Before you start feeling uncomfortable about Master Roshi fondling a 16-year-old girl, you should be aware that the age of consent in many parts of Japan is actually 13 years old.
Now you can feel uncomfortable.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.....
Well. I'm done with this argument.
~Throws up hands in disgust~
And if you all know what's good for you, you'll follow me.
One Strip! One Strip!I would argue that it being legally considered age of consent actually makes it more creepy, because it's not just Roshi being creepy, it's nationally-endorsed creepiness.
Being Master Roshi is legally acceptable in Japan. And That's Terrible.
edited 22nd Dec '13 7:50:59 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Well, when he's not a horrible pervert, he's a legitimate Martial Artist, who taught Goku and Krillin some important lessons, is one of the few people to be the former in a fight, and helped Tenshihan find a new path beyond being an Assassin.
He also put out Fire Mountain(yes, he destroyed the whole place, but Ox-King just fixed that shit anyway), which at the time was one of the most impressive acts in the series.
He just happens to be a horrible pervert, and unfortunately, as everyone got stronger, that was really all he had left.
One Strip! One Strip!@#4168
Oh, right Bardock may have brushed away his son when he saw his power level, and Vegeta (Cell Saga) may have been the cause of Trunks' Daddy Issues but even THEY would NEVER make their kids study. Those FIENDS!!! Yep, it's official.
edited 23rd Dec '13 5:46:06 AM by karynnm
Vegeta gets a sort of free pass on being a bad father because there's nothing significant about it. It's not that people ignore his bad dad qualities; it's that he's already pretty clearly established to be an absolutely terrible person, and being a bad father is just another side of that. There's nothing surprising about a man whose primary character traits are cruelty, arrogance, and a complete willingness to murder anyone and everyone between him and glory, turning out to be a terrible father.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
That may be true, but that doesn't mean that parents who do far less damage than him should be villanized more.
I thought Bardock and Vegeta in the Cell Saga were far worse than Chi-Chi, and take a very good guess on who gets the most criticism and villanizing. I won't mention Goku because he gets fairly criticized even more than the two I mentioned.
What the OP of that is trying to say is that fans try to make Vegeta and Bardock look like Father of the Year and trying to sugarcoat them, ignoring their mistakes, while Chi-Chi stopped smothering her kids, and fans still see her as an abusive mother and an outright horrible person.
edited 23rd Dec '13 7:02:52 AM by MsCC93
I don't think they are villainized more, just differently. Vegeta and Bardock are genocidal mass-murderers. If the worst that could be said about them is that they're bad parents, many lives would still be here today. Nobody cares when they're a bad parent because they do so much other awful shit.
By contrast, being an angry mom is the worst thing that can be said about Chi Chi. That is the lowest point of her bad qualities. Due to the extent of their other crimes, Vegeta and Bardock being bad dads is the Jaywalking of Arson, Murder, and Jaywalking as far as those characters are concerned, but for Chi Chi, that's it.
Assuming we're not talking about the fans who Draco in Leather Pants these characters, because there will never be logic to that. I admit, the only time I've ever seen Vegeta suggested to be a good parent is when talking about Buu Saga Vegeta, and that seems to be based entirely off the scene where he offers to take Trunks - either to the amusement park or ice cream, I forget which - if he does well in his training, and the scene where he blows himself up in an attempt to take back his Majin Vegeta mistake by killing Buu. While both of these are good examples of parenting, there was also that time when he made said mistake in the first place, trying to cast away his family to become narmtastically evil again.
Some people probably just don't take that scene seriously because, honestly, it's hard to be taken seriously when you're shouting lines like, "I wanted Babidi to REAWAKEN THE EVIL WITHIN MY HEART!!!" But he did, and it can't just be ignored.
edited 23rd Dec '13 7:34:31 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Agreed. At worst, Chi-Chi is just annoying and she does smother Gohan, but it doesn't hinder his self-confidence or anything.
And yes, I was talking about the fans, the whole time. Even on this very wiki, Vegeta and Bardock are listed under the Draco in Leather Pants trope, and fans even defend their bad parenting, but before I joined this website, I saw a shoehorned example of Chi-Chi on the Abusive Parents trope page (it was deleted though). Heck the whole "whitewashing"/"demonizing" of characters is what makes me dislike the DBZ fandom.
Honestly, to me, the only decent pair of parents on the show are Android 18 and Krillin.
Sorry to have annoyed you. Yes, it's just an anime show, but I love ranting about these things because I'm just that much of a media nerd lol.
edited 23rd Dec '13 8:29:12 AM by MsCC93
Annoyed? You didn't annoy me, and I hope no one else was annoyed, because it's a fair question.
Also, if you think the whitewashing and demonizing of characters here is bad, you should see the Ranma fandom.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Why is "Cell Saga Vegeta" being labeled as the bad dad here? Buu Saga Vegeta is still an awful father and person in general, what with punching his son (must be a saiyan thing), nearly killing his wife, screwing over the world because "waaah my power level isn't as high as Kakarot's", getting his son and wife killed in the process, refusing an easy way to save his son and wife because he "wanted the Earthlings to solve their own problems" (even though Majin Buu is his mess), etc.
edited 23rd Dec '13 12:42:16 PM by sockpuppet1
Eh. He's softer by Buu Saga. For one, he genuinely felt bad for hitting Trunks in the face. Cell-Saga Vegeta would've just punched him again.
My various fanfics.Let's change the subject....does anyone read any fanworks...I found one
in particular that was VERY hilarious and I do think it would happen if it were canon.
I know it's old, but this subject interests me.
Saiyan culture is primarily battle-focused, so Bardock losing interest in Goku when he had a low power level and will be shipped to a new planet is perfectly normal for a Saiyan. King Vegeta did the same to Tarble. When it came to his strong son, Vegeta, he was willing to fight Frieza himself for him. Vegeta was raised in Saiyan society and saw Trunks as weak. He got over his issues eventually.
It's not that those three are bad parents, it's that their culture is fundamentally different.
"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Yeah, the subject is pretty old (I actually tried to change it).
I was just asking about the Draco in Leather Pants and the Ron the Death Eater that fans do regarding other characters brand of parenting. I know it's not real, but I just found it unfair to single out one character and call them abusive, while glorifying someone who did even worse than them.
edited 23rd Dec '13 7:50:55 PM by MsCC93
I wish King Vegeta was more popular. Each time we see a glimpse of him there's more dimensions added to his character. Bot G, for example, showed he was willing to swallow his pride (this is the guy that named a planet after himself) for his people.
But noooooo, we need Bardock going back in time and turning Super Saiyan lololololol
"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."I really do wish we had more to go on for King Vegeta besides "Vegeta with a beard."
My various fanfics.Sayains take the term "Family resemblence" to an extreme.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.I understand, but with Bardock and Goku, we see a definite difference. Bardock is, for all intents and purposes, a soldier. He's not a hero, he doesn't have any great sense of altruism or real care for the greater good (most of his actions in his movie are driven by revenge), and he's not even that particularly powerful. He's just your average saiyan. Basically the opposite of Goku without being outright evil. (That'd be Turles)
My various fanfics.

He was convinced that someone would try and rob his castle, and stayed to guard it twenty-four seven, despite the fact that it was constantly on fire.
Ox-King is neither smart nor sane.
Plus, she killed a god-damn dinosaur with both of those weapons, and that's just the one we saw. How do you know there isn't a pile of corpses and ashes in her wake.
.....I have no real argument for the bikini. Maybe she chose that.
One Strip! One Strip!