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fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#87101: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:06:30 PM

That's because Gero fucked up her emotions. She does smile a lot more often nowadays, but she does have a hard time expressing them.

And even then, i do think Krillin and 18 make a sweet couple. Then again the competition isn't that better anyway tongue

Uni cat
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#87102: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:06:33 PM

[up][up] Super seems to just be lampshading how insane their relationship is, honestly.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#87103: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:12:20 PM

Videl's entire character at first is that she thinks she's the strongest in the world, or about to be, and she refuses to believe that she could have been surpassed by some low-class commoner from some backwater podunk.

Granted, she thinks being the strongest means she should fight for justice instead of being a pirate or used planet salesman, but. Aside from that.

Videl and Vegeta are remarkably similar at first in terms of attitude and self-evaluation.

fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#87104: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:16:19 PM

But unlike Vegeta, she doesn't constantly fuck up tonguetonguetongue

Uni cat
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#87105: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:17:21 PM

Yeah, because somehow she became completely passive and a housewife.

She wanted to be a detective!

Why is Krillin the cop instead of her!

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#87106: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:22:50 PM

Well, considering how much people dislike the beating she got from Spopovitch, I'm glad she didn't become a female Vegeta. She deserves it far less than he did.

Bulma actively dumped Yamcha and went out to gather the Dragon Balls to try and wish for a new boyfriend because he was too nice.

When was that? I mean, I can buy it, but I don't recall that one.

One Strip! One Strip!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#87107: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:24:06 PM

Wrong thread.

Edited by LSBK on Sep 18th 2018 at 7:27:06 AM

fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#87108: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:24:09 PM

I don't know, maybe because Krillin as a cop was a funny concept and they rolled with it.

Also, he has to work to earn his money. Not the same case for Videl tongue

But the true reason for Videl's Chickification is that Pan stole all her coolness

Uni cat
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#87109: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:24:44 PM

The Red Ribbon Arc. Yamcha was... going to school?

My various fanfics.
fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#87110: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:31:11 PM

Well, considering how much people dislike the beating she got from Spopovitch, I'm glad she didn't become a female Vegeta. She deserves it far less than he did.

At least she didn't get stabbed in the eye numerous times, crushed by a giant monkey, almost stabbed by a midget, lasered through the chest, got her arm broken, got her shit kicked by a biogenetic monster and blown up trying to kill Kirby's fatter cousin. He deserved it of course, but still.

And half of those people who did that to him are his peers now. Must be ripe for awkward conversations.

But worst of all, she didn't had to spend her early years with Nappa

Edited by fasoman1996 on Sep 18th 2018 at 9:33:48 AM

Uni cat
Fedetropes Call me Blast, not Fedetropes from Doomed universe Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Call me Blast, not Fedetropes
#87111: Sep 18th 2018 at 5:52:04 PM

...now I want to imagine what would happen if Videl filled the role of Female Vegeta with in the gang

Something about it seems hilarious to me

Edited by Fedetropes on Sep 18th 2018 at 9:51:59 AM

¡PONLE QUE DIGA!:"¡HUMONGOSAURIO HASTA LA MUERTE!"
Kamiccolo Since: May, 2018
#87112: Sep 18th 2018 at 8:55:52 PM

That did change a bit in Super. In the early arcs she was kinda left out. At least TOP did feature her as a powerful fighter again, although i have no clue how she got that strong.
Because Toei says fuck yo consistency and they always have. She's not implied to be any stronger in the manga version than she was in the Android arc. I tend to default to that version in regards to continuity given Toriyama's seemingly closer level of supervision.
And Kami I hate what happened to Videl's personality.

She basically used to be Vegeta as a teenage earthling girl.

If anyone in the cast would have become a cop it would be her, not Krillin.

Especially since I remember her saying she wanted to be a police detective.

Jobberhan's loser aura rubbed off on her, the poor thing.
Well, considering how much people dislike the beating she got from Spopovitch, I'm glad she didn't become a female Vegeta. She deserves it far less than he did.
The Spopovich fight wasn't that bad compared to just about any other beatdown in the series, since at least Videl was alive and semi-mobile and didn't have any missing limbs or holes in her body. Spopo actually took more of a beating than Videl did with her even breaking his neck in a rather disgusting fashion, but he was possessed by Babidi so for some reason that's just something he could survive.

