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HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#32901: Jan 17th 2016 at 3:58:54 PM

[up]X6

Technically, once it became clear that Goku could use instant transmission to send himself to Kaiou's planet, they could have gone back for that training, even if they were all too strong to get much out of the gravity on his planet.

But that's neither here nor there.

What about my How far do you think Krillin could take it if he had had a chance to learn it question? It's just a hypothetical thing. I finally get that it wouldn't be much good.

[up]X5

As already stated, nobody teaches anyone anything except for King Kai. And even then, he only taught one dude.

Also, the Yardrat.

edited 17th Jan '16 4:00:29 PM by HandsomeRob

One Strip! One Strip!
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#32902: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:00:22 PM

Maybe at least a Kaio-ken x5, maybe 6 or 7.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#32903: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:01:12 PM

Almost true. Even Master Roshi never actually taught any of his students the Kamehameha, IIRC - they all just sorta learned it on their own.

Which I think is actually part of his modus operandi. He just gives you the training and leaves you to develop in your own way. One more reason why Master Roshi is actually a decent character up until he just becomes a perverted old man joke.

However, Goku is taught the Instant Transmission, Kaioken and Spirit Bomb, so...

By the by: As I said, the best Krillin could do with Kaioken is take out Captain Ginyu and maybe First Form Freeza.

Remember that by the time Goku was using it x20 in very short bursts, his powerlevel was sitting at 3,000,000.

edited 17th Jan '16 4:02:49 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#32904: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:02:44 PM

[up][up][up] Also whoever taught Goku the Fusion Dance.

edited 17th Jan '16 4:02:51 PM by Ssj3Gojira

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#32905: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:08:13 PM

It doesn't need to serve a purpose except to show that the other characters are still evolving as characters and fighters, Saiyans would still only use Super Saiyan and Kaio-Ken wouldn't need to go as high as x50, and establish that North Kaio is the only person who can teach it. There is no justification for not giving the other characters Kaio-Ken.

By the way, I think the other characters would be able to take it to x30 by the Buu Saga.

edited 17th Jan '16 4:08:38 PM by PushoverMediaCritic

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#32906: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:10:29 PM

[up][up]Oh right. And he did teach it to Goten, Trunks, and technically Piccolo.

Also, Goku only used Twenty times Kaioken that one time for the a brief attack and the Kamehameha, and it totally wiped him out. That's why he had no choice but to pull out the Spirit bomb.

So at that point, Twenty was as high as he could go, and doing so risked his body. He could probably go higher now, but as has been said, he just uses Super Saiyan now....unless he is still using it when he fights in base and no one realizes it.

[up] No. Unfortunately as pointed out, it wouldn't help them much (unless they tried that Combo-Kamehameha that I suggested before while in Kaiouken, and that would probably still fail.

Also, none of them are high enough to go to 30. Goku at his weakest (in base before he reached Super Saiyan) could only do 20 times, and he was in the millions at that point.

edited 17th Jan '16 4:13:48 PM by HandsomeRob

One Strip! One Strip!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#32907: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:14:15 PM

All the human fighters put together using Kaioken x30 and using their most powerful Kamehameha in collaboration would...

... probably get a little dust on an android.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#32908: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:14:58 PM

And that's a fact that I hate.

Maybe one day, I'll learn to accept it though.

One Strip! One Strip!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#32909: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:22:21 PM

THEY DON'T NEED TO BE RELEVANT IN COMBAT.

People care about the peripheral characters in One Punch Man when, no matter how strong they get, they will never match up to Saitama. But, we still have scenes that show that they're still growing and getting stronger independently as characters. Anytime the Humans develop a new technique or learn a new technique, they grow as characters. Character growth is FAR more valuable to me than Power Level relevance.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#32910: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:29:38 PM

Well, there's goes one of my fanfic ideas.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#32911: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:31:26 PM

Wait, what? You're saying they don't need to be relevant in combat to be effective, but you want them to spend their time learning something that is only useful in combat?

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#32912: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:34:38 PM

Yes. Because they're martial artists, and making the effort to learn is an important gesture in and of itself that demonstrates character growth.

Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#32913: Jan 17th 2016 at 4:40:54 PM

it'd devalue the other powerups, and you'd keep having to justify why the villains don't use it.

What.

Why would any of the villains be able to use it?

