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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#14301: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:44:19 PM

[up][up] No, it doesn't make him a shittier fighter. You don't need to be an absolute savage to be good at fighting, as lots of people not named Goku/Vegeta show.

Goku and Vegeta's love of combat isn't really related to them getting all the power ups.

edited 10th Apr '15 7:44:29 PM by Saiga

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#14302: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:45:07 PM

No, but it's related to them keeping them.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#14303: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:46:56 PM

I have to say though, with each of these escalating conflicts Toriyama keeps creating, he's almost retconning his original ending for the series.

Weren't Goten and Trunks suppose to be slacking off on their training because the previous ten years were a time of peace?

But then again, somehow they don't know Frieza is invading the planet.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#14304: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:47:09 PM

Which doesn't even matter really. God power just makes Ultimate useless, so training wouldn't have done Gohan any good because he wasn't selected for the God power up.

Even then, it shouldn't be related. Power ups that have nothing to do with training should not be lost from not training.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#14305: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:49:09 PM

Isn't there a thing where Frieza's new right hand men that give Gohan some trouble are as strong as Zarbon and Dodoria?

And that Frieza's power level is now a million? Meaning he got weaker?

That Gohan has no desire to spend the rest of his life bathing in the blood of his enemies is simultaneously what makes him a better person and a shittier fighter than Goku and Vegeta.

Goku and Vegeta's love of combat isn't really related to them getting all the power ups.

No, but it's related to them keeping them.

That.

cue God Videl.

...I would have watched that.

It would have been great if she could have kept it too somehow. Even after Pan was born, I mean.

But then again, somehow they don't know Frieza is invading the planet.

...I mean, what, do they think he's just going to leave them alone?

I mean, hell, what were the Z Fighters doing those four months? Most of them probably weren't training, but.

I would think there would have been some concern of some kind.

Frieza could still blow up the planet. The planet they all need to live. Maybe he would have gone for a surprise attack. Somebody should probably have stayed vigilant.

edited 10th Apr '15 7:51:23 PM by unnoun

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#14306: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:49:59 PM

It was a guy giving Piccolo trouble that Gohan killed in one shot.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#14307: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:52:22 PM

So didn't Piccolo stand up against Frieza's second form?

And the androids and Imperfect Cell that were stronger than Frieza?

And he's given trouble by Zarbon and Dodoria level enemies?

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#14308: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:52:22 PM

Clearly, Gohan and Piccolo have taken slacking off in their training as a personal challenge, and spent the last four months in the Room of Spirit and Time playing poker and drinking beer.

Whoever can drop their battle power low enough to rival Yamcha gets to go drive cars.

edited 10th Apr '15 7:53:08 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#14309: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:53:35 PM

But how do they get out again after two days if they've gotten so weak they can't just kiai a Vice Shout?

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#14310: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:53:39 PM

[up][up][up] Yeah, it's hogwash.

To be fair the moment the army wasn't immediately wiped out it was clear the character's power was being misrepresented to make things seem more meaningful.

edited 10th Apr '15 7:53:46 PM by Saiga

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#14311: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:56:38 PM

Vice Shout is kinda one of my favorite things in the series, incidentally.

It's one of those aspects of self-awareness in the Buu Saga. A move based exclusively on yelling really loudly.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#14312: Apr 10th 2015 at 7:56:57 PM

I don't understand why Freeza's army couldn't get any training done in 4 months.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#14313: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:00:04 PM

This 4 months of training thing is going to become a meme isn't it?

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#14314: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:00:59 PM

Some people think that they did, and that's a perfectly logical reason for Piccolo to have had trouble.

Because it's not like Piccolo actually means anything in the universe. Born a prodigy from a race renown for high battle power, trained in martial arts, his tremendous power divided and built back up prior to re-merging and training beyond that... yeah... definitely on the same level as aliens with no given history.

[up] It already is.

edited 10th Apr '15 8:01:10 PM by Saiga

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#14315: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:02:50 PM

@ Saiga re: Ultimate Gohan: And it's never been revealed what prompted the rewrite?

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#14316: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:07:05 PM

Rewrite isn't really the right term. Nothing that was already written was changed.

All that has been said:

Interviewer: And then the Cell arc ended. Did you think that everyone felt you would put Gohan into the leading role?

Akira Toriyama: I intended to put Gohan into the leading role. It didn’t work out. I felt that compared to Goku, he was ultimately not suited for the part.

It could have been based on popularity polls, but this link will explain it better.

edited 10th Apr '15 8:08:49 PM by Saiga

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#14318: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:18:56 PM

...Oh god I just had the horrible thought of DBH taking the "training for four months" concept and applying it to Broly.

TheAirman Brightness from The vicinity of an area adjacent to a location Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Historians will say we were good friends.
Brightness
#14319: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:33:05 PM

What would happen if Yamcha trained for four months?

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#14321: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:34:29 PM

[up][up]Two ways that could go: the "He'd get weaker because he's Yamcha" joke or the "nothing because he's human and humans suck" joke.

edited 10th Apr '15 8:34:51 PM by LSBK

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#14322: Apr 10th 2015 at 8:35:25 PM

Imagine how much more Yamcha would suck if he hadn't trained for four months.

Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#14323: Apr 10th 2015 at 10:15:39 PM

Yay, I just got the Spirit Bomb from Mentor Goku!

Aw man, it sucks! It's got zero combo potetial.

I have a message from another time...
Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#14324: Apr 11th 2015 at 3:51:30 AM

Oh, certainly, Goku and Vegeta are terrible protectors. They're horribly irresponsible and regularly make selfish decisions that endanger the lives of the people they're supposed to be protecting. There is nothing about them that makes them better suited to defending innocent lives than Gohan.

The're just better suited to violence. Gohan is someone you can count on to protect you far better than you could Goku or Vegeta, but it's just unreasonable to expect Gohan to always be able to kick their asses when violence isn't something he's passionate about; it's not something he enjoys doing, and given the opportunity, he'll quit because he hates it.

Gohan a better protector? Remind me what happened every time the fate of Earth was in his hands? Oh that's right, he screwed up and had to be bailed out by Goku. And no let's not forget that after beating Cell he just assumed nothing stronger than himself could show up which is a terrible attitude to take where you are responsible for protecting your world.

Listen, Gohan is a nice guy and all but he's just not cut out to the whole "Earth's Protector" thing. He doesn't want it, he's not very good at it, he's better off leaving it to others.

Oh yeah, and while we are at it, forgive me for thinking that people who put in constant, consistent effort to be good at something are more deserving to be good at it than those who don't. Till now I didn't though this was a controversial opinion but we learn something new every day.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#14325: Apr 11th 2015 at 3:59:20 AM

That's ignoring that the effort they put in isn't what makes them good at it.

Also for Gohan's faults at being a protector it will never outdo that Goku and Vegeta are threats to everyone's safety.

edited 11th Apr '15 4:01:00 AM by Saiga


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