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Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#86626: Sep 5th 2018 at 6:51:47 AM

I quite like Goku V Krillin at the 22nd TB. They're best friends but I think this is their only serious fight in the series against each other.

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#86627: Sep 5th 2018 at 7:02:40 AM

It actually wasn't that serious.

Goku was massively sandbagging, and as soon as he gets serious, he beats Krillin while making faces at him.

It did admittedly look good visually I suppose, and it is the only time they've ever fought each other like you said.

One Strip! One Strip!
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#86628: Sep 5th 2018 at 7:06:49 AM

People love the Super Saiyan 3 transformation sequence, but they don't really talk about the actual fight that followed it all that much, especially compared to Majin Vegeta vs Fat Buu and Goku vs Kid Buu, both of which I actually like less in terms of fight choreography.

Super Saiyan 3 Goku vs Kid Buu wasn't really all that, but Super Saiyan 2 Goku vs Kid Buu was some goooooooood shit.

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#86629: Sep 5th 2018 at 7:07:09 AM

Goku wasn't sandbagging, he just wasn't fighting as if his life was on the line.

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#86630: Sep 5th 2018 at 7:39:10 AM

[up][up] While it's anime-only and thus doesn't make a lick of sense power-wise (Goku should have been SSJ3 the entire time), I agree fully. The song that played during that part in the Kai dub really sold it.

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#86631: Sep 5th 2018 at 8:03:45 AM

Goku vs Ginyu Force is literally Goku at his most badass in the entire series. He picks them apart with such contemptuous easy, it's just a joy to watch.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#86632: Sep 5th 2018 at 9:40:01 AM

Um...Karrot vs. Ten was...um, a thing.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#86633: Sep 5th 2018 at 9:43:38 AM

I have my problems with the Ginyu Squad fight, being that conceptually and structurally it was just a repeat of the fight against Nappa and Vegeta, Gohan, and Krillin's involvement was basically spinning out the clock. And that it served to get Goku out of the way so he could once again pull a big damn heroes moment against Freeza.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#86634: Sep 5th 2018 at 1:51:35 PM

Goku wasn't sandbagging, he just wasn't fighting as if his life was on the line.

He was sandbagging hard, as seen in the difference between most of the fight and him deciding to win at the end. If he'd just tried that hard from the start Kuririn wouldn't even be able to react to him.

There's also stuff like him pretending to have his tail weakness just to mess with Kuririn.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#86635: Sep 5th 2018 at 2:17:11 PM

There's also stuff like him pretending to have his tail weakness just to mess with Kuririn.

Hell, you could argue Goku is insulting him by pretending that Krillin stood a chance, and toying with him like he did.

One Strip! One Strip!
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#86636: Sep 5th 2018 at 2:18:41 PM

Goku is such a good friend; making Krillin actually believe he had a chance before pulling the rug out and being like "Lol no"

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#86637: Sep 5th 2018 at 2:21:25 PM

Goku wasn't really sandbagging so much as he was having fun. Goku in that fight is both a Saiyan and a child, and Krillin is his best friend. Goku was having the time of his life in that fight, he was having so much fun fighting/playing with Krillin. It's not malicious in any way, Goku was just genuinely having a great time and Krillin was impressing him with his progress and ingenuity.

The Goku/Krillin fight is one of the best in the series because of how pure and wholesome it is, just two best friends going at each other in a martial arts fight.

Also, the disappear technique isn't just a showing of speed, it's an actual technique the same as the afterimage is. Just as the afterimage technique isn't necessarily a speed feat (Goku and Roshi use it on each other, and neither can see through it), the back-and-forth disappearing technique isn't a speed feat either. It's just a modified version of the afterimage technique that doesn't leave behind an afterimage.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Sep 5th 2018 at 2:21:41 AM

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#86638: Sep 5th 2018 at 2:22:38 PM

Goku specifically warns Krillin that his Kamehameha wouldn't work and blocks it one handed; he wasn't expecting Krillin to use it as a distraction.

The conclusion does sort of draw on early Dragonball's inconsistency with how people can see fast stuff though; Krillin and Master Roshi's fight was so fast the audience couldn't keep up and yet they keep up with future fights from faster people.

