I don't think the Priest is telling Zenou what to do, but so far I do think he's actively encouraging his whims. A few times it feels like he's making conclusions for Zenou rather than simply speaking for him, but even so it's presented more like Zenou just doesn't want to bother making those decisions and leaves it to the Priest, rather than the Priest pulling a Babidi and trying to think for him.
This episode does also give us the first instance of Zenou actually confirming that he's actively committed to the idea, the lack of which was one of the reasons I was suspicious before. When Bergamo asks him to stake rescinding the rule on the match, he's all "I've already made my decision, but you amuse me so why not?"
It's less him being excited and more him responding to people being afraid that he's some kind of villain by giving them exactly what they want to see. Him responding to Bergamo's "you want to wipe us all out! But we'll fight back! We'll survive, and see you erased!", and the other universes' subsequent fear, with "Send all your strongest warriors! I'll defeat them all!" is not exactly the most heroic response. He's not only not defending himself, his tactlessness had led him to take every opportunity to make himself look even more like the bad guy.
The Perspective Flip in this episode is so strong it's probably intentional. They're playing with it: we know, objectively now, that Goku is only tangentially at fault here and has no bad intentions. But he's still getting ironic scenes where he plays the typical villain role you would get in this sort of plot. When Bergamo was left broken in a heap, I was like "this is just like that episode of YYH where Toguro curbstomps Yusuke before the Dark Tournament and Yusuke realizes he has to get stronger or die... except that would make Goku Toguro... which is weird..."
edited 4th Mar '17 10:31:49 PM by KnownUnknown
They're not painting him as the villain for the audience, they're painting him that way to the other characters. It's Dramatic Irony.
Exactly, we're shown that the other universes view him as the villain, not that he actually eyes. Do he's not doing himself any favors either.
@Soble:
You git it wrong, the fight against Universe 9 was an exhibition match. It wasn't part of the survival tournament, it was just for future Zen'o's benefit and amusement.
edited 5th Mar '17 12:06:02 AM by Cortez
Yeah, Bergamo seems to have been trying to throw some negative hype on Goku without necessarily believing it - he reminded me a bit of a professional wrestler. Arguably for a good cause: he might have been trying to put on a good enough show that Zenou would agree to lifting the erasure clause. There was, at the moment, little other practical reason to make everyone hate Goku beyond making himself look good in comparison.
Though after his defeat and witnessing Goku's battle junkie behavior, he started actually believing his own story.
Speaking of erasure, it's kind of funny that the Tournament has a No-Kill rule, given that teams who lose are dead anyway. I guess it's a mechanical thing: if you kill your opponents, you don't have to worry as much about getting them out of the ring, and the ring-outs are intended to be the primary challenge.
The big thing that feels weird about the whole thing being a single huge Battle Royale is that it means the tournament is going to be a lot shorter than it seemed, and there's almost certainly going to be less focus on individual teams then we thought as well. Though the more I think about it, the more I think it's a really smart writing move.
One thing I was worried about when it started looking like it would be whole team vs whole team head to head was that there were too many characters to develop, keep track of and have fight in tandem. But having everyone be in the ring at once removes the problem, ironically. With 10 vs 10, there's just few enough that each character needs to be unique. But in an 80 person brawl, you have so much stuff going on that more characters can be nondescript, or mooks, or simply easily defeated, with the prime unique characters being very few and prominent.
A lot of the exposition and setting stuff in this arc is really smart. I was gushing about the exposition for why the universes were getting erased and how certain ones are exempt for ages - it's simple but adds so much framework and potential for future plots.
edited 5th Mar '17 12:48:35 AM by KnownUnknown
I find that more interesting and I think Goku might be doing it on purpose for a better fight.
Toriyama's thoughts on Goku are always fascinating.
I don't think Bergamo was wrong at all. Everything he said was technically correct, and he has no reason to believe otherwise than his accusations. He may have painted a target on U7, but from his perspective, he was right to paint a target on U7, because from his perspective, U7 spawned the most dangerous mortal to ever live.
Yeesh Goku is one hell of a flawed individual under his pen.
I hope he doesn't have fun in the actual tournament. I honestly cannot imagine that one one will not take this battle with near %100 seriousness. As I mentioned before I wouldn't be surprised if some of the warriors actually broke out crying in despair if they lost. It be really powerful if Goku honestly found no enjoyment in this massive battle cause he honestly feels bad what's happening & even possible guilt that the whole thing could have been his fault when it really wasn't.
Also again I think everyone like Bergamo believe Goku is more than he appears. They think he's some magnificent bastard in league with or manipulating Zeno somehow to start the tournament done solely to satisfy his own apparent bloodshed.
edited 5th Mar '17 12:54:40 AM by slimcoder
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."That's sad...
Would be sad.
If Karrot can't enjoy the one thing he "loves" doing.
Just because a few universes will get erased.
"Bloodlust"
edited 5th Mar '17 12:57:58 AM by randomness4
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.These aren't alternative universeries...
They are unique...so it's not quite the same.
But they can still just die off.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.Bergamo was trying to throw Goku off his game by turning the audience against him. He just totally misread how Goku would react to such a pressure.
I'm not sure what to think about the Battle Royal format. Seems like it will be a mess.
I'm expecting Goku to trounce Toppo, which will set up the Grey Trooper trying to avenge him.
Goku being flawed as he is makes sense since he's already based on Sun Wukong, who was a fucking asshole for most of his life both in the mortal realm and in the realm of the gods.
Watch Symphogear![]()
It's been stated a few times on this thread. I think it's from one of the Daizenshuus.
Also:
See, this has got me thinking on something that's been in my head for years:
If you didn't think he'd be a good dad (not that I'm saying Gohan shouldn't exist), or that he should get married, then why did you even do it?
I feel like it didn't really add anything to Goku as a character, and Chi-chi (who wasn't much of a character before hand) was arguably made worse by it in some cases.
As for asshole Goku, I don't know what I want to happen to him in the tournament (or even in this match with Toppo) but I do know that I want it to be interesting.
What really frustrates me about the whole thing is that he hasn't considered how this affects his friends who will be competing with him? Despite his intentions, it's not just him they'll be targeting. It's gonna be a rude awakening when poor Krillin gets shanked again because someone wanted to hurt him to mess with Goku (sure, Goku will stomp that person, but still).
edited 5th Mar '17 7:06:20 AM by HandsomeRob
One Strip! One Strip!

I'm not sure where all the complaints about Goku not justifying himself come from.
Goku relishes a fight. The idea of 70 of the best fighters from 7 different universes ganging up on him makes him happy. Why ruin that?