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Cessation of Existence & Afterlives.

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IraTheSquire Since: Apr, 2010
#176: Apr 7th 2012 at 8:04:08 PM

It does for me though, actually. It gives me some sort of closure and "I don't have to care about anything anymore" whereas an eternal existence makes me go "ok, what should I do with my afterlife? Damn it." Maybe I'm just too lazy. tongue

BreadGod Autistic Metalhead from Kansas Since: Nov, 2011
Autistic Metalhead
#177: Apr 7th 2012 at 8:16:22 PM

Since I'm an atheist, I believe that the only thing that awaits us when we die is oblivion. This is a terrifying thought, and it explains why the fear of death is the oldest fear in the world (and why Nurgle is the oldest of the chaos gods). I don't really see this as a bad thing. It simply tells me that since this is the only life we have, we might as well make the most of it.

edited 7th Apr '12 8:16:49 PM by BreadGod

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#178: Apr 8th 2012 at 12:01:51 AM

[up][up]

I guess I'm one of those folk who could live a simple live eternally with little complaint. Or who knows, maybe they can take really long naps. smile

Still, I'm sorry if I sound so depressed over this. I just can't find any comfort or solace in any of this belief and even though I'm young, it keeps me awake at night. I kind of wish I could hit myself in the head and forget about these thoughts.

edited 8th Apr '12 12:07:20 AM by Thorn14

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#179: Apr 9th 2012 at 4:39:45 PM

Well, the afterlife aside, if I thought I was nothing but a cognitive illusion I'm not sure why I would get up in the morning. I'm not a hedonist, so pleasure isn't enough.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#180: Apr 9th 2012 at 4:45:57 PM

I don't see why anything would be less meaningful if one considers the "self" an illusion. I don't see why anything would be less meaningful if this life was all we had and if nothing was to last forever.

I don't see why we should impose ourselves on scales of space and time that we do not actually live in.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Lanceleoghauni Cyborg Helmsman from Z or R Twice Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: In my bunk
#181: Apr 9th 2012 at 4:54:55 PM

I agree with Best Of. Is it so wrong to be happy with what we have, regardless of whether we believe it to be imagined or real-but-pointless? Impermanence is the name of the game.

I don't know what it is about me, I just finally reconciled with my mortality, meaninglessness, and the inevitability of oblivion, and suddenly it made me happy

I don't know exactly why, but I'm no longer afraid of death itself. It's the dying part that gets me [lol]

Definitely don't look forward to that yet.

edited 9th Apr '12 7:23:23 PM by Lanceleoghauni

"Coffee! Coffeecoffeecoffee! Coffee! Not as strong as Meth-amphetamine, but it lets you keep your teeth!"
Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#182: Apr 9th 2012 at 8:58:35 PM

It kind of bothers me because it means our lives truly are insignificant in almost every entirety of the word. It means we're literally lumps of flesh that got over its urge to hunt and fuck and nothing more.

Its kind of depressing.

I kind of wish I was spiritual since I could at least take comfort in it. But as it stands I can't take comfort in my mortality like you can because it scares me and I can't take comfort in spirituality because I doubt I'd actually believe it. sad

edited 9th Apr '12 8:59:57 PM by Thorn14

Aondeug Oh My from Our Dreams Since: Jun, 2009
Oh My
#183: Apr 9th 2012 at 9:02:12 PM

I can't take comfort in my spirituality completely because the system is cruel and lacking in feeling.

I find the idea of a total lack of that system, or any other, even more horrifying however.

If someone wants to accuse us of eating coconut shells, then that's their business. We know what we're doing. - Achaan Chah
Enthryn (they/them) Since: Nov, 2010
(they/them)
#184: Apr 9th 2012 at 9:23:11 PM

You're significant to you. Why does it matter if you're not significant on some grand, cosmic scale? Is your life any less worthwhile because it's not engraved in the laws of the universe?

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#185: Apr 9th 2012 at 9:26:35 PM

Because when I'm gone thats it. Theres no deeper meaning to me. And I'm not exactly an influential person. If I was famous and would be known it wouldn't be so bad. It just means all my emotions and problems are just chemical pulses. No such thing as a personality or attitude. Just chemicals.

But I guess I'm being overly negative. There are so many things I hate about reality because its well...reality and if its true this extremely short life is all we have, well that means I'll be missing out on so so much.

edited 9th Apr '12 9:33:28 PM by Thorn14

Enthryn (they/them) Since: Nov, 2010
(they/them)
#186: Apr 9th 2012 at 9:35:07 PM

And van Gogh's Starry Night is just oil stuck to processed plant matter. Except it isn't, is it? We collections of chemical impulses find meaning in it beyond the literal, low-level physical description. And that meaning is completely real, because it means something to us — just as our lives mean something to us.

We create meaning for ourselves; what greater meaning could there be? Would you really be happy with some cosmic principle telling you, "Here is why you exist. Now, go serve the purpose that has been chosen for you"?

Thorn14 Gunpla is amazing! Since: Aug, 2010
Gunpla is amazing!
#187: Apr 9th 2012 at 9:39:07 PM

True, and this is coming from someone in an art department.