I just really like the fight and I think it's a good showing for both characters. Other people are obviously disagreeing, but the question was "what fight do you like that's kind of unpopular" not "what fight do you like that everyone else is going to agree with".

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#86639: Sep 5th 2018 at 2:50:31 PM

It was more claiming that Goku wasn't sandbagging when he clearly was. You can sugarcoat it how you want, but the result is the same.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#86640: Sep 5th 2018 at 2:52:49 PM

I mean, a "good showing" doesn't necessarily mean the character stood a chance.

Krillin had a "good showing" against Piccolo too, but he still obviously was never going to win that fight.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#86641: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:00:21 PM

Goku was only sandbagging as much as he outright admitted he was holding back his Battle Power when he fought Tenshinhan. He wasn't holding back any more than that. Krillin had a pretty good showing against Goku's Tournament Power, despite being at a notable disadvantage, up until Goku pulled out a modified Afterimage technique out of his ass that made him invisible.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Sep 5th 2018 at 3:05:04 AM

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#86642: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:09:19 PM

Goku wasn't using a modified afterimage technique, he was actively jumping between two points so fast that no one (except perhaps Tien?) could see what he was doing.

Afterimage creates an illusion of you, it doesn't make you invisible (and Piccolo actually uses an illusion in his takedown of Krillin in the 23rd BT).

Edited by Sigilbreaker26 on Sep 5th 2018 at 10:11:54 AM

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#86643: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:12:20 PM

Yes, that is what the afterimage technique does. Tenshinhan noted that it was harder to see through Goku's disappear technique than it was to see through the afterimage, and the only reason he can do either is because he has three eyes.

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#86644: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:12:58 PM

...Afterimage doesn't make you invisible.

Goku's jumping has absolutely nothing to do with afterimage.

Edited by Sigilbreaker26 on Sep 5th 2018 at 10:14:01 AM

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#86645: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:14:21 PM

Goku in that fight is both a Saiyan and a child, and Krillin is his best friend. Goku was having the time of his life in that fight, he was having so much fun fighting/playing with Krillin. It's not malicious in any way, Goku was just genuinely having a great time and Krillin was impressing him with his progress and ingenuity.

The Goku/Krillin fight is one of the best in the series because of how pure and wholesome it is, just two best friends going at each other in a martial arts fight.

I'm not gonna deny this. Barring his first transformation into Super Saiyan, Goku just doesn't have a malicious bone in his body. He's obviously just trying to have a fun battle with his buddy without any higher stakes or anything. And yeah, Krillin pulls off a few good tricks here, even if he stood no chance.

He's still kinda insulting Krillin though. But in hindsight, it's not a shock that Krillin doesn't take it personally. Anyone who knows Goku knows that he doesn't have a deliberately mean bone in his body. Guy will even talk friendly with people who have gotten him mad enough that he's actually hated them (as Frieza can attest).

One Strip! One Strip!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#86646: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:14:35 PM

[up][up]It makes you invisible when you're traveling in-between the afterimages. Doing the afterimage technique so fast that you don't even leave behind afterimages is the natural evolution of that technique.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Sep 5th 2018 at 3:14:29 AM

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#86647: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:20:08 PM

I don't see what point is being made behind Goku not expecting Kuririn to use a distraction. He still faked the weakness of his tail, for no reason other than jollies.

I could buy it being a good showing for Kuririn if he was able to fight impressively against a holding-back Goku or managed to pull a few tricks against full power Goku while being outclassed.

But instead he was using tricks while being outclassed by a sandbagging Goku, and was completely helpless when Goku started using more speed. Possibly not even his full effort given his dialogue with Ten.

Edit: also, no, Pushover, Goku wasn't using some special invisibility technique. Ten describes exactly what he does.

Edited by Saiga on Sep 5th 2018 at 8:21:36 PM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#86648: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:24:19 PM

And what Tenshinhan described is the same as the afterimage technique, just done fast enough that he didn't leave behind an afterimage.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#86649: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:39:09 PM

What he describes is moving faster than the others can see, not a specific technique or turning invisible.

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#86650: Sep 5th 2018 at 3:45:23 PM

Yeah, PMC, Tien pretty clearly describes what he sees.

Now that we've pretty thoroughly discussed Krillin V Goku, what are other people's choices for unpopular fights that they like?

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"

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