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HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#3976: Dec 14th 2013 at 8:27:07 AM

[up][up]

I'm looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the series Saiga.

[up]Pretty much yeah.

On a separate note, I re-watching the ep where the Gang decides to start training to fight the Androids; I always felt the logic behind waiting three years for the Androids to show up was questionable.

Goku's point that he hasn't done anything yet doesn't really hold up, because Gero was part of the Red Ribbon army, who killed and hurt a lot of people in their quest for making Commander Red taller WORLD DOMINATION, and he should be held responsible for that. More to the point, they could have used the Dragon balls to tell them where he was so they could smash all his shit before he got very far with it instead of waiting.

However, I think Krillin made a better point about why they should do things that way. Most of them were enemies of Goku when they met him, and eventually became his allies. He specifically mentions Vegeta (alongside Piccolo) when point this out; Fighting the greater threat of the Anrdoids will eliminate the later threat of Vegeta through long term Enemy Mine.

And it worked too. Vegeta had already lost much of his motivation (immortality, and defeating Freeza) as a result of his association with Goku, and then he had Trunks with Bulma, and really only needed to admit to himself that he was no longer who he was before (that took longer, but it did happen eventually).

…..So….. No, that's stupid, they still should have gone after the Androids right then and there, but I kinda sorta see a possible point to it. Not enough to justify it, so I guess this was a waste of time.

One Strip! One Strip!
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#3977: Dec 14th 2013 at 9:14:20 AM

Goku's logic is weird, in that he really likes giving people a chance to make a Heel–Face Turn down the line, which has...well, mixed results.

Not killing Vegeta wound up being the only reason anybody survived Namek. Not killing Frieza...well, it bit him, but at least Frieza had the courtesy to bite him five seconds later rather than coming back to do it somewhere down the line - which he also did, but that wasn't about Goku sparing him, he was rebuilt with spare parts. Not killing Gero is a weird example, because we got Androids 16, 17, and 18 out of that decision, but that's only a good thing in one of the two timelines, and it's the one in which they knowingly made the decision. Not killing Fat Buu, again, weird example because on the one hand, Fat Buu did make a Heel–Face Turn, but on the other hand, a greater evil arose from it, so...yeah.

The decision to spare Vegeta is probably the most unambiguous example, in which it has just as little justification and yet the most inarguably positive outcome of any of Goku's "Let him live!" moments.

edited 14th Dec '13 9:15:26 AM by TobiasDrake

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HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#3978: Dec 14th 2013 at 9:28:52 AM

Well I suppose it's because most of his friends consist of people who were once his enemies, so I guess he figures everyone deserves that chance.

Hell, Goku himself was meant to be an enemy of earth, and only avoided that fate through a lucky head injury (never expected to say something like that), so perhaps he feels that everyone deserves the chance that he got by accident.

One Strip! One Strip!
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#3979: Dec 14th 2013 at 10:12:11 AM

I normally don't read opinion blogs, but I think I'll read what you're doing, Saiga. Would also help my own understanding of the series.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3980: Dec 14th 2013 at 3:17:15 PM

Freeza leads the Planet Trade Organization, which kind of blends him being a galactic emperor with being a real estate broker. Some of the elements from the Saiyan arc exposition seem to be retconned out, however, as Raditz mentions that they auction the planets they sell instead of just handing them over to Freeza, and some other minor things.

edited 14th Dec '13 4:08:41 PM by Saiga

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#3981: Dec 14th 2013 at 4:05:11 PM

Why does Frieza bother selling planets? Why not just take the money rather than hand over a planet for it? If he has enough power to go unchallenged, it seems like an unnecessary middleman.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3982: Dec 14th 2013 at 4:32:49 PM

From the manga, he might not actually sell the planets. That part is from the Saiyan arc, and could be retconned out. He might just rule over them, as "Freeza no. 79" implies.

Dunno. I'm going to need to check up on that. Alternatively, if he does sell then, it could just be that he likes the image as a businessman rather than a tyrant.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#3983: Dec 14th 2013 at 6:48:01 PM

Could be he just doesn't want to deal with all the responsibility of governance. Being a tyrant is a lot of work, all the time. Why even bother with it if he's already living like a king anyway?

edited 14th Dec '13 6:48:25 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
sockpuppet1 Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#3984: Dec 15th 2013 at 11:58:26 AM

So Saiga, will you be reviewing all the way from the very start, with just Goku and Bulma? I ask because many fans aren't familiar with those parts, and those that are usually don't like them very much. I see Dragon Ball as we know it starting at the King Piccolo arc.

And you're reviewing volume by volume? So that'll come out to 26 blog posts, yes?

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3985: Dec 15th 2013 at 4:56:26 PM

42 blog posts (16 Dragon Ball / 26 Z) and yeah I'm going right back to the start.

