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Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36801: Mar 31st 2016 at 8:42:07 AM

Technically, there's over 160 characters in Xenoverse, but 21 slots for Goku might be a bit much.

Seriously, there's 21 versions of Goku post DLC.

edited 31st Mar '16 8:42:28 AM by Rinsankajugin

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#36802: Mar 31st 2016 at 8:43:59 AM

Those are costume and Super Move changes though, I wouldn't count the way Xenoverse does variations as separate characters. They have the same melee kit and animations.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#36803: Mar 31st 2016 at 8:48:47 AM

[up][up][up] True. For instance, a concise roster usually only has Recoome and Captain Ginyu because Jeice, Guldo, and Burter didn't get much action. Of the three, IIRC Guldo is more likely to be included than Jeice and Burter because at least he got to show off a few techniques in a fight that didn't revolve around being curbstomped effortlessly by his opponent. Recoome and Ginyu actually got to show off and be impressive.

To that end, if a game had to cut some of Frieza's forms, I could see replacing First Form with Second. Third Form had no real reason to even exist at all and First Form spent 90% of its screentime sitting in a floating bubble car letting other people fight, but Second Form spent a lot of time participating in the action - and, in a pinch, can be used to stand in for King Cold. <.<

For my own reasons, I would want to see a few more female characters included in a game's roster. Zangya, Chi-Chi, Selipa, SKOT, etc. I'd even take Jetpack Bulma. But I freely admit that it's not because Dragon Ball has a lot of female fighters going unrepresented, but instead because of my aforementioned re-enactments; it's kind of awkward when every female character has to be represented by a different skin of Android 18 or Videl.

edited 31st Mar '16 8:49:49 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36804: Mar 31st 2016 at 8:53:26 AM

[up][up] I'd say the same thing, except GT, SSJ4, SSJG, SSJB Goku have the same base moveset as the 15 normal Goku variations with supers, stats and appearance being the only difference. And before ya say that lumping GT Goku with the others is unreasonable, just remember Majin Buu has a variation that makes him half his size and is still lumped in the same character slot.

The game also lumps the Great Saiyamen with Gohan and Videl, 9 Frieza Soldiers into 2 slots, and Time Patrol Trunks with Future Trunks. (Granted TP Trunks is Future Trunks, but as an adult)

That's why I see variations in Xenoverse as being true slots rather than the character portrait slots.

edited 31st Mar '16 8:54:14 AM by Rinsankajugin

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#36805: Mar 31st 2016 at 8:54:39 AM

Second Form > Final Form Freeza can have Cold > Mecha Freeza as alt outfits 8D

I've always wanted a game to just have Final Form Freeza with Mecha as an alternate. It's a cool design but making it a separate character is stupid.

[up][up] Does it make things a bit better than 18 is clearly viewed as a high priority inclusion given that she's often the sole Android representative in games with smaller rosters?

[up] That doesn't make sense to me. If anything, the other separate characters shouldn't be considered so (like Time Patrol Trunks/Future Trunks).

Like there is no justification for acting like Goku with Super Saiyan and Super Kamehameha equipped is a different character slot from Goku with Super Saiyan 2 and Super Kamehameha equipped.

edited 31st Mar '16 8:56:24 AM by Saiga

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36806: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:02:11 AM

I know it sounds weird, but remember that Evil Ryu, Violent Ken, Shin Akuma and Oni exist.

Also, have you seen Ultimate Ninja Storm 4's roster? It's just like Xenoverse, except every variation has it's own portrait slot. Each character has only one transformation just like Xenoverse.

edited 31st Mar '16 9:03:14 AM by Rinsankajugin

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#36807: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:04:21 AM

Yes and Storm 4 has already been terrible about that. Even worse than the famous (Scouter)(Late) Tenkaichi Syndrome.

The variations weren't given separate slots so I don't see the argument to call them separate characters. The differences in all of them are just too minor and some of them are literally just costume changes.

Even Great Saiyaman and Saiyawoman, are ultimately just different costumes.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#36808: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:06:34 AM

Technically, there's over 160 characters in Xenoverse, but 21 slots for Goku might be a bit much. Seriously, there's 21 versions of Goku post DLC.

Mainly because of new attacks, costumes, and Z-Souls, but I agree it was too much by the end. On the otherhand, Super Saiyan 4 and Super Saiyan God Goku were separate characters due to how transformations are handled.

For Xenoverse 2 I'd prefer looking back to Budokai's capsule system. That way the canon fighters don't take up multiple character slots for new attacks and more truly different characters can be added. It still baffles me that Dabura wasn't in Xenoverse 1 despite the main villains being related to him.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36809: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:09:25 AM

To be honest, I have no idea why SSJ4, SSJG and SSJB had separate slots considering all of those forms still have time limits in the series.

edited 31st Mar '16 9:09:52 AM by Rinsankajugin

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#36810: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:10:36 AM

Does it make things a bit better than 18 is clearly viewed as a high priority inclusion given that she's often the sole Android representative in games with smaller rosters?

