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IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#17226: May 21st 2015 at 6:41:52 PM

Vegeta was not even with 18. That's why 18 could tank his blows without taking damage.

Also, you cannot trust any power level rating given for the androids by the characters.

They don't have an energy the characters can sense, so they have no idea how strong the androids actually are. The only gauge we have is the Nameless Namekian, who was basically dead even with 17. And guess what? The Nameless Namekian is a fair bit stronger than Vegeta.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#17227: May 21st 2015 at 6:44:42 PM

Except we have no other case of 18 fighting Vegeta-level characters at the same time. There's no reason to think she was holding back in the preliminary stages of the fight.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#17228: May 21st 2015 at 6:47:54 PM

Except 18 is exactly as strong as 17 and 17 is as strong as the Nameless Namekian who's orders of magnitude stronger than Super Saiyan Vegeta.

Also, refer back to when I made comparisons between all the Super Saiyans.

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#17229: May 21st 2015 at 6:49:21 PM

We have no reason to believe she was holding back other than the fact that she took absolutely zero damage in that fight.

Oh, and there's also the fact that she's suppposed to be even with 17, or at least pretty close to him. 17, who fought an opponent stronger than Vegeta evenly.

Vegeta is not that much stronger than Trunks, and Trunks got completely and thoroughly owned by the Androids both in his time and in the then present.

Put simply, you have absolutely no evidence for claiming that 18 and Vegeta were even, but we do have evidence to assume she is far stronger than he was and just playing with him.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#17230: May 21st 2015 at 7:01:05 PM

[up][up]18 is weaker than 17.

[up]She took quite a bit of damage. When characters take no damage in Dragonball, they're drawn without scratches, but 18 had several, just as 17 did against Piccolo.

edited 21st May '15 7:01:54 PM by Cruherrx

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#17231: May 21st 2015 at 7:04:42 PM

Gohan was taking nearly no damage from Cell. He was still drawn with scratches and even cuts.

Again, the damage Vegeta dealt to 18 was purely cosmetic.

Also, IIRC, the one who claims 17 is stronger than 18 is 17 himself. Hardly a reliable source, given that he can't feel powerlevels, much less 18's or even his own.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
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#17232: May 21st 2015 at 7:11:21 PM

Well, 17 claimed to be stronger than 16 too and we know how that turned out.

16 was also surprised by how much power Cell got from 18, and he had 17 as a gauge right? But who really knows?

Buldogue's lawyer
Guy01 Since: Mar, 2015
#17233: May 21st 2015 at 7:13:33 PM

It only makes sense because that was the same problem he had back on Namek with his 100% Full Power form.

I guess so, but I think I would have preferred a more even fight to the finish. Maybe it's just my taste.

Ok, who let Light Yagami in here?
Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#17234: May 21st 2015 at 7:28:09 PM

At the start, both Vegeta and 18 are holding back. They agree to fight for real. Trunks is watching the fight and thinks to himself that he can't believe his father is fighting so evenly with her. Piccolo then says Vegeta's stamina will wear out eventually.

From a narrative perspective, there's no reason to mention stamina if it didn't matter. Vegeta lost because he couldn't keep fighting at that level while 18 could indefinitely.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#17235: May 21st 2015 at 7:33:38 PM

I'm pretty sure that comment is Anime only.

[up][up] Well, they start even more or less it seems, its just Freeza's power starts to drop as the battle goes on. Freeza just simply jumped the gun and didn't get used to his newfound power.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#17236: May 21st 2015 at 7:37:00 PM

Again: They don't know how strong the androids actually are. Furthermore, the fact that Trunks is surprised by Vegeta fighting evenly with 18 should tell you that Vegeta isn't leaps and bounds ahead of Trunks, which is why Trunks is surprised by it.

The moment 18 stops screwing around, she pwns Vegeta in a very short time. And no, you don't get to claim "well his stamina dropped", because in this series, Vegeta is the mothereffin' king of stamina and constitution. Vegeta's the character who's taken the most thorough and complete thrashings and could still get back up and continue fighting. I remind you, his very first fight had Vegeta fighting a whole bunch of people, getting hit with several super powerful attacks that all should've managed to put him down and he could still outfight everyone else.

Vegeta's Stamina is incredible, and it wouldn't drop so easily.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#17237: May 21st 2015 at 7:48:19 PM

Almost feel kinda bad for Bulma.

Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#17238: May 21st 2015 at 7:50:09 PM

[up][up][up]No, it's manga.

[up][up]I'll take the characters' word for it over guessing that she's stronger just cuz.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#17239: May 21st 2015 at 7:50:48 PM

Characters that other parts of the story indicate are completely incapable of knowing the truth?

IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#17240: May 21st 2015 at 7:55:49 PM

Bulma has the dream husband, though. He does have practically infinite stamina, and he spends most of the day out of the way so you only have to see him when it's time for nookie.

edited 21st May '15 7:56:17 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#17241: May 21st 2015 at 7:57:27 PM

I would think that makes it worse, actually.

I mean, Bulma's busy with a planet to run. She can't afford to spend all day in bed.

Wearing Vegeta out enough to make Bra would have taken weeks.

edited 21st May '15 7:57:39 PM by unnoun

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#17242: May 21st 2015 at 7:58:09 PM

Given that Bulma is Bulma, she probably invented something to do that.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#17243: May 21st 2015 at 8:01:43 PM

It's a problem that could be more easily overcome if both partners were able to talk about things and cooperate.

Vegeta and Bulma are both selfish assholes.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#17244: May 21st 2015 at 8:04:12 PM

Look, Vegeta trains his body most of the time and Bulma is a women constantly working.

There's no reason she can't be like

Bulma: "You, upstairs, naked, five minutes"

Vegeta: "Nobody commands me!"

Bulma: "Then I'll just dismantle the gravity room"

Vegeta: "Ugh, fine. But you better make this worth it woman"

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#17245: May 21st 2015 at 8:06:26 PM

What I find interesting is that in the first arc there's no real indication Bulma's particularly smart from what I remember. She's basically just the Team T&A.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#17246: May 21st 2015 at 8:10:14 PM

She kinda designed the Dragon Radar, invented a time machine in an alternate timeline, and designed the detonator for the Androids despite not having designed them and only having their blueprints.

I think Bulma has earned her title as Smart Girl. Its so refreshing to have a character be able to contribute so much despite having no fighting capabilities. And a human no less.

edited 21st May '15 8:11:56 PM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#17247: May 21st 2015 at 8:12:19 PM

[up] I said in the first arc. I was just wondering if there was any Continuity Drift.

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#17248: May 21st 2015 at 8:13:32 PM

And I honestly enjoyed the Broly movie at the start. Mostly because there was a lot of intrigue at the beginning. The heroes were being duped, and it was only a matter of time before they worked it out and the battle began. It actually didn't start with fighting, and that's what made it stand out, I think.

Yeah, that bit of the movie I very much liked. The set-up was really good.

That being said, I like the second one the most of the Broly movies.

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#17249: May 21st 2015 at 8:18:11 PM

Broly's creator apparently think he's stronger than Beerus...

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#17250: May 21st 2015 at 8:22:46 PM

Eh, I can kind of see that.

That being said, his power is pretty inconsistent.

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else

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