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HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#43451: Sep 1st 2016 at 1:41:42 PM

Buu only gets the energy when Goku gets hit by Vegeta and takes damage.

Notably, he seemingly didn't get any when Gohan was fighting Dabura because despite the fact that Dabura was doing well due to Gohan's incompetence, Dabura wasn't doing any real damage apparently.

If Goku had jumped to using 3 right away, he could have completely ended the threat without being hurt, and since he had no idea that using it would completely eat up his time, he's got no excuse besides deciding that getting a good fight was more important then saving the world.

One Strip! One Strip!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43452: Sep 1st 2016 at 1:46:08 PM

The energy Goku bleeds out would have to go somewhere, and Babidi could probably absorb it with a spell or something.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#43453: Sep 1st 2016 at 1:55:15 PM

Apparently he couldn't because he was worried about not getting anything from any of them. It's either they hurt each other and he got the energy from that, or nothing, apparently.

LOLypop1224 ...what am I even DOING here? Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
...what am I even DOING here?
#43454: Sep 1st 2016 at 3:42:40 PM

I mean, I just don't look at that entire fight in-universe, because it's so clear Super Saiyan 3 was not a concept Toriyama had thought of during that battle. The whole point was with the Majin boost, Vegeta was actually, finally Goku's equal. He gets closure and that's part of the reason why he decides to sacrifice himself. SSJ 3 ruins that idea so much and I hate it.

The *Legendary* Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant! He is a literal giant f***ing baby!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43455: Sep 1st 2016 at 3:52:00 PM

It only ruins that idea if you let yourself forget that Vegeta's all about enduring punishment from stronger fighters, and Goku knew that he would've had to flat out kill Vegeta to put him down.

Vegeta is Goku's equal - Goku just has a desperation transformation that would put him over Vegeta for a brief period, but at that point, it comes down to whether or not Vegeta can endure a beatdown long enough for Goku's SSJ 3 juice to run out. Vegeta might still win.

edited 1st Sep '16 3:52:14 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#43456: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:07:20 PM

Yeah, I don't think the idea was to validate Vegeta's obsession. He gets closure at the end of the arc when he accepts that Goku is better than him, not when he sells his soul for power. If Vegeta actually achieved his goal by becoming a majin the story would basically reward him for willingly throwing all his character development and that's not cool. In that regard Goku having a whole another transformation on Vegeta works out well.

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#43457: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:10:27 PM

I'm still surprised that, after years of training between Buu and Beerus, Vegeta never managed to gain Super Saiyan 3 himself; seriously, how the fuck are you supposed to get that anyway?

edited 1st Sep '16 4:10:46 PM by Ssj3Gojira

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#43458: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:13:05 PM

It's funny that both GT and Super make Vegeta skip 3 and go straight to a stronger transformation.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#43459: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:26:38 PM

It might not be something you can come up with when you are alive.

Plus, it's pretty ineffective all in all due to the massive power drain.

One Strip! One Strip!
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#43460: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:37:30 PM

Also, I just realize that the scale for the Universe 6 fighters are radically different between the anime and manga; in the anime, Goku absorbed the power of Super Saiyan God into himself, and Beerus flatout says that his Super Saiyan state is just as powerful as his Super Saiyan God form was; if that hasn't changed than Goku and Vegeta's Super Saiyan states are god-level now, 2 and 3 are two to eight times stronger than that, and Blue is some unknown number beyond that. Botamo is immune to any form of physical or ki attack, Assault Frost could keep up with Base Goku (who wasn't really serious), Magetta could tank a Final Flash from Super Saiyan Vegeta, Cabba could rival Vegeta in his Base and God-Level Super Saiyan states, the former of which as we saw is able to beat down Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks through Copy-Vegeta, and Hit is several times stronger than God Goku was back when he fought Beerus; the old 6-10-15 god scale from the movies are also pretty much non-existent now, due to the anime never specifying how much power Beerus actually used, since he was lying the whole time to Goku about using his full power.

