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IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#9976: Dec 30th 2014 at 4:07:36 PM

For shits and giggles, I can at least say that Battle of Z considers Vegetto stronger than Beerus or Whis, because the 'Ultimate Challenge' is him. Admittedly, you go through a marathon fight with every other character in the game before, but they're hilariously easy anyway, and the only real opponent in that fight is Vegetto. Everything else either dies in one hit to Beerus or, at most, takes a blast before dying.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9977: Dec 30th 2014 at 4:35:48 PM

Battle of Z also thinks Super Saiyan Gohan is stronger than Ultimate Gohan going by in-game stats.

To be fair to Saint Seiya, a lot of the dialogue puts it on a level way above Dragon Ball. It's just that the author really doesn't show it.

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#9978: Dec 30th 2014 at 4:51:59 PM

Saint Seiya Omega I think does a better job of actually showing that.

Also, we have reached 400 pages. We are now as strong as a Super Saiyan 3.

edited 30th Dec '14 5:00:50 PM by Ssj3Gojira

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#9979: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:00:54 PM

Yes, we are. Goku can, therefore, so can Vegetto.

How Fusion works when Goku can turn SS 3 and Vegeta can't isn't exactly clear. The Elder Kai has the witch's unlock ability, but that's under the "Special" category, which is different from transforming. Further, when Goten and Trunks fused and mastered Super Saiyan 3 as Gotenks, it didn't enable the individuals to be able to transform beyond SS 1. Yes, I know it's a different kind of fusion. The point is it's unclear.

[up]And we still get beat by Raditz. Thanks Obama.

edited 30th Dec '14 6:01:35 PM by Cruherrx

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9980: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:13:40 PM

But Vegetto can transform into a Super Saiyan. So obviously the Gotenks example does not apply.

edit: Wait, misread your post. Fusions can the abilities of their components, not the other way around. That'd be ridiculous.

edited 30th Dec '14 6:14:53 PM by Saiga

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#9981: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:32:36 PM

[up][up] Actually, since the average power level of a human is 5, then a 400 times boost would give us a power level of 2000 to Raditz's power level of 1500.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#9982: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:40:44 PM

[up][up]But since Goku's body can't handle Super Saiyan 3, and Vegeta's definitely can't (+ Vegeta never learned how to do it), I don't see how he'd be able to use it. If he can, I don't think it's a form he could maintain for even the length Goku could.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#9983: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:44:28 PM

[up][up][up]It also seems to think that Beerus is stronger than Whis. It's fun.

[up]Tell me, do you think Vegetto can use the Big Bang Attack? How about the Kamehameha? How about Instant Transmission?

edited 30th Dec '14 6:45:59 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9984: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:53:12 PM

[up][up] What do you mean Vegeta's can't? His odds are just as good as Goku given that they're the same strength in base.

Also, Vegetto's body is simply much better than either of them. There's no reason he'd be worse at using it than Goku.

He can use Super Saiyan from his components. Nothing was ever said about it specifically requiring both parties to have the ability for him to pick it up.

edited 30th Dec '14 6:54:09 PM by Saiga

Spirit Pretty flower from America Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Hooked on a feeling
Pretty flower
#9985: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:55:39 PM

Has Frieza's race finally been named?

#IceBearForPresident
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9986: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:56:22 PM

No, and it will likely never been named. Toriyama's said they aren't really a race.

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#9987: Dec 30th 2014 at 6:58:05 PM

Which makes no sense.

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9988: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:00:10 PM

They're a small bunch of mutants. Meaning they're probably an offshoot of some race, but are too far removed to be considered that race any more and too small in number to be considered their own race.

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#9989: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:02:08 PM

But what race did they come from?

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9990: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:03:12 PM

Does it matter? That race has no relevance aside from being the progenitors of the Freeza clan. The mutation is the only thing that makes Freeza et al special.

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#9991: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:03:57 PM

grumble grumble

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#9992: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:07:36 PM

Changelings. Concise, to the point and it's been used for years to describe it, even before Acrosian/Icejin/Frost Demon was ever considered.

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#9993: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:11:57 PM

[tup]

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#9994: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:27:02 PM

Let me explain.

Let's say Goku is a 5. SS 3 brings him to 2000, and that's too much for his body. Vegeta would clearly last even less time than Goku.

Now put them together and do the exponential increase that Fusion gives. Let's say Vegetto is a 50. Throw in the super saiyan 3 multiplier and his power shoots up to 20,000. Can his body, made from two that can't handle their meager power level increase from going SS 3, manage his massive power increase from going SS 3?

edited 30th Dec '14 7:27:30 PM by Cruherrx

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9995: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:29:33 PM

You're not explaining the right parts. Why would Vegeta be able to handle it less than Goku? They're the same strength in the same form.

And yes, he could - at the very least better than his components. Because Goku at 8,000 can't handle the Kaio-ken x 3, but Goku at 3,000,000 can comfortably handle the Kaio-ken x 10.

edited 30th Dec '14 7:30:03 PM by Saiga

Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#9996: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:33:56 PM

Vegeta has no training for SS 3. And Assuming he can handle it, it'd be about as effectively as Goku does, which is not at all.

Goku got better at the Kaioken by training his body to be able to handle it, no? Vegito just up and going Super Saiyan 3 when neither of his component pieces can handle the form looks like a disaster waiting to happen.

edited 30th Dec '14 7:34:18 PM by Cruherrx

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Spirit Pretty flower from America Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Hooked on a feeling
Pretty flower
#9997: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:46:34 PM

Well the Xenoverse page is using Changelings.

#IceBearForPresident
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#9998: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:50:56 PM

[up] It shouldn't, it should be using the term actually used in Xenoverse rather than fan terms (Freeza clan).

[up][up] He got better at the Kaio-ken simply by getting stronger, despite the multiplier increasing. Vegetto's stronger than Goku and Vegeta, so he'll handle it better than them.

edited 30th Dec '14 7:51:52 PM by Saiga

Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#9999: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:58:36 PM

Is it stated that he was able to use higher versions of the kaioken simply by increasing his power level?

Because I always assumed it was through constantly using the technique and tearing his muscles apart that he was able to use higher levels. As your muscles heal, they become stronger than they were previously.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#10000: Dec 30th 2014 at 7:58:48 PM

SS 3 is just a massive energy waster, the only thing that is required to use the form with good results is a tough body with energy to waste.

Dead bodies are the toughest bodies to handle the form, but even so...Goku would revert to base from the amount wasted energy that happens from just using the form. This is the main downside...so Vegetto really shouldn't have much problem.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.

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