And anyway, how will a mass PM be less problematic than headline announcements have been? From what I can tell, headline announcements have caused prblems, and it's not just due to their shortness.

edited 18th Apr '12 4:38:20 PM by ThatHuman

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#33: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:38:40 PM

It's not 'mass' to you or any other individual. It's singular. One click and it's gone. grin

The only problem we've had with headlines is that nobody writes them and nobody reads them. PMs should be 'like headlines, but they work'.

edited 18th Apr '12 4:39:01 PM by polutropon

ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#34: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:42:40 PM

I'm pretty sure I've seen a moderator or two commetn that mass announcements give rise to problems.

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#35: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:44:16 PM

That moderator should definitely speak up.

feotakahari Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer from Looking out at the city Since: Sep, 2009
Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer
#36: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:45:55 PM

^ The statement has repeatedly been that informing everyone causes everyone to panic. The counterargument has repeatedly been that not informing everyone causes them to panic slightly later, when they find out a garbled version of the changes on their own.

That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awful
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#37: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:47:07 PM

[up][up] First page of this thread, this post. Mass announcements might make things seem like a bigger deal than they actually are, and confuse/worry people who aren't actually affected.

edited 18th Apr '12 4:47:57 PM by ThatHuman

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feotakahari Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer from Looking out at the city Since: Sep, 2009
Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer
#38: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:50:33 PM

^ Pretty much everyone who uses the wiki was affected by either the porn purge (which could potentially purge a lot of stuff that isn't actually porn) or the nightmare fuel purge (since so many works had nightmare fuel pages.)

That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awful
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#39: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:53:29 PM

[up] Well, not everybody does edits audience reactions, and there are lots of works entirely unaffected by this porn issue. For me, Nightmare Fuel pages have been "stuff I'm not gonna look at anyway".

edited 18th Apr '12 4:54:13 PM by ThatHuman

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#40: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:54:25 PM

@That Human The first page of that thread you linked to is nothing but people painfully reinventing the 'PM to logged-in editors' idea.

This should go with out saying, but I fully oppose any 'the proletarians don't need to know' type arguments. This site needs to trust its editors more, not lock them out of the loop.

Ironeye Cutmaster-san from SoCal Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
Cutmaster-san
#41: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:55:42 PM

The porn purge will get announced once all the tech is ready for the council (i.e. when the influx of panicky people can actually appeal cuts instead of spam all relevant threads about how it isn't fair that they can't do anything about it). As for Nightmare Fuel...I actually don't know why that one wasn't headlined. The fix only took a few minutes, so it's not like there was time for a bunch of pointless whining to gum up the works and drown out any useful feedback.

I'm bad, and that's good. I will never be good, and that's not bad. There's no one I'd rather be than me.
ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#42: Apr 18th 2012 at 4:58:52 PM

[up][up] It's not exactly locking anyone out of the loop since everything can be found somewhere. There's no such active suppression of info. Administrivia pages get updated accordingly, and so on.

edited 18th Apr '12 5:00:26 PM by ThatHuman

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#43: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:00:27 PM

Rather than not communicating what the wiki is doing, we should communicate what the wiki is doing. Communicating what the wiki is doing is a good thing.

ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#44: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:03:58 PM

This stuff is not exactly "hidden". If anyone needs to be updated on wiki issues, they'd have found a way themselves. And people who don't care would only be bothered when they get PMs. And anyway, do other wikis leave a notice for every single person every time a major change happens? For MediaWiki sites, that would be like having a bot go to every single User Talk page and leave a notice. I'm pretty sure other wikis at most have a little announcement section, and doesn't force the information upon everybody with an account.

edited 18th Apr '12 5:06:05 PM by ThatHuman

something
feotakahari Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer from Looking out at the city Since: Sep, 2009
Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer
#45: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:04:59 PM

^^^^ The sooner they're informed, the more time they have to stop being panicky people and start being prepared people. The more prepared people we have, the less likely it is that a good page will be cut due to bad arguments made in haste.

^ Every single person I've informed about this change has wanted to know about it. Most have been angry they weren't informed sooner.

edited 18th Apr '12 5:05:41 PM by feotakahari

That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awful
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#46: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:05:23 PM

[up][up]This is demonstrably untrue; quite a few of the threads on this very page demonstrate that it is untrue.

And yes, a mass PM is the default way of letting editors know what's what on other wikis.

edited 18th Apr '12 5:06:04 PM by polutropon

ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#47: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:06:35 PM

[up] What other wikis? I've never heard of other wikis dropping a message on everybody's talk page. They just use an announcement section.

edited 18th Apr '12 5:08:40 PM by ThatHuman

something
polutropon Since: Dec, 2011
#48: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:08:18 PM

Ones not called TvTropes. (Or at least the subset with a PM function.) We've got a weird and insular community, and it could really stand to learn from how other wikis work.

ThatHuman someone from someplace Since: Jun, 2010
someone
#49: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:09:01 PM

I've never heard of other wikis dropping a message on everybody's talk page about this kind of issue. They just use an announcement section.

edited 18th Apr '12 5:09:14 PM by ThatHuman

something
feotakahari Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer from Looking out at the city Since: Sep, 2009
Fuzzy Orange Doomsayer
#50: Apr 18th 2012 at 5:10:15 PM

^^ It's been said that this is not how Wikipedia does it. With that in mind, what wikis are you specifically referring to?

That's Feo . . . He's a disgusting, mysoginistic, paedophilic asshat who moonlights as a shitty writer—Something Awful

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