To be fair, Goku isn't that much of a Blood Knight when you get right to it; how many times did he come to the aid of people he had just met when he had the chance to? He helped out Turtle, Chi-Chi and the Ox King, Suno, hell, the entire reason he took down the Red Ribbon Army was so that he could get the Dragon Ball they had, just so that he could use them to bring Bora back to life for Upa's sake. Really, the Blood Knight thing only became really prominent during the Z portion of the series.
Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!I think this quote from the character page makes the most sense:
Yanno, one of the problems of saying 'According to Toriyama', is that unless you give a link to it, you can say anything and not get believed.
I could just as easily say that according to Toriyama, Dragon Ball is a series about potatoes.
himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimariWell it's mostly because the link didn't transfer when I copy/pasted it.
For the record, here's the interview.
That's only partially correct.
Though I'd say it's more about all vegetables...not just potatoes.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.That's not very accurate. Goku lets Vegeta go purely because he wants to fight him in the future. He attempts to do the same for Freeza, telling him to go train so he can become a better challenge. The part about him being not giving up against Freeza because he's motivated by protecting his friends is also from the anime, not the manga.
x4 I only just now realized what was happening.
Though...it's weird you were defending Goku not being a Blood Knight when I was accidentally referring to Trunks as one.
What I meant by calling Goku the Trunks of the future is that Goku will fight to defeat the current threat no matter how helpless it seems at first...then he comes back and wins.
edited 4th Jun '16 11:14:10 PM by randomness4
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.Trunks is called a Badass because he heck Frieza to pieces. When you actually looked at him, he isn't really that impressive compared to the other hybrids Saiyans. He fought the androids for years, yet he was only around Namek Saga Goku's level (at least in the manga). He also got two years in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, and still came out weaker than Goku and Gohan who did less than a year, and only 'surpass' Vegeta by using the crippling Ultra Super Saiyan form. On top of that, he less 'Badass' present counterpart is stronger than him at the same age during a time of peace. Not saying that I don't like Trunks, but I think the fandom overrates him and his Badass creed.
Also, Trunks running for help really isn't that much different than Gohan, especially if in the time between the Cell Games in this event he didn't become much stronger. We will see, but it's funny that slacker Gohan is still way ahead of him despite the fandom giving him endless crap for not training.
Also, six months may seem short, but Vegeta and Goku did very specific training. It was as easy as some seems to think, Goku and Vegeta should have reached god energy on their own since they trained for years non-stop.
And, Uub is severely underuse. To say that he brings nothing new is just unfair since no has done anything with him. He is reborn version of Kid Buu who has shown learning techniques from watching them and has the ability to grow at a fast rate. There is plenty that can be done with him, especially I can see him taking a more superhero route like Gohan.
Edit: Just wanted to say, he didn't spare Frieza so he can return to fight him. He spared Frieza because he saw letting him live with his pride shatter as a better punishment than killing him. Basically, Cruel Mercy. And even then, he gave Frieza energy because Frieza begged for his life when he wanted to leave him to die.
edited 4th Jun '16 11:33:14 PM by Ramona122003
You're not only judging by his power...and feats.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.We can't make much of a judgement on Trunks running to help in Super. I thought you were talking about doing so in the Android arc, which is where I think his decision was completely understandable.
I know he's not the ultimate badass - that's what makes him so compelling. But he has done a number of really impressive things, like getting over 50x stronger in three years with no-one to train him (going off the manga). Namek arc Goku is still an incredibly high level.
Anyway, it doesn't matter how special the training is - it's still possible for Gohan to do it. I'm not saying his independent training would produce the same result.
Besides, Whis' super-special-training is nothing but a narrative convenience anyway.
edited 4th Jun '16 11:29:55 PM by Saiga
That narration convenient is true for any story.
Yes, I was referring to Super's storyline where Trunks returns for help. According to some, Gohan is irresponsible for not getting stronger to protect the Earth. Depending on how the next episode plays out, the same can be said about Trunks if he's not much stronger compared to what he was during the Cell Games. It holds even more true for him since he is literally the last line of defense.