I was supposed to updated yesterday, but I ended up not being home. So I'll have to do that later tonight.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#3986: Dec 15th 2013 at 5:42:55 PM

So we should expect merciless mocking of Yamcha then should we?

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Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#3987: Dec 15th 2013 at 5:44:06 PM

It's not expected. It's required. waii

Watch Symphogear
sockpuppet1 Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#3988: Dec 15th 2013 at 8:57:04 PM

I will complain if there is not at least one Yamcha joke per volume he appears in.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#3989: Dec 15th 2013 at 9:59:30 PM

I have said it before, and I will say it again:

You all enjoy mocking that dude too much. The entire Dragon Ball fandom enjoys it a little too much.

It's an unhealthy addiction.

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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3990: Dec 15th 2013 at 10:00:25 PM

No, the problem is that you don't enjoy it enough.smile

FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#3991: Dec 15th 2013 at 10:15:41 PM

Dude, people don't mock Tristan from Yu Gi Oh as much.

And I don't think he accomplished anything after the Pegasus arc. Yamcha had a baseball career for pete's sake. Probably the only Z-Fighter to ever make any real money.

edited 15th Dec '13 10:16:20 PM by FOFD

sockpuppet1 Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#3992: Dec 15th 2013 at 10:29:51 PM

The fact that he uses his powers to compete against muggles for some extra cash just makes him seem more pathetic grin Also, pretty much all of the Z-fighters except Tien, Piccolo, and Chiaotzu are likely richer than Yamcha:

Bulma: owner of the largest corporation on Earth and a super-genius.

Vegeta: has Bulma.

Goku/Chi Chi: have a freaking castle.

18/Krillin: have money extorted from Mr. Satan

Mr. Buu- tournament winner and Mr. Satan's best bud.

edited 15th Dec '13 10:31:35 PM by sockpuppet1

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3993: Dec 15th 2013 at 10:31:25 PM

Getting fired isn't an accomplishment, either.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#3994: Dec 16th 2013 at 6:12:58 AM

See, this is the thing. People don't just make fun of him for legitimately failing. They bend over backwards to twist anything he's done to make him an even bigger loser than he already is, and they do it with glee.

I guess that yeah, I don't really find it funny, hence my criticism of it. I kinda wish I could just sit back and enjoy it, but I think it's just a bit too much.

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#3995: Dec 16th 2013 at 8:58:07 AM

I thought the anime made up his baseball career to make him seem less pathetic.

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SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#3996: Dec 16th 2013 at 9:49:23 AM

But it only made him MORE pathetic, because starting fights with normal assholes is the only way he can win.

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Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#3997: Dec 16th 2013 at 12:02:08 PM

Actually, Goku and Chichi's form of income started coming from Hercule after Gohan and Videl got married if I remember correctly, also Yamcha being in a baseball team was something Toriyama came up with for the anime, like he did for Gregory.

edited 16th Dec '13 12:02:23 PM by Ssj3Gojira

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Nikkolas from Texas Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#3998: Dec 16th 2013 at 12:16:40 PM

Keep telling you guys, he's got this awesome theme song.

Where's Krillin's badass theme song? Eh? What? I don't hear anything.

Krillin is the Tristan of DBZ. Yamcha is more like Duke Devlin.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#3999: Dec 16th 2013 at 12:40:42 PM

All of his accomplishments in Dragon Ball prime notwithstanding, in Z, Krillin killed three Saibamen simultaneously, contributed to both Nappa's and Vegeta's defeat, helped save Dende from Dodoria, distracted Second Form Frieza, and helped Vegeta abuse his Near-Death Power-Up Bullshit.

The last noteworthy thing Yamcha ever died was coming back from getting killed by a Saibaman only to be effortlessly oneshotted by the weakest Android in the entire Cell Saga, while being unceremoniously dumped by his longtime girlfriend so she could marry the man responsible for his death, because apparently even his friends consider that a public service.

Seriously, Yamcha is the whipping boy of the entire franchise.

edited 16th Dec '13 12:43:52 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Nikkolas from Texas Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#4000: Dec 16th 2013 at 1:13:50 PM

The only time Krillin had even a shot at doing any real damage to Nappa was with the Kienzan. Otherwise, he and Piccoo and the rest never stood a chance against him. The other things you mentioned were also just "you happen to be here" feats. He happened to be the only one alive who Goku could give the Spirit Bomb. he happened to be the only one who could hurt Vegeta. And big lot of good that did BTW.

As for Bulma marrying Vegeta, that's because Vegeta is a shit character and DBZ is badly written.

And speaking of being badly written, Krillin could have KILLED Freeza after blinding him with the Solar Flare. So...yeah, there goes all the good will you can give him. Fucker had the best chance at killing Freeza out of anyone save Goku and he didn't do it.

edited 16th Dec '13 1:15:39 PM by Nikkolas


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