So you're wondering why Goku didn't use it in his fight with Cell? Because clearly it was obsolete for him to not use it at all there.
Goku's already capable of launching KHH's with enough power to blow off half of Cell's body, but doing so is incredibly draining for him. Grade III is even more draining than that. Also, we never got any indication that they could just flip it on and off like a switch.
You answered your own question. Goku didn't use it then because he didn't need to use it to fuck up Cell's life.
You know, I'm surprised at how much new shit has happened during the course of the Tournament of Power. I was expecting only like 4 or 5 new transformations and most of the competitors would just stay as they are, but there have been about 28 new characters and/or transformations and/or transformations for new characters just during the course of the tournament alone, with a possible 29 and 30th on the horizon what with Hakaishin Toppo and a possible Ultra Instinct for Vegeta.
edited 3rd Jan '18 3:41:58 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
Well, yeah now that they have Super Saiyan 2 and up. Logically, though, if they're banking on one giant ki blast to do the job, Super Saiyan 1 isn't enough, and they don't have SS2 or up, Grade 3 would give them just the little boost they would need. Again, it's what Roshi does. He saves his buff state for when he needs to do big Kamehamehas or put a bit more power in his physical attacks. Trunks would've benefitted greatly from training under him. Then he wouldn't have made such an amateurish mistake.
edited 3rd Jan '18 3:49:06 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
I agree, logically, if it's their last shot, they should switch into G3 if they don't have SSJ 2.
"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"Roshi didn't use Grade III, it's not the same thing at all and we shouldn't apply the same standards based off that. Besides, Roshi stopped using his buff appearance in the manga anyway.
Goku outright says they don't need Grade III, and it's a bad idea, before 2 was a thing. 2 really has nothing to do with it. And we've seen Goku can put enough power in one blast to blow his load, so he doesn't need to stack another transformation on top of that. Transforming is used for prolonged fights, which Grade III is completely useless in.
Do you have any evidence that it's not the same phenomenon or are you insisting that it isn't just because?
And yeah, Goku says that it's bad because it doesn't work for prolonged fights, which it doesn't, but that's not what I'm talking about here. I'm talking about using it like a Kaioken, or like Roshi does, bursting into it right before firing a Kamehameha designed to end the fight. And yeah, they could use it quickly, as Cell showed.
edited 3rd Jan '18 3:58:02 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
That's not how burden of proof works. They weren't connected by the manga and one is identified as a Super Saiyan transformation. Prove they're connected. What I am saying is that I am not making the assumption that they are the same
You're talking about using it in a way that we haven't seen it be possible. It's not the Kaio-ken. Also, Roshi doesn't use it the way you describe either for what it's worth. He only used it when firing a KHH to destroy large areas.
edited 3rd Jan '18 4:01:48 AM by Saiga
Roshi has used his buff form in Super: to hold a position and one-shot mooks, to beat up Goku and Tenshinhan while possessed, to intimidate Caway, to pump more energy into his Kamehameha to defeat Ganos, and to push back Frost with a surprise attack, Sounds pretty similar to what I'm suggesting and like a smart way to use Grade 3, especially how he used it against Ganos.
Also, how does "Roshi buffs up to fire giant Kamehamehas meant to destroy large objects" not sound similar to "buff up to fire giant blasts meant to finish off opponents"? Either way, you're using the buff state to fire a blast more powerful than you'd be capable of achieving without it.
edited 3rd Jan '18 4:17:11 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
He's never tried to finish off an opponent with a Kamehameha before Super, and he'd never really been in a position where that would be needed. Don't see why a buff Kamehameha would be easier to dodge than a normal Kamehameha, either.
Frankly, Roshi's uses of his buff state are 5 out of 7 times from Super, so I'm not really interested in having a discussion about it if you're ignoring most of the times it was used.
edited 3rd Jan '18 4:45:24 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
He's used the KHH in plenty of fights when things get serious, deciding what he considers a finisher or not seems pretty arbitrary.
But the fact that he doesn't use the KHH as a finisher doesn't seem like much of an argument to him using the KHH as a finisher.
If Super is your only defense, I already pointed out that Super's running on its own logic. And this is originally about Grade III, which predates Super by a looooong time which is why I'm not taking it into consideration.
Super has him use the form to fight in for melee as well so it doesn't even support the point you were making.
edited 3rd Jan '18 4:48:16 AM by Saiga
The official Super twitter
claims that they're going to be releasing new ep.122 shots leading until Saturday, which includes some generally crisp head shots of Freeza
◊, Toppo
◊, Gohan
◊, and pudding-seeking Beerus Dyspo
◊.
Geekdom101 managed to set-up an interview with the former Bruce Faulconer Productions crew to reminisce about their days doing the American soundtrack for the original Z dub and tie-in games.
edited 3rd Jan '18 8:57:16 AM by XMenMutant22
You know, I never would've thought of it, but I really like the direction of having Dyspo take the advantage vs Freeza in their fight. Most people predicted that Freeza would beat Dyspo easily, and given Dyspo's track record it didn't seem unlikely. Dyspo outright having the advantage, though, is a good way to handle it. Have none of the final three Pride Troopers go down easy.
edited 3rd Jan '18 10:45:18 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
i figured out how 17 and 18 are suddenly at SSB level
they have those infinite ki generators right? well they've been generating ki for years now, and neither one of them have been using it much if at all. so it's all just stored up giving them immense strength
this is also somewhat consistent with Z since we know 17 and 18 of the main timeline are stronger than in the future timeline due to being woken up later- and thus had more ki generated than their future counterparts
I'm half serious
"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-MaeThat was actually what we originally heard and theorized when 17 being much stronger was first revealed, but then the episode proper came out and revealed it was due to training. I mean, maybe it could be a mixture of both: infinite energy and light training with Krillin is how 18 is stronger and infinite energy and constantly fighting poachers on a monster island is how 17 is even stronger than that.
Well, Jiren straight up said that aside from Goku and Hit, Toppo and Dyspo can deal with everyone else in the tournament without him, so this should really not come as a surprise. But that went against a lot of folks head cannons, so they immiedietly sprung up with lame excuses like "Jiren didn't mean what he said" or "Jiren has no idea what he's talking about".

If SS2 didn't exist, you can bet your ass that I'd be wondering why the characters didn't just use SS1G3 for big ki blasts, like Roshi does. It may have been replaced by Grade 4, but it was made obsolete by SS2, which is better than it in every way.
And yeah, SSG to SSB is a better way of handling that concept, since the point of using it is to avoid SSB's preexisting stamina issues.
One thing the manga does that annoys me is MSSB. In the Future Trunks arc, it sounds like it's just SSB, but at full power all the time. When Vegeta uses it against Beerus, however, it's after he's already tired himself out a bit using SSB and using it gives him a massive power boost, more power than when his SSB was fresh. So is MSSB actually a separate transformation? Going by AF, I wouldn't put it past Toyotarou to write a stronger transformation that is just a mastered version of the previous form.
edited 3rd Jan '18 3:12:54 AM by PushoverMediaCritic