Gohan in theory can become stronger than Goku and Vegeta, but reaching god energy is not that easy. If it was, Goku and Vegeta would have done it years ago since they do nothing but trained. It says something that Whis made Goku and Vegeta stronger and a few months than they every did in a decade.
Edit: Also wanted to add that in the Saiyan Saga, Goku wanted to become stronger to fight the Saiyans and save his friends. When King Kai told him he was going to be a day late, he freaks out because everyone will be dead, not because he was afraid of missing a fight. Yeah, he did spare Vegeta, but before then he was doing everything in his power to kill the guy. Goku even acknowledges he was being selfish for asking Krillin to spare him.
edited 4th Jun '16 11:43:11 PM by Ramona122003
What I'm saying is that is not a good excuse because that only exists as a means for them to get stronger.
Also, we don't know how much time has passed in Trunks' timeline because it's an alternate timeline. In the Android arc, eight months passed there before he returned to the past, three years after his first trip. Furthermore, unlike Gohan, we have no idea what his limits are and he might not have been able to become stronger.
It's not that simple. The training they were doing was not going to lead them to God forms because they weren't aware of them and weren't aiming for them. But someone who does know, can teach them. The same could be taught to Gohan.
It wouldn't really matter how much time has passed...Trunks can only get stronger through self-training and that's just not as efficient.
He can master FP SSJ, but that's about it.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.According to sources, 17 years have past since Trunks defeated the androids. So, there really isn't an excuse for him not to be much stronger, unless he was too busy doing other things, like rebuilding the world. We also do have a clue of his limits. Present Trunks is stronger than him at the same age and he is considered a prodigy. He may no have the same upper limit as Gohan, but if Trunks is anything like his present counterpart, he has it within him to surpass his father if he trains. Honestly, Trunks should be at least a Super Saiyan 2 since he saw Gohan ascend and know that the level exists. I will be shocked if he couldn't do it.
Also, Vegeta was aware of Super Saiyan God after seeing Goku do it and trained. When Whis saw him again, he tells Vegeta that although he has gotten stronger he will never surpass Goku because the method he was using was right. Gohan can be taught and may learned even faster than Goku and Vegeta, but it take months of dedicated, constant, and hard training.
SSJ 3 Gojira, are you referring to me? I mentioned the original fight with Frieza because Saiga said that Goku spared Frieza to fight him again. In their first fight, that isn't true. He spares Frieza out of Cruel Mercy. He actually tells Frieza that he never wanted to see him again.
edited 4th Jun '16 11:53:45 PM by Ramona122003
I have already acknowledged Goku cares about his friends. He doesn't want them to die. But he does not put their safety before a good fight, and when he shows his desire to protect them it also goes hand-in-hand with fighting someone strong.
No, he does tell Freeza (twice) to go train and come back stronger. Shattering his pride is definitely part of it, but he stopped when he decided the battle wouldn't be fun for him anymore.
It's completely fair. He doesn't have anything new from the characters he is a pastiche of, and Boo's ability to copy techniques is seriously underwhelming when several characters have already done that. Besides, that's Boo. Oob may be his reincarnation but he doesn't have his physiology so he's lost the most interesting part of Boo.
I think he has potential as another fighter in the cast. But I haven't seen a damn thing that makes him look like a good fit for the main character role.
In the anime.
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We don't know present Trunks' limits either, or if he really is stronger than Future Trunks (that's pure speculation).
And Vegeta knew of Super Saiyan God. He couldn't reach that with his training. Guess what? He couldn't reach that in Whis' training other. Both Goku and Vegeta had to discover a new form through Whis' training.
Months of hard training is totally doable for Gohan because months are a miniscule unit of time.
edited 4th Jun '16 11:55:12 PM by Saiga
That's not true at all. Regardless of how you personally feel, there is a manga and both anime and manga are just adaptations of Toriyama's script. And the following episodes are essentially filler!
So, I should have rephrased: it's not even that base Vegeta is that strong in the anime. He's that strong in some anime exclusive content which doesn't necessarily have bearing on the arcs that are adapted from Toriyama's script.

Having the foolishly foolish courage to repeatedly take on threats stronger than him makes him the Goku of the future...then he defeats Cell and protects the future "forever".
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.