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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#76951: Feb 3rd 2018 at 5:58:57 PM

Yeah, the Jiren = Superman thing just seems really forced on the fanbase's side. And I feel is influenced by bringing western expectations to a character based on a specific Japanese subgenre.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#76952: Feb 3rd 2018 at 5:59:32 PM

For one, he's not kind in any way. Like, he's nothing like Superman.

EDIT:

>Vegeta is out of energy.

>He's in his beyond Blue form the next episode.

Super never stops entertaining.

edited 3rd Feb '18 6:00:38 PM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#76953: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:01:27 PM

Yeah he really isn't.

Makes me feel really embarrassed to have bought in the hype & that particular piece of fanon early on.

It was something someone mentioned long, long ago when Jiren first appeared in the new OP, someone said he's the closest we'll get to Superman here & I latched on to it cause it was an interesting concept.

edited 3rd Feb '18 6:04:02 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Ikedatakeshi Baby dango from singapore Since: Nov, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Baby dango
#76954: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:02:53 PM

Don't be. Just put it in the Super disappointment pile and spit on it on your way out.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#76955: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:04:33 PM

Out of curiosity, how are hardcore Vegeta fans reacting to this?

Deadpoolrocks Since: Sep, 2010
#76956: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:05:16 PM

about jiren insulting toppo it seems to be because he cast his morals aside and still lost because he next praises vegeta for surpassing his limits and not having to cast anything aside to do so.

Ikedatakeshi Baby dango from singapore Since: Nov, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Baby dango
#76957: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:08:49 PM

Yeah, the person willing to do a sacrifice for the sake of protecting your universe and just gotten beaten up is the pathetic one compared to the asshole who has only displayed that he's an arrogant jerk. Praise your enemy for beating up your friend.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#76958: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:10:47 PM

Yeah especially since Jiren & Toppo are supposed to be sworn friends so the former should be more empathetic to what the latter did.

Even Batman's not that mean, just look at the Injustice series on the topic of Superman's downfall.

Vegeta's just being an arrogant prick to him, there shouldn't be much he finds respectable.

edited 3rd Feb '18 6:11:47 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#76959: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:11:44 PM

In fairness, this whole tournament everyone's acted like nothing is at stake. Which is why I've always said that this tournament should have been for shits and giggles. Or something like, the biggest feast ever and only the winning universe is invited (and it would be especially hilarious if Goku then went all serious business when he heard that was the reward.)

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
NieOrginalny Rapidly changing picture from Very Far Away Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Rapidly changing picture
#76960: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:14:09 PM

This episode felt like it had nothing to do with what came before it, all the dramatic build up from the last episode was gone. After having Toppo erase literally everything that was thrown at him, and erasing an energy attack by flicking a tiny destruction ball at it, we go to 17 and Freeza... throwing rocks at him, and it apperently somewhat working. Then Toppo meets up with Jiren, and Jiren's stray blast buries 17 and Freeza in rubble for the rest of the episode, making all the time Toppo was taking with them seem worthless.

After a short while of Toppo beating up Vegeta a bit, he uses the power of friendship/love to power up, and use an attack that doesn't even make such sense to use in this situation, that was only pulled out because he used Final Flash way too much already, and for a cheap callback to Buu saga. Did he REALLY need to use up all of his energy when he was easily beating up Toppo and even punching through his destruction energy?

I'd try to ponder on something about Jiren, but I'm too tired so I'll just say that his roundhouse kick on Goku was pretty hilarious.

I am procastrinating, but not excessively I think.
bobg Since: Nov, 2012
#76961: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:18:36 PM

Did Jiren kill Frieza? He disappears after the stray Power Impact hits and is not seen for the rest of the episode or the preview for the next one.

jjj
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#76962: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:20:34 PM

Throwing rocks? This episode gets better and better.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#76963: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:25:59 PM

Y'know, as silly as No Selling divine power with friendship and punching is... this show is for kids above all else,

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#76964: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:27:20 PM

That's a terrible excuse.

When I was a kid I could tell the difference between stuff that respected my intelligence and stuff that didn't.

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
Ikedatakeshi Baby dango from singapore Since: Nov, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Baby dango
#76965: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:27:56 PM

Being for kids doesn't justify low quality.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#76966: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:28:08 PM

[up][up][up]

Then kids are all dumb.

I'm not sorry.

edited 3rd Feb '18 6:28:23 PM by HandsomeRob

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#76967: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:28:40 PM

Yeah just cause its for kids doesn't mean they shouldn't try.

I mean look at Star Wars: The Clone Wars, that show was for kids & damn was it awesome. [awesome]

Also the original series was for kids too & it never went to fucking nakama levels.

edited 3rd Feb '18 6:29:18 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
CountofBleck Starting to believe in himself from New Wirral (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Starting to believe in himself
#76968: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:29:09 PM

[up] We already had Goku and Frieza survive Hakai energy already, and Freizaa survived 2. Why is Vegeta punching through it such an upset.

Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#76969: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:29:20 PM

Yeah Jiren doesn't have anything in common with Superman other than being a superhero and stronger than Goku :P.

Also if Kafla had 3 in order to match Goku then he should really just stick to dodging until her energy runs out instead of finding a way to beat her.

That wouldn't have worked since Ultra Instinct was also rapidly running out of energy. Watching them dance around waiting to see who runs out of energy first would have been way less cool.

This episode: Yeah, this episode was a disappointment after how good the last one was. Things I really liked such as Toppo's Destruction barrier that made energy attacks useless and the "floating islands" aspect of the destroyed arena are nowhere to be seen. Plus Toppo just had way less menace in general. Not sure if I'm ready for four episodes of Jiren, but maybe I'll be surprised.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#76970: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:29:21 PM

[up][up][up][up][up] Oh I'm the first to argue that - I hate how stuff like the Pokemon anime assumes kids are idiots, but this seems mild compared to that sort of thing.

edited 3rd Feb '18 6:29:44 PM by HamburgerTime

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#76971: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:32:27 PM

Having seen the episode just now...

..I'm not really sure whats so bad about it?

I feel like this thread was blowing out any flaws it had out of proportion.

The only flaws I saw were a weak first half, animation wise.

Watch Symphogear
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#76972: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:33:39 PM

because when you're literally using a lower percentage of your power it means nothing when an attack pushes you back. It doesn't put Vegeta anywhere near the level that Beerus used against God Goku.

The point of comparison is still two characters not using their full strength being antagonized by characters who are far weaker.

  • Beerus is not trying -> Beerus is not using his full strength -> Vegeta can push him back.
  • God!Goku is tired -> Goku is not fighting at full strength -> Kale and Caulifa can push him back.

This isn't a great comparison admittedly and I'm defending it more out of stubbornness than it being essential to my argument, so I'd like to move on from this.

Gotenks achieved it in two weeks, he's a fusion beyond the individual Saiyan girls. And Goku found that amazing, because it took him years of training to do so ... It's not even remotely comparable to a fusion like Gotenks doing it.

Gotenks learning Super Saiyan 3 is bull in of itself because he didn't have years of training, not the kind that Goku did anyway, and thus shouldn't be able to unlock it. But he did it in two weeks, indicating that the hurdle for obtaining it isn't that high. It'd be more inconsistent for 3 to be difficult for Caulifa/Kale to obtain easily when 1 and 2 obviously weren't; there's precedent for them unlocking new forms extremely fast.

Gotenks isn't beyond the two of them in any capacity other than maybe popularity, note . Even if he was stronger than them, that wouldn't have any bearing on their learning capacity. Being a fusion doesn't affect that at all.

And Goku working on the flaws in his UI is better for the eventual 'completion' of UI than not needing to because he can just exploit Kafla's flaws. The development of UI is more important than that one fight.

I didn't like the idea of "developing" UI in the first place. It's just another way for the anime to waste time on making Goku tougher, giving him another new form to master when he'd barely mastered the last one. We need more scenes of Goku thinking outside of the box and growing mentally, like using landmines and baiting Jiren into falling off of the ring, and fewer scenes of Goku learning how to better use his god powers a little more every time he gets punched in the face.

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#76973: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:34:59 PM

So, yeah, terrible episode but at this point I feel like we should all be used to that.

And going off the preview for the next one I'm guessing 17 is going to be eliminated, but not before they fellate him a little more. And as for Frieza? Who knows.

NieOrginalny Rapidly changing picture from Very Far Away Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Rapidly changing picture
#76974: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:37:44 PM

When 18 defeated Ribrianne with power of love, it was cool, funny and actually made some kind of sense. She was fighting against a magical girl who preached about love a lot, but her definition of love was incredibly skewed and carricatural, so having her be defeated thanks to genuine love was a fitting end for her, plus she seemed to have started to realize her mistake afterwards and kept on cheering for her teammates. It's also not like she was a major player to begin with.

But with Vegeta and Toppo? There was no irony there, there was nothing clever about that, Vegeta was losing, he got a moment to think about his family and the saiyans, and then just started easily beating Toppo.

I am procastrinating, but not excessively I think.
Ikedatakeshi Baby dango from singapore Since: Nov, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Baby dango
#76975: Feb 3rd 2018 at 6:37:49 PM

Straw that breaks that camel's back. Only this camel is already a half-dead quadriplegic on life support while also suffering from cancer. It's not the worst Super episode, it's not first episode that ruined the buildup of the previous one, it's not the first to use BS powerups and inconsistent power levels, but I'm sick and tired of this endless disappointment that Super puts out. When I say this episode reminds me of Fairy Tail, I meant it.


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