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Cortez from Parts Unknown (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#35851: Mar 13th 2016 at 6:49:51 PM

Except it is part of the tournament, Vegeta asked that Frost not be penalized.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#35852: Mar 13th 2016 at 6:55:24 PM

Except Vegeta is not the one calling the shots, now is he?

Even if they allowed the fights to go on, it doesn't necessarily mean that they count. At this point everyone basically just wants to see Frost get pummeled.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Cortez from Parts Unknown (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#35853: Mar 13th 2016 at 6:59:15 PM

Except his request was accepted and the ref overturned Frost's disqualification.

Otherwise Piccolo would still be fighting because he had won the match because Frost was disqualified.

Vegeta vs Frost is a tournament fight, that was made abundantly clear.

RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#35854: Mar 13th 2016 at 7:53:17 PM

@ Rinsankajugin: The way I took it, Freeza's race are like reptiles in that they don't look old as mammals do, they just get bigger and more intimidating. Freeza's lifespan may not be absurd, it could just be his race stays young for a while. Also, consider that humans spend an unusual amount of time as children, so Freeza could've become an adult at 7 instead of 18.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#35855: Mar 13th 2016 at 7:58:51 PM

I still think King Cold was kind of a waste. He was a Big Bad who showed up an arc too late. Ditto Dabura.

edited 13th Mar '16 7:58:59 PM by HamburgerTime

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#35856: Mar 13th 2016 at 8:12:36 PM

So...is the next episode not today?

One Strip! One Strip!
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35857: Mar 13th 2016 at 8:15:49 PM

DBS is preempted this week due to the Nagoya Women's Marathon.

TheMageofFire Since: May, 2012
#35858: Mar 13th 2016 at 8:15:54 PM

Nope, a break this week for something else.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#35860: Mar 14th 2016 at 4:24:50 AM

I'm pretty sure people are overestimating Frost by overestimating Piccolo.

Piccolo was weaker than Tagoma/Super Saiyan Gohan and four days before the tournament shown training with base Gohan. I would not assume in those four days he just skyrocketed in power because no-one took any notice of that. Goku said he had no chance, and it was only Piccolo's tactics that made a win feasible for him.

So either Frost lost a LOT of power from fighting Goku, or isn't Freeza's league. And that's certainly possible if Goku's base form isn't the same as this "Saiyan Beyond God" thing.

The fact that Goku can still turn into a regular Super Saiyan now suggests to me that his post-God powers aren't always turned on. While it could be that he still has one base form and Super Saiyan just fits between base and Super Saiyan Blue, that really doesn't seem to be what Resurrection F / the arc implies. If that was the case, he could have just used Super Saiyan against Freeza. He was already winning and only transformed to show Freeza that he needed to stop holding back - which is the same thing he did to Frost in Super. So it's weird for him to behave differently (by using a different form) when trying to do the same thing. I think it's because in RF, Goku was already using the god power he absorbed in base, and transforming into a Super Saiyan with god power is what Super Saiyan Blue is (that's how it is described - a Super Saiyan with the power of a Super Saiyan God).

Previously I had thought Goku just had the two modes - base, and Super Saiyan Blue which was just Super Saiyan bringing out his God power. But as we've seen, he can still go Super Saiyan without channeling the power of Super Saiyan God. So if the opposite was true, he could start using his God power without becoming a Super Saiyan. Goku's base form feats in this tournament were nothing impressive.

I'm thinking that unless Goku is actually using the God power, he's more or less back on the level he was at in the Boo arc with some improvements from training (which Vegeta said would not be much). It just seems too coincidental that Piccolo's gap between him and Super Saiyan Goku right now seems to be about what it would be back in the Boo arc.

And honestly, I think that would be more meaningful if Piccolo was able to make that strategy with the power he had currently possessed to if he had just got mad training hax only to reach a level where it still doesn't match his opponent. What on earth would be the point of giving him a bullshit power-up to bring him up to the point where he could be told he had no chance?

Piccolo is cool and all but all the complaints of him getting shafted here ring as hollow to me as the ones about Vegeta getting shafted in Ro F. If anyone got shafted here it was Buu.

I'm finding them fucking hilarious because over on Kanzenshuu a lot of people jumped the gun based on episode titles and previews and thought Piccolo won before the episode aired, then started lording it over the Saiyan fans. And I recognized a lot of the names as people who made fun of people who thought Vegeta would beat Freeza/got shafted, so the turn around was pure shadenfreude.