Every other powerup is already devalued by Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan God.

edited 17th Jan '16 4:41:49 PM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#32914: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:01:10 PM

Sorry but that's dumb. If you want to say that fighting isn't the only thing that matters then have them do something else.

Guy01 Since: Mar, 2015
#32915: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:02:13 PM

You know, I feel the humans could have gotten way more powerful if they were actually allowed to use the gravity machines. Just work their way up to the higher gravities and train smart with it.

Also, the 75,000 thing was Krillin's pl during the Frieza fight, prior to the 3 years of training for the androids, so he could have potentially gotten stronger since then. Tien clearly did.

edited 17th Jan '16 5:06:39 PM by Guy01

Ok, who let Light Yagami in here?
LOLypop1224 ...what am I even DOING here? Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
...what am I even DOING here?
#32916: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:09:10 PM

The humans didn't need Kaio-Ken. They needed a Super Saiyan equivalent to be relevant. The whole point was on Namek, the characters essentially went through TWO tiers of power-ups. Zenkai and then Super Saiyan. Both of which were made inaccessible to humans.

Toriyama could have given a Super Saiyan equivalent for the humans if he REALLY wanted them to be able to catch up. He let Piccolo catch up for a while. But he didn't, because he didn't want to.

The *Legendary* Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant! He is a literal giant f***ing baby!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#32917: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:11:26 PM

Power Level relevance is not an excuse to slack off and not grow as characters. You don't stop Taekwondo just because your best friend is two belts ahead and will always be two belts ahead. Learning the Kaio-Ken would have the Humans evolve as characters and grow stronger. Maybe not strong enough to matter, but mattering doesn't matter. Kaio-Ken wouldn't be a means to an end with the end being Power Level relevance, Kaio-Ken is the end, and with it, character growth.

Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#32918: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:15:22 PM

The problem with that is that only Goku and Vegeta are still focused on being fighters. Krillin is a cop, Yamcha's... Yamcha, Tenshinhan and Chaozu are farmers (I think), and Piccolo seems to just chill on the Lookout. There are plenty of ways for the side characters to grow without having them return to something that they've all moved past and would be pointless to return to.

Also, you speak like the Kaiouken is the only way for those characters to grow which is laughably wrong.

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#32919: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:17:59 PM

Being martial artists is an enormous part of their characters and I don't like seeing it neglected.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#32920: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:18:28 PM

Yamcha went into private security, apparently.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#32921: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:24:08 PM

Thing is, it's not necessarily the focus of their being, it's not the reason they live for.

Yamcha took up Martial Arts simply because everyone around him was doing it. He never really had a personal interest in Martial Arts, it was a means to an end to him.

Krillin originally picked it up to impress chicks and get back at the monk guys, and he's done both so he basically quit.

Chiaotzu just wants to ride Tien.

Tien basically lives for martial arts, yes, but later on in the series, it doesn't seem like he's very interested in fighting, per se, just the pursuit of the Martial Arts themselves. I can see him picking it up, just as another technique to add to his repertoire and just so that he's useful if, say, Captain Ginyu rolls around so that he can deal with that while Goku's busy with the final boss.

There's really one person who should have picked it up, and it's Piccolo, because on him it is actually useful and also because he seems like the kind of guy who'd take the time to learn that kind of stuff.

edited 17th Jan '16 5:25:11 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#32922: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:27:22 PM

Noo, Yamcha was the martial arts nerd when he first joined. He was the guy who knew every single martial arts master and technique by name. Training under Kamesennin was a dream come true for him.

Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#32923: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:27:41 PM

Giving Piccolo the Kaiouken now would probably be rather pointless since Super Saiyan Blue seems to outclass even Super Saiyan 3 by a very large margin.

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#32924: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:31:26 PM

Initial motivations aside, Krillin is Goku's best friend and friendliest rival. He never stopped training, never stopped trying, to keep up with Goku.

Chiaotzu...doesn't have much of a personality, but he does what Tenshinhan does, and Tenshinhan worked his butt off to surpass Goku every step of the way, as well as learn how to be an honorable martial artist from Roshi.

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#32925: Jan 17th 2016 at 5:35:24 PM

Roshi was supposed to be world famous for anyone who knew even the slightest thing about Martial Arts history, though, and Yamcha clearly trained - that's why he was so dangerous as a bandit and why he wasn't instantly shitstomped by Goku.

However, his interest in Martial Arts clearly waned considerably as he was shown just how truly small he is in comparison to the aliens.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari

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