Content Policy Change

OK. Let's stop talking about specific pages here. I can see it breaking the thread apart in no time flat.

That entire discussion of Troper Tales is off-topic. I feel bad for causing the derailing.

I think No Such Thing As Notability does need a line about porn not being wanted.

ok I guess

edited 14th Apr '12 3:07:34 PM by Bookyangel2438

@Marq: Ah... That would make sense. Though this gives more incentive as to go for this purge.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:07:53 PM by Psyga315

It was cut because it was on the Hentai index. Seeing as it's not actually pornographic, we'll examine the content and see if we can bring it back.

@Sep: Hindsight does tend to be the clearest sight, doesn't it?

Quick question about the nature of the council thing: Are the members going to be made known to the wiki at large, or is it going to be an anonymous thing? I think both options have pros and cons, and I'm curious about how it's going to be handled.

Troper Tales was entertaining, but not in the good way. Getting rid of it saved the site's reputation.

Also, what are we going to do about Fetish Porn dressed up in G-ratings (stuff like El Goon Shive and that webcomic about the transformation high school)?

Considering that we aren't supposed to talk about specific pages, we have no input on who'll be on the council, we can't reverse the policy change, and the methods of the council will be determined by mods, what is an appropriate topic for this discussion?

With this, I agree. We need some way of knowing that everyone knows what work is being defended and have it in a way where someone can't convince everyone with one sentence and several cheery pickings. Despite how some of those have helped out in some cases.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:12:08 PM by Psyga315

Suggestions of methods for the Council?

Asking questions for clarification so the staff can Joss wild panic?

edited 14th Apr '12 3:11:48 PM by ArcadesSabboth

I feel like there should also be an open discussion before any trope is cut, so the council can get input from the public and to insure there is chance of defenders in case there are none on the council.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:12:47 PM by LMage

I like that idea!

What we define as paedophilia here? I guess it's going to be "pre-teen" vs. teen, and the council making the call if it isn't crysta-clear.

I suppose cutting purely porn for porn sake is somewhat acceptable but there needs to be a line. Some works are very pornographic in nature but have plot lines, character's and stories to them as well.

Not mention examples to keep in-line with the discussion rules even though there is a huge one I'd love to name drop.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:14:33 PM by Vyctorian

@Septimus

I suggest the general rule being that in-universe age of consent and cultural sexual standards be used, and failing that the age of consent and cultural sexual standards of the work's country of origin at the time of it's creation.

This allows for works like Romeo And Juliet that where written at a different time.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:17:35 PM by LMage

Bad ideas. Ages of consent are purely random numbers. And there are places where it is as high as 21 or as low as 8 with no particular reason.

Troper Tales was hurting us, but only because it was the latest stick that the trolls over at SA and certain youtube channels were using to make some tropers feel embarrassed. Same as they are doing now with sexual content. And the same as they will do with what ever they dream up next. We've paid the danegeld a couple of times already, so they'll keep doing it. And we'll keep cutting because we think it'll stop them. Only it won't.

However, that doesn't matter right now. What matters now is getting some proper terms of reference wrt what is and isn't allowed. At the moment it's too fuzzy, and very much open to misinterpretation and abuse. I'm also concerned we aren't acting to bring the troper community into the discussion and make them aware of what is going on. If there is one thing that we know from bitter experience, its that when you present people with fait accomplis and act to keep things quiet, its that there is a huge backlash that goes on for months and ends up causing more problems. We've just had a wiki talk thread about getting people involved and giving more information for goodness sake.

Yeah, there are countries where small pre-pubescent girls are purchased by old men who invite all their male relatives to gang-rape her every day for the rest of her life, and it's legal.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:17:39 PM by ArcadesSabboth

@The discussion of possibly moving questionable content to another wiki:

Remember that Wikia is not the only free wiki host. There's Wikkii (which hosts both Farmer and Custom installs of MediaWiki), Wikidot, Wetpaint, etc.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:18:09 PM by Sixthhokage1

Troper Tales isn't the discussion here can we please stop bringing it up.

Yes, seriously please drop TT and specific works.

As for general announcements to the whole wiki, that should at least wait until the council is formed up and has some plan, and is reviewing specific works and tropes.

Then how about this: so long as the work in question is not a glorification of pedophilia or child abuse, then it is fine. If a work handles the subject realistically and with some degree of respect for the reality of it, then I don't see a reason to cut it.

Also, as I mentioned a few pages back, a general announcement will likely only turn the complainers in.

edited 14th Apr '12 3:21:00 PM by SeptimusHeap