The final completion of Vegeta's arc could be considered a rehash of the exact same revelations he had at the end of the Cell arc. He relapsed into an asshole so he could overcome being an asshole again, demonstrating how utterly at a loss for character arcs the cast was, seven years after resolving everything.
Both Gohan realizing his true potential and becoming the greatest warrior he could be, and Goku getting an heir that doesn't suck also happened at the end of the Cell arc.
There are a lot of great moments in the Buu Saga, but the point is that it's basically a saga from The Kaioshin Show with Dragon Ball characters stapled into it, and many of those great moments have more to do with all the new stuff that came with Majin Buu than anything to do with Dragon Ball's developing story.
Then they exhausted all the new concepts and ideas until finally Goku and Vegeta were left to face Buu, and Vegeta went, "We've tried Fusion Dances and Potaras and Ultimate Boosts and Magic Swords and all that shit, and now the Earth's been blown up and your villain is still coming. You know what I say? F*ck you. Super Saiyan forms, Genki-Dama, Dragon wishes, weaker fighters stalling for time, former villains fighting for the protagonists, we are going to DRAGON BALL the shit out of this."
edited 18th Jun '15 10:40:58 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.From what I understand of his critics, Gohan is only interesting to them when he's forced to fight, especially because he doesn't want to. It's this conflict of interest that adds more dynamic to his character for them. Otherwise, he's just an out-of-place square in an action cartoon in their opinion.
Thematically, Buu arc doesn't offer much more resolution than the previous arcs.
I guess Vegeta had a nicer send off, but for the most part, Android saga serves as a much better conclusion.
that's a pretty stupid argument honestly, Shonen series gonna have a Shonen fanbase.
edited 18th Jun '15 10:52:55 AM by BlackYakuzu94
A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.I fail to see how any of what you described is a bad thing.
Particularly their resolve to DRAGON BALL the shit out of it. In fact, I do believe returning to basics for the finale is a good thing. I dislike 11th-Hour Superpower.
himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimariI didn't say it was a bad thing. Like I said, the Buu Saga is pretty great and I love most of it.
My point is that it barely has any relationship at all with any of the storyline that came before. It's more like a sequel than the climactic resolution of the entire series to this point. Here's a new playground for our old characters to play in.
Majin Buu is more Battle of Gods and less Resurrection of F.
edited 18th Jun '15 10:57:14 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Good point, actually. The end of the Cell Saga has a much more climatic feel to it, it'd have served as a better ending to the series, especially since it establishes Gohan as the hero by mirroring Goku's battle with Frieza (the hero holding his own for a bit before the villain really goes all out, and then the hero unlocks a new transformation and the villain is screwed). The Cell Saga had everything, it established Gohan, gave Goku a proper send off, gave Vegeta character development, and ended everything with the epic kamehameha struggle. If they planned on doing another arc they should've made Gohan the hero and done the Buu Saga far differently, as it stands now it feels more like a sequel than the same series.
This shall be my true, Start of DarknessI don't see that as necessarily a bad thing, because the Buu Saga isn't the end for the world, it's the end for the characters.
You can say what you will about rehashing ground for Vegeta, but fact of the matter is... The Buu saga actually had their rematch, which the Android Saga didn't. And eventually, Vegeta was forced to admit that there were more important things than their rivalry. And then he finally accepts that Goku is superior and he is finally considered a good person because he is finally doing things for someone other than himself.
That's the kind of thing I'm talking about.
It's not about ending the story of Dragon Ball, because And the Adventure Continues implies that it doesn't ever really end. It's about ending these characters' adventures so that they can be retired to make way for their successors.
himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimariWhich Bo G kind of makes pointless, doesn't it?
what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone elseYeah, but again, these characters were already retired at the end of the Cell Saga.
Goku sacrificed his life to save the World and will remain dead forever; he's never coming back, he will never have further adventures, the story of the main character is absolutely 100% done.
Gohan has finally unlocked his Hidden Power and even surpassed his father. Goku's legacy lives on in his son, and the Earth is safe from harm so long as he's there. He's your And the Adventure Continues ending.
Vegeta has accepted that there are more important things in life than being the strongest warrior around. He never had his rematch with Goku but he doesn't need one; he's put the path of the overbearing conqueror behind him and is going to focus on being a father and a husband for the rest of his life. As Vegeta himself put it, "I will never fight again."
