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Cider The Final ECW Champion from Not New York Since: May, 2009 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
The Final ECW Champion
#3676: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:25:35 PM

Really? In Battle Of The Gods they actually spend more time hitting each other than they do playing laser tag. The animation is on a whole nother level of quality. Vegeta does not have that stupid haircut. Dare I say the jokes it told were actually funny?

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Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#3677: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:30:47 PM

Also, Battle of the Gods at least corrected the mistake of giving Gohan Super Saiyan back, unlike GT.

Though really, from what I've heard Battle of the Gods sounds really stupid compared to the other Dragonball movies. While Goku was always the one to save the day in those, at least he wasn't literally a god above everyone else, and the villain at least always had minions for the jobbers to fight.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#3678: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:34:59 PM

I sure hope there isn't a scene where Goku exclaims that he is the "Super Saiyan God".

That's gonna sound Narmy as hell in English.

edited 28th Sep '13 8:35:25 PM by FOFD

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#3679: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:35:39 PM

Except even when Goku is a god It's the only time in the franchises history where he ever loses against an antagonist when giving it his all.

And even then, there's a Sequel Hook inside where Bills said There are 12 universes, the Current Dragonball verse being the seventh one.

edited 28th Sep '13 8:35:52 PM by Demongodofchaos2

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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3680: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:37:07 PM

Gohan still goes Super Saiyan in BoG, just not during the fight. And that being even partially corrected was thanks to fans calling the scriptwriter out on it.

I don't care that the battles involved less ki attacks, I like ki attacks. Don't care for the gags. And although they don't have the all the same mistakes as GT (Vegeta's hair), they have plenty of new ones.

I really don't care for the gags.

[up] Wrong. He's lost plenty of times before. Against Tao Pai Pai, against Cell, against Vegeta, against Roshi, against Tenshinhan, etc...

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#3681: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:39:34 PM

No, I mean lose to the point where he doesn't manage to make a complete comeback and eventually surpass them in power. Bills didn't even use 70% of his power.

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Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#3682: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:41:50 PM

Yeah, I know Goku loses, but he's still the only person to really do anything, pretty much.

You know, a lot of people seem to dislike Movie 7 since it's literally just a movie-length fight scene with no semblance of plot or anything, but I think that's part of why I actually like it. The movie promised a fight of three Super Saiyans vs. three androids, and it delivered. tongue

AND Vegeta and Trunks got to actually do stuff, even destroy their opponents. Goku pretty much spent the film getting his ass kicked by 13 until the Spirit Bomb.

edited 28th Sep '13 8:42:57 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3683: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:42:35 PM

Yes, but Goku didn't surpass Roshi, Tenshinhan, Vegeta or Cell until the next arc. In future follow-ups to BoG, the same thing will happen with Goku surpassing Beers.

[up] I also like it, don't know why. I think I like them being attacked out of nowhere on an "off" day and also the fighting taking place at a glacier.

edited 28th Sep '13 8:43:36 PM by Saiga

theweirdKiddokun What a Wonderful World! from Last Place in the Race Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
What a Wonderful World!
#3684: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:46:05 PM

Well I feel while GT had good ideas it was boggle down by its horrible execution. While BOG has good execution it had some questionable ideas.

The Reaper Games starts anew.
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#3685: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:47:23 PM

The fact that they fight on a glacier makes it really cool, too, both literally and figuratively.

Also, by the end, Goku is responsible for raising the world's ocean levels with all the melting and destruction that happens.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3686: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:47:45 PM

For me it's shitty ideas AND execution for GT, and shitty ideas for BoG, and from what I've seen, shitty execution. I haven't seen the full movie yet, though.

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#3687: Sep 28th 2013 at 8:49:18 PM

The final fight is pretty darn boss, though.

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Cider The Final ECW Champion from Not New York Since: May, 2009 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
The Final ECW Champion
#3688: Sep 28th 2013 at 9:24:51 PM

To me, all the fights were pretty standard dragon ball stuff (as in, miles above all the fights in GT). In GT, Goku and the Earth Dragon would go at it for twenty seconds then spend fifteen minutes talking. It was worse than even the most dragged out scenes in Z, where at least there would usually be some decent brawling in between dialogs.

There is nothing in Battle of the Gods like Goku getting his eyes stabbed out and then miraculously getting them back again for no reason. Nothing like him running out of power and desperately hiding from Nova only to pull SS 4 out of nowhere like the previous half hour never happened. Definitely nothing along the lines of discovering how your brilliant beam spam strategy has been doing nothing but make the enemy stronger and concluding the best way to go about it with that knowledge is to keep beam spamming.

Then again, for all my bashing of TOEI there movies are usually alright. Even GT's movie was watchable, much more watchable than the episodic series it was tied to. I will admit battle of the gods was not one of their more eventful movies, feeling less like a movie and more like a longer episode of the show when it was still on the first 13 volumes or so and had not gotten horrendously slow yet. The kind of quality episodes the show should have been able to maintain with an extra large animation budget for the big screen. It probably was not one of the better movies done, but miles beyond GT.

Oh, and this retread through the Dragon Ball comics has made me realize something. I still findDr. Slump funnier. Now I can kind of understand why Toriyama was a little bummed Dragon Ball became the runaway success. Then again, maybe he just does not like long projects in general. "This was supposed to be a simple manga about an old man and a tank!"

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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3689: Sep 28th 2013 at 9:26:56 PM

There is nothing in Battle of the Gods like Goku getting his eyes stabbed out and then miraculously getting them back again for no reason. Nothing like him running out of power and desperately hiding from Nova only to pull SS 4 out of nowhere like the previous half hour never happened.