Edited by Kamiccolo on Sep 18th 2018 at 8:57:35 AM

Eriorguez Since: Jun, 2009
#87113: Sep 19th 2018 at 3:40:37 AM

...

The biggest inconsistency of the series is Cell losing his wings in his second form, just to regain them in his perfect one.

Honestly it wouldn't have hurt Semi-Perfect's design.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#87114: Sep 19th 2018 at 4:59:24 AM

OH MY GOD, I THOUGHT I WAS THE ONLY ONE WHO THOUGHT THAT! Yes, Semi-Perfect Cell absolutely should have had wings! Or, at least have those short wings he grew immediately after absorbing 18, that was a good look.

Another thing I've been thinking about, Super Saiyans 2 and 3 give off a lot of electricity in the aura, right? Has that electricity ever been anything but a neat thing to make the aura look prettier? Has anyone ever been shocked by SS2 or SS3 lightning? Seems like giving SS2 and SS3 an electric element would've been a bit more interesting. For that matter, make the SSG aura actual fire, and make the UI aura like, warping of reality around the user or something, have the auras do something besides looking cool.

Fedetropes Call me Blast, not Fedetropes from Doomed universe Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Call me Blast, not Fedetropes
#87115: Sep 19th 2018 at 5:29:16 AM

I think I remember SS 3 Goku giving an electric punch with his aura in the fusion reborn movie...or at least it looked like that

¡PONLE QUE DIGA!:"¡HUMONGOSAURIO HASTA LA MUERTE!"
Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#87116: Sep 19th 2018 at 7:18:59 AM

"The only couple in DB that hasn't raised serious eyebrows at times pretty much remains Videl and Gohan since Chichi and Goku is basically a running joke at this point."

I actually have way more problems with how Toriyama wrote Videl than how he wrote 18. Videl shows up purely to be Gohan's love interest. There's a running joke in not just how much weaker she is than his kid brother (that's because she's a human) but she also has an insane amount of trouble with stuff like flying that Gohan learnt as a 4-year old and Goten does effortlessly. But that's all just a gag, really; just like how Kid Goku is a gag. So I can write off stuff like that, and her cutting her hair because that's what Gohan likes as just comedy. Kind of tired, been-there comedy, but nothing more.

What I can't write off is the Spopovich fight. It's basically Videl's one serious fight in the entire series and it purely consists of the ever living shit being beaten out of her. Of every single fight in Dragonball, it is the only one I find hard to watch because it is so brutal. Usually, when there's a beatdown, it's actually a fairly short affair, a few gut punches, maybe no selling a really strong ki attack, then a short-sharp finisher.

But Videl and Spopovich goes on for absolutely ages and it's nothing but him tanking her attacks and beating the shit out of her. I don't like to use the term "fridging" often; it's a go-to complaint from the shrill whenever a female character dies and gets hurt and has been overused to the point of meaninglessness.

But this battle is absolutely pointless except for making Gohan angry (anger that has almost zero payoff, by the way). It doesn't establish Spopovich as a threat (because let's be honest he isn't). You could have given this role to literally anyone else and it would have established more threat. And more importantly, in its current state it's just really, really unpleasant in a way that's completely uncharacteristic of Dragonball.

And that's Videl. She turns up, she falls for Gohan, she gets the everloving shit kicked out of her to motivate him, then she marries him. It would have been actually less insulting if she had never been a martial artist to begin with.

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#87118: Sep 19th 2018 at 7:25:29 AM

[up][up] The flying thing is kinda weird given Goku didnt learn it until the very end of Dragon Ball, and even in the Saiyan Saga Goku still mostly used Nimbus for transportation to and from places.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#87119: Sep 19th 2018 at 7:28:04 AM

[up][up] Ooooh pretty colors.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Kamiccolo Since: May, 2018
#87120: Sep 19th 2018 at 11:03:02 AM

