Discussion of religion in the context of LGBTQ+ rights is only allowed in this thread.
Discussion of religion in any other context is off topic in all of the "LGBTQ+ rights..." threads.
Attempting to bait others into bringing up religion is also not allowed.
Edited by Mrph1 on Dec 1st 2023 at 6:52:14 PM
Indecisive pumpkin
Actually, you do hear about therapy for sex addiction, and there's a growing school of thought that it's not healthy either. There's mounting evidence that it's the demonizing of sex in the culture and people being made to feel guilty for wanting to act on their natural sexual urges that's the root of the issue. Basically if people stopped trying to press oppressive morality on sex, people's lives and relationships would be much healthier.
It may even be to blame for the growing divorce rate because it makes it hard to talk about your sexual desires even with your spouse. People are getting divorced because they're sexually incompatible and the slut shaming in this culture means that there's no way to really work through it. If one partner cuts off sex in the relationship, the other really has no recourse and culturally they aren't allowed to complain about it. As a result, it's breaking apart families.
edited 24th Feb '13 11:11:24 AM by shimaspawn
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. DickPlus the whole ex-gay or ex-straight thing may or may not be bullshit. Not because of anything they said, but it is possible that they are sexually confused. Sorry for the semantic argument but this is exactly what I'm trying to get across. I honestly don't think there is a such thing as ex-gay or ex-straight person or even ex-sexual, (now asexual used to be sexual.) (Is there a real word for that because that sounds like a fetish for your Exs)(I'm not taking about calibrate I mean with no desire).
If you were asexual you always were, even if you try to love or crave sex you can't fake it too yourself. Now matter how Ship chooses to express himself I doubt he could force himself to find guys more attractive than women.
edited 24th Feb '13 12:00:54 PM by Wildcard
Comparing this to other therapies that modify behaviour, the one we have the most research on is alcoholism. One of the first steps in recovery to alcoholism is realising that there is no cure, and you'll always be an alcoholic. Likewise a gay person would realise they're gay and that they'll always be gay and nothing can change that.
Based on that fact, trying to be in a heterosexual relationship is really unfair to your partner. There's strife in a marriage when one party isn't attracted to the other one. You can make it work, but you'll never be truly happy and that can poison a relationship and really fuck up whatever children result. In addition there's a huge risk of divorce. No spouse deserves that.
That leaves remaining celibate and unloved and that's just cruel. Since you're basically telling someone they need to come to terms with the fact that they're not allowed to love and be loved. And that is railed against in the Bible far more than homosexuality.
That's why any sort of therapy on this is a bad idea. We know the limits of this sort of thing. And just telling someone they can't love is terrible.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. DickBritain's most senior Catholic accused of 'inappropriate acts' with four men
. This is the same guy who compared gay marriage to slavery
in a national newspaper last year.
Perhaps the latter incident was a roundabout way of publicising an interest in BDSM?
edited 24th Feb '13 12:47:24 PM by Snipehamster
Maxima: Did you see my comparison, now back a page or two? I want to make sure I'm understanding your argument correctly.
That’s the epitome of privilege right there, not considering armed nazis a threat to your life. - SilaswThe answer to that question is a bit out of my ability to explain. I can understand the papers about it, but putting it into plain language is trickier. That said, every addiction treatment has that as the first step.
I don't know what porn video you're talking about so I can't comment on it.
edited 24th Feb '13 1:19:55 PM by shimaspawn
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick![]()
I think (emphasis on think) that the acceptance part is because alcoholism isn't something that's changeable, it's part of your brain chemistry that you have that addiction (or that predisposition towards that addiction). Likewise if you've started going to AA then I believe it's assumed you've tried other means to get your alcoholism under control, that's why one of the steps is accepting that you can't do it alone and putting yourself in the power of something else (not necessarily god though)
You have nothing to apologize for, and it's not a semantic argument. It's the truth. That was what Alan Chambers, head of Exodus International was saying. He's trying to say, similar to me, that if this difficult process is going to be successful we need to accept the truth; and the truth is that none of us has the power to change things that were set since long before you even knew what sexual orientation was.
In other words you cannot and should not fake it. But you can learn. And what you learn and practice becomes real with each iteration. Learning to speak Spanish is not faking that you don't know English. But with enough time, you can come to start to forget parts of English and become as comfortable speaking Spanish as a native speaker.
edited 24th Feb '13 5:14:27 PM by TheStarshipMaxima
It was an honorI just don't think inquiries have ever shown sexuality to follow such a pattern. Sexuality is not a skill; it goes deeper than that. It's like trying to "cure" antisocial personality disorder with therapy; it's ineffective at best. It only results in pain and self-loathing, the latter of which the subject will probably already have plenty of.
edited 24th Feb '13 5:40:20 PM by Robotnik
@kay4today: Don't we have that right now?
This might come down to whether or not you believe people can change that part of themselves. I have doubts about this. Maybe if we had a person who'd been through the therapy and could see either of our sides.
Next up on the Mock Starship League meeting: Is Max a pinko commie? He is after all a fan of liberal leaning Star Trek but he seems to have Republican views.
edited 24th Feb '13 6:30:44 PM by Wildcard