Except for retaining Super Saiyan God's power, and miraculously getting it back out of nowhere, you mean?

MikeBreezy92 Storm King Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: Noddin' my head like yeah
Storm King
#3690: Sep 28th 2013 at 10:06:40 PM

Who's to say you can't keep the form after you gain it?

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Cider The Final ECW Champion from Not New York Since: May, 2009 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
The Final ECW Champion
#3691: Sep 28th 2013 at 10:07:44 PM

That was acknowledged as out of the ordinary by the observers and used to establish Goku's genius. The GT stuff mentioned just happened without meaningful notice or significance in continuity.

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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
sockpuppet1 Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#3693: Sep 29th 2013 at 3:15:17 AM

So then they explicitly say "the result is greater"?

Yes.

Chapter 501

Elder Kaioshin: Here! Put this Potara on your left ear! [ ] Put the other one on Gohan’s ear. Just by doing that, you two will be able to merge together! Like with Fusion.

Goku: Huh! Re-really!?

Elder Kaioshin: Of course. And what’s more, the result is greater than with Fusion!

And that's not even getting into the dozens of statements that state Potara > dance in a more indirect way, which come from numerous characters, like Buu, Goku, Gohan, and Vegetto himself. I can bring those up too if you'd like.

Vegetto >>>>>>>> Gogeta many times over. The end.

Except even when Goku is a god It's the only time in the franchises history where he ever loses against an antagonist when giving it his all.

Uh... no...

He's lost tons of times while giving his all and never beat the guy who trashed him. Cell and Buu are the biggest examples. He got beaten fairly easily and gave up hope, leaving the job of saving the world to someone else.

No, I mean lose to the point where he doesn't manage to make a complete comeback and eventually surpass them in power. Bills didn't even use 70% of his power.

From a story perspective, it doesn't matter if he surpasses them by the next arc if he never actually beats them. That's the case with Cell and Buu.

Goku never even came close to surpassing Super Buu (except with the temporary power up that he lost at the end of BOG... and that being stronger than Super Buu is even kind of debteable) and never became so superior to Pure Buu (who is MUCH weaker than Super Buu, yet still beat Goku handily) that he thought he could comfortably beat him.

At the tournament at the EOZ, he thought that there was a chance he could lose to a version of Pure Buu that didn't have enhanced stamina, regeneration, magic, body manipulation, and technique copying... you know, Uub. Which would obviously mean he'd still lose to the original Pure Buu, who had all those abilities (he might be stronger than Buu, but not enough to actually win against the real Pure Buu who beat him). BOG isn't at all unique in this respect.

edited 29th Sep '13 3:15:38 AM by sockpuppet1

Cider The Final ECW Champion from Not New York Since: May, 2009 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
The Final ECW Champion
#3694: Sep 29th 2013 at 6:52:21 AM

It is still something acknowledged in the story used to demonstrate something about a character as opposed to a handicap that disappears for no reason without explanation or surprise. Battle Of The Gods is still better than Dragon Ball GT in that respect.

From Nappa onwards absolute worst thing about the dragon ball show was how much time characters would essentially stay in one spot doing nothing. The excuse given for this is that they were dragging it out for more comics to be done, not a good excuse but an excuse nonetheless and come GT the same thing is being done even though TOEI should have nothing to wait on. In Battle of the gods one can argue things draw on, but at least in between scene transitions we see the characters move on to different things. They fill out the time to the final fight by trying lots of different things and getting into lots of different hijinks on their way to the climax.

At most, I could see an argument as to why it is worse than GT's movie, a film I never really got the hate for as it is cute and gets straight to the point, both are still far and above every single GT episode.

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Fizzo Supervillain from Brazil Since: Jun, 2010
Supervillain
#3695: Sep 29th 2013 at 8:53:53 AM

What I liked about the Super Sayan God is it isn't a power up achieved by training that only Goku in the series can get, but eventually the other sayans will get by the next battle. it's just a damn ritual, is clear from the moment they discover the nature of the transformation that any sayan in that party could become God if they wanted by very little effort and no training at all. And that's different from every other power up in the series. It's not about Goku being more awesome in training than everyone else, is about he doing a ritual that anyone else could do. Prefer this way more than the Super Sayan 4 (altought, the idea of the Super Sayan 4 is one of the few things I like in GT).

Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
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#3696: Oct 2nd 2013 at 2:58:11 PM

Watched the movie. It was so-so at best.

I'll gloss over them massive retcon that Bills. There are some bigger problems.

Like the biggest being that most of the movie involves no fighting. The entire middle part is just nothing but padding.

And god, the use of fake 3D is final battle was awful. If you can't do it right, don't do it at all.

And what's with Goku actually doing better once he stopped being SSG? That was weird.

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#3697: Oct 2nd 2013 at 3:05:06 PM

He absorbed the power into himself, making his base power stronger then it originally was.

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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#3698: Oct 2nd 2013 at 3:07:10 PM

Beers outright said he was weaker even after absorbing the power, and yet he fairs better. It's weird.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#3699: Oct 2nd 2013 at 3:20:56 PM

Maybe Beers was drunk on himself.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Cider The Final ECW Champion from Not New York Since: May, 2009 Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
The Final ECW Champion
#3700: Oct 2nd 2013 at 4:33:33 PM

Bils...Beers now? Was confused by the instant transmission. His face is human enough to show the expression.

Rereading Dr. Slump, I realized Akira Toriyama can draw more than six faces (on men anyway).

But a bigger question might be, where was Arale during King Piccolo, Nappa, Vegeta, Cell and Majin Buu? She could have handled the first three and they were all on television so she must have seen them. She might not have been able to beat Cell or Buu but I find it hard to believe she died in the human extinction attack.

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