It does. Videl also seems to be getting priority inclusion over Mr. Satan of late, which I assume is because she can fly. Not every game wants to have Jetpack Satan as a gag fighter for some reason.

The variations weren't given separate slots so I don't see the argument to call them separate characters. The differences in all of them are just too minor and some of them are literally just costume changes.

Even Great Saiyaman and Saiyawoman, are ultimately just different costumes.

Making Great Saiyaman and Saiyawoman into skins has an additional benefit of giving non-transformed Goku an actual move roster. Adult Gohan gets a lot of generic attacks because he does so little fighting outside his Super Saiyan transformations or Ultimate power-up.

For the purposes of a concise roster, blending Future, Ultimate, Saiyaman, and Adult Gohan into different skins of the same character might be a good idea. It would also have the added benefit of letting the player perform Saiyaman moves as Future or Ultimate Gohan, which would be hilarious.

edited 31st Mar '16 9:11:49 AM by TobiasDrake

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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#36811: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:12:51 AM

Skins shouldn't equal a whole character slot, but I otherwise agree with you.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36812: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:14:32 AM

I still don't know why they made a Future Gohan moveset, but no Future Gohan costume.

That was a weird decision.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#36813: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:15:47 AM

Especially when you remember Xenoverse had every other hairstyle of Gohan's.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36814: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:18:05 AM

Also, I'm surprised Dimps remembered Orlen and Raspberry since they both only had 1 episode each, but no Buu absorption.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#36815: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:21:54 AM

Strange priorities I'd say, making bunch of color coded mooks as playable characters. But they are exactly what I'm asking for, different skins for the same character that don't take up character slots.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36816: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:26:48 AM

The only difference is that one slot has ki blasts and the other slot has hand guns.

Now where's the Frieza Soldier with the football charge ultimate, he was cool. tongue

Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#36817: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:31:28 AM

Wait, 21 variations of Goku?

  • Goku
    • Great Ape
    • Kaioken
    • Super Saiyan
    • 2
    • 3
  • God
    • Blue
  • GT Goku
    • Super Saiyan 4

edited 31st Mar '16 9:33:04 AM by Soble

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#36818: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:31:35 AM

I would also like to be able to play as Future Gohan with only one arm.

It's weird how they go halfway on this. Most of his moves and specials make use of only one arm to allude to the fact that he loses the other, but you can't play as him with only the one arm. It just hangs there pretending to contribute.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#36819: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:35:57 AM

Kinda like Gohan himself.tongue

Zing!cool

One Strip! One Strip!
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#36820: Mar 31st 2016 at 9:45:44 AM

[up][up] The 21 Goku's in Xenoverse were:

  • Saiyan Saga Goku (Base, Kaioken)
  • Saiyan Saga Goku (w/o Weighted Clothes)
  • Damaged Saiyan Saga Goku
  • Saiyan Saga Goku (2) (Base, Kaioken)
  • Damaged Saiyan Saga Goku (2) (Base, Kaioken x 3)
  • Frieza Saga Goku (Base, Kaioken x 20)
  • Ginyu Goku
  • Damaged Frieza Saga Goku (Base, SSJ)
  • Damaged Frieza Saga Goku (2) (Base, SSJ)
  • Buu Saga Goku (Base, SSJ2)
  • Damaged Buu Saga Goku (Base, SSJ2)
  • Buu Saga Goku (Halo) (Base, SSJ3)
  • Damaged Buu Saga Goku (2) (Base, SSJ3)
  • Damaged Buu Saga Goku (3) (Base, SSJ)
  • BOG Goku (Base, SSJ3)
  • SSJG Goku
  • SSJB Goku
  • GT Goku (Base, SSJ)
  • Damaged GT Goku (Base, SSJ3)
  • Power Pole GT Goku (Base, SSJ)
  • SSJ4 GT Goku

edited 31st Mar '16 9:46:24 AM by Rinsankajugin

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
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#36821: Mar 31st 2016 at 10:50:22 AM

I can see justification for the different Sagas each having their own Goku, but that Damaged bullshit needs to fuck right off.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#36822: Mar 31st 2016 at 11:08:11 AM

I can't.

Xenoverse wouldn't need half as many character slots for redundant characters if they just did what other games do and gave the characters modular movelists. You can get away with using the same Goku for the Saiyan and Cell arcs if the player can remove Goku's Kaioken and equip his teleport in its place.

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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#36824: Mar 31st 2016 at 11:13:09 AM

But in a game with levels, it's a bit weird to have Saiyan Arc Goku and Buu Saga Goku be the same strength.There should be ~10 different Gokus at most, covering Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, and Dragon Ball Super, each with their own time-appropriate moveset and transformations.

[down]Exactly. Necessitating multiple Gokus for Story.

edited 31st Mar '16 11:15:37 AM by PushoverMediaCritic

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#36825: Mar 31st 2016 at 11:14:14 AM

Levels don't scale with the player in story mode, and scaling is needed in multiplayer and Parallel quests.

[up]You don't need multiple Gokus, just give him a set level during each story portion and give him the appropriate move-set.

edited 31st Mar '16 11:17:00 AM by VeryMelon


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