On the other hand I do think having Piccolo lose that way was a bad move, because Vegeta has no reason to fight Frost. Him making Piccolo step down so he can get another victory and just getting away with it seems like very poor writing to me, it's not about shafting Piccolo but about it simply achieving nothing positive to have Vegeta fight him - especially not when it's for a stupid reason that makes things worse for the team.

edited 14th Mar '16 4:31:56 AM by Saiga

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#35861: Mar 14th 2016 at 4:35:56 AM

If Vegeta wanted Frost to be humiliated properly, he'd have let Frost lose against a much weaker fighter.

Getting shitstomped by a God while you're exhausted isn't very humiliating.

edited 14th Mar '16 4:36:17 AM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#35862: Mar 14th 2016 at 4:59:25 AM

The difference in time between Resurrection 'F' and the tournament wasn't only four days. It was eight months, the last four days of which the tournament was announced and Goku and Vegeta beat each other up in the Time Chamber.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#35863: Mar 14th 2016 at 5:04:30 AM

It was four days from when we saw Piccolo sparring with base Gohan.

Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#35864: Mar 14th 2016 at 6:15:24 AM

If Goku is not supposed to use his god powers right now, they should explain it properly rather than letting it be inferred. Besides it would be pretty lame if the only reason the tournament is any kind of challenge is because Goku handicaps himself for no reason.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35865: Mar 14th 2016 at 7:46:46 AM

Goku not transforming for Botamo already implied that.

edited 14th Mar '16 7:47:02 AM by VeryMelon

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#35866: Mar 14th 2016 at 7:50:21 AM

[up][up] Well, he did say he lost because he thought only Super Saiyan is enough.

If Super Saiyan Blue is "A Super Saiyan with the power of a Super Saiyan God" then he can't be using his God powers in Super Saiyan right now.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#35867: Mar 14th 2016 at 7:52:55 AM

I mean, it'd be kinda boring if Goku & Vegeta just curb stomped everyone with no effort. Gotta at least give the opposition a chance.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35868: Mar 14th 2016 at 7:56:04 AM

No, Toriyama should have just made Universe 6's best fighters able to challenge them as Super Saiyan Blues.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#35869: Mar 14th 2016 at 7:57:48 AM

Not without good reason, that would be ridiculous.

Of course if Universe 7's Freeza could, you'd think Universe 6's Freeza could be even stronger had he been alive the whole time.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35870: Mar 14th 2016 at 8:03:09 AM

I'm not saying ALL of them should have, 2 max. 1 Super Saiyan God level opponent for Goku to beat, one Super Saiyan God level opponent for Vegeta to lost to, then Monaka will beat that opponent. Have Buu fight Botamo and Piccolo fight Magetta.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#35871: Mar 14th 2016 at 8:04:03 AM

Well the circumstances of Universe 6 aren't the same as 7's; the Saiyans of 6 can't even go Super Saiyan because there was never a need for it. Same for why Frost isn't as powerful as Frieza, he never had the burning hatred to train himself to fight them.

[up] But that still wouldn't explain why are they as strong as Goku or Vegeta tho; it would just kinda be up scaling the power level scale with no real justification beyond just making stronger opponents.

edited 14th Mar '16 8:05:25 AM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#35872: Mar 14th 2016 at 8:07:26 AM

Meh, just coming up with ideas for keep people in the "Goku and Vegeta stomping everyone would be boring" camp happy. I don't care if they do.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#35873: Mar 14th 2016 at 8:12:59 AM

Well, they're doing that now by just having them sandbag, which sorta creates the same effect.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#35874: Mar 14th 2016 at 8:27:17 AM

Here's the thing about Goku: Goku sandbags. He sandbags a lot. Goku likes to take his time with a fight, taking his opponent's measure blow by blow and working out how much power he needs to counter them and how much strategy he'll need to get around them. In a more dire setting such as a fate-of-the-world circumstance, he might forego that - but even then, frequently doesn't.

And this isn't a dire setting, this is a tournament. The kind of place where Goku is more than happy to use only a fraction of his strength fighting the likes of, say, Krillin because it makes the fight more fun. Goku is earnest, good-hearted, and he fights out of sincere passion for the sport rather than to prove or anything or achieve a goal.

For an opponent like Frost, that's what makes Goku the perfect victim. Sure, Goku could have walked on stage, turned Super Saiyan Blue, and vaporized him with a stern glare. But Goku would never do that. Instead, Frost got matched up against someone who is more than willing to take his time and let the poison settle in.

Like Saiga said, I think a lot of people are overestimating Frost by overestimating Piccolo. Goku has several transformations that would probably have made short work of Frost. But he never had the chance to power up to one because he was still in the "Playing around, getting an idea of how tough my foe is" stage of Goku's standard fighting strategy when he succumbed.

edited 14th Mar '16 8:28:32 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#35875: Mar 14th 2016 at 9:11:04 AM

Did people just kind of ignore the fact that Goku was curb-stomping Frost handily using only SSJ 1?

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.

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