but she also has an insane amount of trouble with stuff like flying that Gohan learnt as a 4-year old and Goten does effortlessly. But that's all just a gag, really; just like how Kid Goku is a gag.
Flying is a big deal for weaklings. Everyone thought it was insane that Goku was able to do it at the 23rd Budokai, when he had been training for years for it and had at this point already become literally stronger than God and strong enough to blow up planetoids.
What I can't write off is the Spopovich fight. It's basically Videl's one serious fight in the entire series and it purely consists of the ever living shit being beaten out of her.
I don't know what the anime did but this is 100% not true in the manga. The fight is a back and forth of Videl and Spopovich exchanging very painful-looking blows, with Spopovich probably getting the worst of it by having his neck bent in a way that humans are not supposed to bend, but as pointed out by characters in-universe, Spopo's weird zombie-like attributes mean he can keep bouncing back while Videl can't. So she slowly accumulates damage until she loses ground and it become a curb-stomp while he continues to fight. Even after that point she gets in a couple solid hits, they're just not enough.
Of every single fight in Dragonball, it is the only one I find hard to watch because it is so brutal.
It really isn't. Compare Vegeta vs Freeza, Vegeta vs Fat Buu, Piccolo vs Goku [either the first time or the third time], or even Gohan vs Super Buu [Gotenks]. They all got it much worse.
But Videl and Spopovich goes on for absolutely ages and it's nothing but him tanking her attacks and beating the shit out of her.
Lasts about 1 chapter.
But this battle is absolutely pointless.
It serves a dual purpose: one, it establishes Videl as a (muggle) fighter. Prior to this point we'd only seen her beat up mundane criminals far weaker than her. This showed that he both has some skill (because she would have killed a stronger opponent if he wasn't a weird demon-zombie thing) and some pride as a martial artist (because she kept fighting long after it was clear she was outmatched, refusing to give up until she literally couldn't move anymore; much like Fat Buu vs Kid Buu later). Two, it establishes the more serious tone via slow escalation (rather than jumping to thousands of people dying immediately) after the early quarter of the arc had basically been pure comedy. Much like Yamcha vs Saibaman; it's not that the Saibaman killing Yamcha is remotely impressive at this point, it's that it hits the audience like a ton of bricks that the arc just took a dark turn and will keep going.

Edited by Kamiccolo on Sep 19th 2018 at 11:12:48 AM

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#87121: Sep 19th 2018 at 11:15:37 AM

I've always found it a bit ironic how people talk as if Videl vs. Spopovich is Toriyama saying "women should stay out of the ring" even though it doesn't seem to actually scar or change Videl at all after she's better, and the reasoning for why it's apparently so much worse or needlessly brutal than anything else always seem to carry the implications of "because she's a girl".

Edited by LSBK on Sep 19th 2018 at 1:19:27 PM

fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#87122: Sep 19th 2018 at 11:23:01 AM

I also believe that there were a lot more brutal fights than that.

Frieza Final Form vs Vegeta, Goku vs Piccolo in the tournament or Nappa just straight murdering a good part of the Z Warriors.

Uni cat
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#87123: Sep 19th 2018 at 11:37:23 AM

Oh boy it's time for "actually you're the sexist one for not liking watching women get brutalized". I mean I get it, women should be able to get into knock out drag out fights too, but context matters for a lot. And a lot of these example of men getting it real bad have different contexts. Like Gohan vs Buutenks has no where near the same level of verisimilitude. Goku vs Piccolo Jr. has the context of Goku being able to win the battle with his own power. Vegeta vs Frieza has the context of not being Vegeta's only real fight, before or after.

LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#87124: Sep 19th 2018 at 11:51:48 AM

I'm not really sure what relevance the fact that Videl didn't get really upset about in-universe has when she never fights again after it.

Like the fight itself isn't necessarily bad in a vacuum but it's her only fight, she gets curb-stomped, and that's it for her fighting.

This song needs more love.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#87125: Sep 19th 2018 at 11:54:22 AM

[up][up]No, it's time for "when people insist this one fight is the most brutal thing ever, even when several others just as, or even more brutal exist, we look at the one thing that's different."

No one is saying anyone has to enjoy it, I'd imagine a lot of the issue is the anime making it seem much longer than it actually is, and I would have appreciated a better payoff. But, there's a giant elephant in the room.

Videl vs. Spopovich is neither a curb-stomp all the way, nor the most brutal outcome. Compared to, say, Gohan vs. Recoome, which was a curb-stomp all the way, and ended with Gohan having his neck broken and twitching on the ground.

If you want to debate, fine, but stop putting words in people's mouths, and exaggerating their arguments. It makes discussing things with you very frustrating.

[up]I'd say it matters when people try and make it out to be Toriyama's condemnation of female fighters or something. Even though it's already been established that most of the cast are useless in fights at this point.

I don't like what happened with her character in Super, but that doesn't have anything to do with the Spopovich fight.

Edited by LSBK on Sep 19th 2018 at 5:15:56 AM


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