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Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#19426: Jun 19th 2015 at 7:14:57 PM

Save for the Special making him too special, the best and only Bardock for me is Father of Goku Bardock.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#19427: Jun 19th 2015 at 7:16:13 PM

If only DB Minus could be actual reboot of some kind, updated origin, minor revisions like the Androids' purpose. So long as the name doesn't turn it into a comedy spin-off, I'd watch it.

I suppose that's what Kai is for though.

Jaco peed on Tights

Hold up, what. [lol]

edited 19th Jun '15 7:20:59 PM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
LOLypop1224 ...what am I even DOING here? Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
...what am I even DOING here?
#19428: Jun 19th 2015 at 7:19:01 PM

You guys should read Jaco, it's great. I mean, I mainly got it so I could understand who he was for the new movie, but it was really enjoyable.

It's at the end of the story. Tights is asking about Jaco's 'suit', when Jaco replies that it's his skin. Tights then realises, horrified, that Jaco has been naked this entire time. Then she looks down and asks "how do you pee?". It turns out Jaco pees through little holes in his head, and it lands on Tights.

...so yeah.

It's still great, though. And, surprisingly, that was the only instance of toilet humour in the entire manga. I think.

edited 19th Jun '15 7:23:39 PM by LOLypop1224

The *Legendary* Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant! He is a literal giant f***ing baby!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#19429: Jun 19th 2015 at 7:23:16 PM

I'm... pretty sure I saw that in a Scary Movie sequel.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#19430: Jun 19th 2015 at 7:37:16 PM

So I've been pondering the ins and outs of Frieza lately, and I have no idea why. In particular I had this thought about him. And yes I know this is a very dead pteranodon I'm flogging here.

Since we know SS Goku and SS Trunks were of similar strength when they fought and defeated Frieza, is it possible Vegeta was simply Vegeta-ing when he said his Super form was stronger than Goku's? If so, this wouldn't necessarily require 17 and 18 to be that far above Frieza. Well, relatively speaking; there's still a big honking thirty-million gap in there, which, for reference, is several times larger than the gap between first-form Frieza and farmer-with-a-shotgun.

16, though, he'd still be far stronger.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#19431: Jun 19th 2015 at 7:39:35 PM

Even Goku said Vegeta was stronger than him then. Plus they had three years of training; Goku was much stronger than we he fought Frieza on Namek.

edited 19th Jun '15 7:40:02 PM by LSBK

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#19432: Jun 19th 2015 at 7:53:53 PM

...why do I keep forgetting about that *EFF!*ing timeskip? It's not like it's a minor plot point, either.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#19433: Jun 19th 2015 at 10:06:53 PM

Another fun Frieza tidbit: according to Daizenshuu 2, Toriyama created him in a time of economic downturn for Japan, and the character was based on the various greedy people, especially land speculators, who took advantage of that to get richer.

In other words, Frieza is a satire of the 1%. #OccupyNamek

edited 19th Jun '15 10:07:01 PM by HamburgerTime

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#19434: Jun 20th 2015 at 5:13:55 AM

Point is, if he was forced to drop Ultimate Gohan, I think it's doubtful he'd outright say it.

Even though he has taken every opportunity given to him to complain about editorial pressure? There's no way for us to know for sure, but it just doesn't add up with anything we've actually seen.

So why does everyone harp on Frieza becoming stronger than Buu in four months? Goku got something like 375 times stronger in the space of a few days during the Saiyan and Namek sagas. The multiply that by fifty for Super Saiyan.

Because that was also a load of shit and one of the weaker parts of the series.

It is makes Freeza a complete moron, because he knew he could do that all along and never did it. Afraid of a possible Super Saiyan / Saiyan uprising? "Well I already KNOW I can make myself stronger than that, but I won't".

"Got beaten by a Super Saiyan? Well I have time to train, but I won't, I'm sure these robotic parts that barely upgraded me will be enough."

I could honestly point out more, but the main thing is that it doesn't do the idea justice to compare it to an Ass Pull from the original series. New content shouldn't try to ape the previous works' flaws.

We even got a training montage from it.

No we didn't, the movie skips the whole thing. Unless you meant Goku and his space training.

And one of the guidebooks did say that Freeza never trained before that his potential is limitless.

[[citation needed]] - as it stands that is an unsubstantiated rumor.

I don't find it dumb. He is the villain of the franchise after all.

He's more of a tumor on the franchise than anything else. And no, we'd have a plot without him - Goku would be sent to Earth, do pre-Z stuff, and either be forgotten or visited by the Saiyans. Some things would happen differently from that point, but Freeza's influence is no different than anyone else.

Freeza really was just another villain, the fact that so many can't move past him is really bad for this franchise.