Trunks returns to his timeline and destroys the Androids with the strength he gained from training with his father in the Room of Spirit and Time, ringing in a new era of peace for his world as well.
Piccolo and God reunited, finally bringing their story to a close. Also, on top of that, the Earth has a new God to watch over it and a new set of Dragon Balls, so even that potential plot hook is wrapped up.
Krillin finally gets that girlfriend he always wanted.
Tien also finally gets what he always wanted, announcing he's returning to the mountains to train for the rest of his life and will never come back.
Bulma lives happily ever after with Vegeta. Chi-Chi lives happily ever after without Goku.
Every story is wrapped up, every character is brought to a conclusion. Close the curtains, roll credits, story's over. There's nothing left to tell.
Meanwhile, in typical sequel fashion, coming up with more to tell required the Buu Saga to backpedal on nearly all of these.
edited 18th Jun '15 12:16:14 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.This is actually even more prevalent in Kai when it went on haitus where they have the full version of Dragon Soul playing during the end of the second-to-last episode which closes off the Cell Saga (the last episode deals with Future Trunks wrapping things up).
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!so,the Frieza movie has come out in my theaters today and I will be watching this sunday.I will be watching both The Terminator(the original one)and DBZ on the theaters back to back,what an awesome Sunday it's going to be huh?Just like last Sunday when I got to watch Raiders of The Lost Ark and Naruto The Last back to back as well on the big screen.Doesn't my theater rock?
I dunno. After coming off of Raiders, Naruto: The Last may have been a letdown. Even if it's not bad, it can't be as good as Raiders.
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!See, I disagree with you.
Most of the characters who had their arcs concluded on the Android Saga... well, they aren't really relevant on the Buu saga.
And I hope you're not trying to say that Vegeta would stick to something as idiotic as saying "I will never fight again" when fighting is literally the one thing in life he enjoys doing more than anything else.
Not to mention such being a line I don't ever remember hearing or reading in the Latin versions. I'd have to check the original Japanese, but it's definitely not a Vegeta thing to say.
The tone used in the latin version of the Android Arc was nowhere near as final. I guess this difference is one that falls on the same ground as the one in which DBGT implied that Goku was waiting on the sidelines to pop back up again in the USA version while the Latin version made it pretty clear 'The Story of Dragon Ball has come to an end', with the narrator literally saying that.
himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimariI never knew there were questions about those two.
I once stated that that Cell is interesting in that he is (at least in the anime, where he apparently had more donors, though I'm not sure how factual that is) literally every opponent Goku ever faced all roled into one, and eventually coming to kick his ass.....and winning. Sort of a one man Boss Rush. It's kinda cool in a sense, with Goku getting one last fight with all of his rivals at once.
That's how I see it, so now I wait for someone to tell me why I'm wrong.
One Strip! One Strip!You're wrong.
I'm not going to tell you why. I'm just going to let you live in misery knowing that you're wrong without knowing why.
Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!If that doesn't sound like a Vegeta things to say, then bear in mind that he also apologizes for his arrogance.
Cell broke Vegeta's egotism. After Trunks died, Vegeta made a suicidal rush at Cell that succeeded only in getting Gohan badly injured protecting him. Realizing how impotent he was and how much he ruined things, Vegeta apologized to Gohan for getting in the way. He accepted his place in the hierarchy and accepted his ability to contribute in a minor but important way, when he distracted Cell during the climactic Beam Struggle.
After that, he acknowledged that both Goku and Gohan have surpassed him and swore that with Goku gone, he will never fight again. His next and final appearance before the timeskip was seeing Trunks off with renewed respect and appreciation for his family. He says no words, but gives a small wave to show he cares.
Also, in opening the manga up to research exactly how this went down, I also noticed an ending I missed: Yamcha makes a comment about his new girlfriend, showing that he, too, has found a happy ending. Specifically, he jokes about using Shenron to wish for a diamond necklace he can give her.
edited 18th Jun '15 12:50:26 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.


And more importantly, it finally has Goku getting an heir that doesn't suck.
... who then procceeds to suck in GT, and probably won't even be seen in Super.
edited 18th Jun '15 10:35:11 AM by NapoleonDeCheese