Its just I always figured the point of our existence was to simply exist, and we could even refine that beyond this fleshly coil but it seems we only exist for a short while and then thats it, and most of us will be unfulfilled in said existence.

Sorry. I guess I'm kind of expecting someone to give me some sort of magical answer.

edited 9th Apr '12 10:11:51 PM by Thorn14

BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#188: Apr 10th 2012 at 8:50:33 AM

There are loads of magical answers out there but they're not worth a thing if you don't or can't accept them. I personally wouldn't recommend a magical answer to anyone, so of course I'm no help to you if you want to be convinced that there's a purpose to the cosmos.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#189: Apr 10th 2012 at 11:07:43 AM

Because action requires a goal or purpose before it becomes worth the energy required to enact it. If the "I" that I experience as me does not exist in any objective way, then what is the purpose of expending energy? (or making sacrifices, or enduring suffering?). You sound like the medieval Japanese in a James Clavell novel- since life is an illusion, one might as well leave it now (or kill someone, it doesnt matter).

edited 10th Apr '12 11:08:31 AM by DeMarquis

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#190: Apr 10th 2012 at 11:26:19 AM

It doesn't matter objectively, but it matters to you subjectively and you'll never have more than your subjective experience so "subjectively" is all that could in any way possibly affect you or matter to you.

edited 10th Apr '12 11:26:35 AM by BestOf

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#191: Apr 10th 2012 at 11:41:38 AM

But what I believe I can prove objectively is itself a compelling component of my subjective experience, thus it matters a great deal.

edited 10th Apr '12 2:41:11 PM by DeMarquis

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Gabrael from My musings Since: Nov, 2011 Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
#192: Apr 11th 2012 at 9:12:17 AM

I had the final episode of Neon Genesis Evangelion going through my head as I read the thread.

The consolation is that if there is nothing after death, you honestly won't know any better and can't be bothered by it's coming.

And you also have no control over it. So it's not worth fretting over.

I personally believe in reincarnation. Which to me is more tiresome and fustrating. Moksha for me would be oblivion, ultimate bliss and peace from rebirth.

"Psssh. Even if you could catch a miracle on a picture any person would probably delete it to make space for more porn." - Aszur
Enthryn (they/them) Since: Nov, 2010
(they/them)
#193: Apr 11th 2012 at 10:38:33 AM

[up] So I'm not the only one.

I still don't know where my happiness lies. I'll still think about why I'm here and whether or not it was good to come back. But that's just stating the obvious, over and over. I am... myself.
Right? ...er, wait, that's End Of Evangelion. Same general idea.

edited 11th Apr '12 10:39:22 AM by Enthryn

inane242 Anwalt der Verdammten from A B-Movie Bildungsroman Since: Nov, 2010
Anwalt der Verdammten
#194: Apr 11th 2012 at 10:43:07 AM

you also have no control over it. So it's not worth fretting over.

The 5 geek social fallacies. Know them well.
Qeise Professional Smartass from sqrt(-inf)/0 Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Waiting for you *wink*
Professional Smartass
#195: Apr 11th 2012 at 11:07:10 AM

[up]That's about how I act in regards to it. I act as if Cassation if Existence is what's coming, but as an agnostic I just hope there is a pleasant afterlife for which I qualify. However your actions or beliefs may affect your afterlife, if it exists. Though I think it is extremly unlikely that any religion, certainly none of the major ones, have it right most of them claim actions and beliefs to have an effect.

Laws are made to be broken. You're next, thermodynamics.
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#196: Apr 11th 2012 at 11:31:11 AM

"Not fretting about it" is fine, so far as it goes, but a certain amount of existential fear is completely natural.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#197: Apr 11th 2012 at 11:40:39 AM

Existential fear is natural, yes. It can be done away with, though, if one can come to terms with it and accept that there will not be an afterlife. Note: if one can come to terms with it. I don't claim that every mind is "built" to be able to come to terms with things like that if in some fundamental levels of the mind there are things that make it impossible to accept naturalist views.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#198: Apr 11th 2012 at 8:46:14 PM

I have no basis with which to disagree with you, except that I strongly suspect anyone actually achieving such zen-like levels of transcendence will have lost the motivation to actually do anything.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
IraTheSquire Since: Apr, 2010
#199: Apr 11th 2012 at 8:52:08 PM

Why so though? There are dozens of reasons for people to get motivated to take care of themselves apart from "preparing for the afterlife" (taking good care of yourself so that your parents/lover(s)/relatives/friends do no worry about you is a good one).

Gabrael from My musings Since: Nov, 2011 Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
#200: Apr 11th 2012 at 9:18:11 PM

Hinduism and Buddhism hold to the belief Boddhisatvas, or enlightened humans, elect to stay in samsara or the cycle of rebirth so they can help others.

Some sects of Hinduism claim one can never be truly enlightened in this life until they die and are released from this obligation anyway.

Plenty of people who believe in an afterlife do nothing.

"Psssh. Even if you could catch a miracle on a picture any person would probably delete it to make space for more porn." - Aszur

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