Now look at the manga version; in that, Goku never absorbed the power into himself, and instead learned how to become a Super Saiyan God at will; between that, the Base Goku vs Final Form Frieza fight being skipped entirely, and Goku needed Blue to beat Golden Frieza, it's implied that without the god forms, Goku and Vegeta are only slightly to moderately stronger than where they were during the Buu Saga. Beyond Botamo now deflecting attacks more like Luffy would, instead of that whole alternate dimension thing, you now have Frost in his Assault Form keeping up with Goku's base form (which probably would still be weaker than Frieza's full power back on Namek), with his Final Form putting up a much better fight against Goku and Vegeta's Super Saiyan states, though actually doing worse against Piccolo than he did in the anime, Cabba doing pretty much the same against Vegeta's Base and Super Saiyan states, along with Magetta, and Hit at his full power is slightly above the power of Super Saiyan God Goku with Super Saiyan Blue being far stronger than him, with him only really winning against Vegeta due to his lack of knowledge of Hit's Time Leap and him only having access to 10% of his SSB power during that fight.

Ultimately, half of the team in the anime is on the level of gods with Hit being several times stronger than God Goku back in the Battle of Gods Saga, while in the manga only Hit is at the level of the gods, with everyone else either being between Perfect Cell and Majin Buu in power, and that's being generous; hell Manga!Hit might actually be weaker than Golden Frieza was, since in the manga SSB was actually needed to beat him.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43461: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:38:12 PM

Maybe Vegeta doesn't want it because he's still offended over Goku not pulling it out for him.

Yes, I know what I said.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#43462: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:39:51 PM

Why is the Wiki calling them the "Dragon" Team now?

I'm looking through the discussion page right now and it sounds like an arbitrary change. Can't find any evidence of that term being used to describe the group as a whole.

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
alekos23 Since: Mar, 2013
#43463: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:41:26 PM

Golden Fighters sounds either like the good or bad guys of a Sentai show.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43464: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:42:20 PM

Because the Dragon Ball wiki likes making stuff up.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#43465: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:45:28 PM

Also, does anyone notice that Goten's hairstyle during End of Z looks pretty much like Gine's hairstyle?

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43466: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:51:29 PM

If it is, and I'm unwilling to check because I'm lazy, then it's the other way around 'cause, as you should very well know, Goten came first.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#43467: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:52:51 PM

Well Goku and Vegeta are massively powerful now, with base Goku fighting on par with suppressed Beerus, and even making him power up twice and copy Vegeta stomping SSJ 3 Gotenks. Which is in line with what Whis was talking about when they started training. Manga seems to be doing it's own thing.

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#43468: Sep 1st 2016 at 4:59:05 PM

I mean, manga-wise, the power scale isn't as massive as the anime's, where Goku has possibly become thousands to millions of times stronger than he was during the Buu Saga, and that's just for his base state.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
alekos23 Since: Mar, 2013
#43469: Sep 1st 2016 at 5:02:33 PM

Both mediums had the sillyness that was SSG Goku's and Beerus's universe threatening fist bunps.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43470: Sep 1st 2016 at 5:04:57 PM

It's only supremely silly if you let yourself forget that Majin Buu can tear holes in dimensions by screaming really loudly.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#43471: Sep 1st 2016 at 5:05:47 PM

To be fair, the furthest the manga showed were the shockwaves reaching the Sacred Realm of the Kais, unlike the anime that showed planet-wide storms, asteroids and planets turning into subatomic particles, and the clash between Goku and Beerus' attacks turning into a singularity that would have consumed reality. Either way, Goku probably just learn how to limit the destruction of his attacks in his God forms, just like everyone else does to avoid blowing up the planet when they fight.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43472: Sep 1st 2016 at 5:07:32 PM

The Sacred Realm of the Kais is in the freaking Afterlife. The Supreme Planet is outside the goddamn universe.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#43473: Sep 1st 2016 at 5:10:21 PM

...dude, the Sacred World of the Kais is what the home of the Supreme Kais is called, and in its entirety it's a tenth of the size of the universe.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
alekos23 Since: Mar, 2013
#43474: Sep 1st 2016 at 5:12:49 PM

Toriyama needs a book on thhe scale of things.Maybe that neat website would help.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#43475: Sep 1st 2016 at 5:13:04 PM

It's always been the Supreme Planet for me.

But what I can't remember is whether it was inside the globe or outside. I know that it's in a place where no mortal can possibly get to it, but I can't remember if it was inside the globe representing the whole of all dimensions or outside.

[up]Loads and loads of writers need a book on scale, whether it be on size or even stuff like speed or force.

Writers Have No Sense of Scale.

edited 1st Sep '16 5:13:51 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

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