LOLypop1224 ...what am I even DOING here? Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
...what am I even DOING here?
#19435: Jun 20th 2015 at 5:28:19 AM

I think the people who thought it should have ended after Freeza gave too much credit to the Z-era as a separate series. If you see it at starting from Z, it makes sense to end it there. But if you see it starting from Dragon Ball...well, that series had plenty of times where it could have been over, that Goku was the strongest...only to be proven wrong at the next arc. Z wasn't just about Goku discovering his heritage - it was about Goku becoming stronger. The whole Super Saiyan thing was just a part of that.

edited 20th Jun '15 5:28:42 AM by LOLypop1224

The *Legendary* Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant! He is a literal giant f***ing baby!
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#19436: Jun 20th 2015 at 5:57:57 AM

It seems like bringing back older characters always leads to Broken Base no matter what :V

In any case, I wouldn't call Freeza the villain, but at the same time he's very closely tied to the main character's backstory and responsible for one of its most iconic moments. I really don't think its that surprising that people associate Frieza so much with the franchise.

As for the whole "training for months thing"....shrug, yea its dumb but its clearly just there as an excuse just so we can watch Goku & Frieza fight again. I'm probably still going to enjoy Revival Of F on that basis alone because I am a simple person with simple interests :P

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
JonnasN from Porto, Portugal Since: Jul, 2012
#19437: Jun 20th 2015 at 8:25:06 AM

[up]I dunno, it worked well for Piccolo Jr. tongue

Freeza is definitely one of the series most memorable villains, but far from the only one. I'd be okay with his return if he had decided to undergo some ancient yet dangerous ritual of his clan, or something like that (I do like the idea of training near a black hole), but "Let's train for 4 months" is just lazy writing (and raises so many more questions: how would Freeza know how strong he ought to become, and if he had barely trained before, how did he know 4 months would be enough?).

LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
DoctorDiabolical So pure. Since: Mar, 2010
So pure.
#19440: Jun 20th 2015 at 8:35:05 AM

All the new gods are gonna be freaking sphinxes?

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#19441: Jun 20th 2015 at 8:56:53 AM

Saiga, I meant that image of Frieza doing a Rocky montage and doing sit-ups, push-ups, and eating several raw eggs a day. In a hoodie.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#19442: Jun 20th 2015 at 9:38:44 AM

Shanpa and Beerus.

Two of the most powerful names in Dragonball.

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#19443: Jun 20th 2015 at 9:39:26 AM

I don't think Shanpa is going to be the actual name, anymore than Bills was.

The pun must be maintained.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#19445: Jun 20th 2015 at 11:14:03 AM

"Let's train for 4 months" is just lazy writing (and raises so many more questions: how would Freeza know how strong he ought to become, and if he had barely trained before, how did he know 4 months would be enough?).

The out of universe answer is: just what you said. Lazy writing.

In-universe, the answer would be: He didn't. That's just how long he decided to train.

Frieza is arrogant and short sighted to the extreme. I believe it's stated he loses because he made the exact same mistake he did on Namek. Namely that his body couldn't handle his new power. He trained, actually got stronger, than because he was too cocky and impatient for revenge, rushed in to fight without considering that he could still overtax his body.

Four months was enough to get stronger. He needed more time to master that power. But when you've been the top of the food chain for years, you tend to not realize these things.

It's still stupid though.

One Strip! One Strip!
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#19446: Jun 20th 2015 at 11:59:45 AM

So here's an interesting tidbit. You know the big giant character guide in Daizenshuu 7? It has no entry for General White. He's pretty much the only semi-relevant character to lack one, which is even weirder because everyone else from the Muscle Tower mini-arc has an entry.

Keep in mind this guide includes such illustrious personages as "Guy Blue kills for picking his nose," "Dolphin that gives directions to Roshi's house," and "Cops whose car the Androids wreck."

LOLypop1224 ...what am I even DOING here? Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
...what am I even DOING here?
#19447: Jun 20th 2015 at 3:08:19 PM

It's a bit of a shame none of the Red Ribbon Army officers were Androids. I think I enjoyed 17 and 18 more, but, now that I think about it, that was a missed opportunity.

The *Legendary* Super Saiyan is motivated by a crying infant! He is a literal giant f***ing baby!
Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#19448: Jun 20th 2015 at 3:29:53 PM

Major Metallitron says "Hi."

edited 20th Jun '15 3:42:44 PM by Zelenal

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#19449: Jun 20th 2015 at 3:30:37 PM

[up] Was he a Gero model, too? I've wondered about that.

Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#19450: Jun 20th 2015 at 3:35:45 PM

I think what he's saying is it's a bit of a missed opportunity that 17 and 18 weren't General Blue or Staff Officer Black/any other named member, but instead were just two random teenagers we'd never seen before.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."

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