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randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#70201: Nov 30th 2017 at 7:43:20 PM

Yes, that was the point.

I don't mind if it is, but I haven't really been into the fights too much to begin with.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Jedi1113 Since: Jun, 2009
#70202: Nov 30th 2017 at 8:12:57 PM

Why is wanting a fight to look cool superficial? It is entertainment, it is meant to entertain. Children, I might add. Its perfectly fine and apprecriated to have more depth, but there is no need to look down on anyone that just enjoys the spectacle.

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70203: Nov 30th 2017 at 10:45:55 PM

Because it is superficial. There's nothing wrong with that mind you, but its still only a surface level of thinking when it comes to enjoying fights. And ya know...I'm pretty sure none of us here are children, so its going to take a bit more than a big spectacle to entertain me most of the time. (Unless the spectacle is really fucking good :V)

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#70204: Nov 30th 2017 at 10:51:10 PM

I mean...it has nothing to do with enjoying the fights.

It was more about the moves just looking cool...like the thing I'm getting at here is that I don't think the scene where Piccoro's blast kills Raditz would look as cool if it wasn't a spiraling drill type beam.

That's what stands out to me when it comes to new techniques.

edited 30th Nov '17 10:51:46 PM by randomness4

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#70205: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:05:19 AM

Well barely any of DBZ's fights are intelligent so they might as well be flashy.

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#70206: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:19:10 AM

Its the pinnacle shonen written in the 80s. Of course it isn't necessarily intelligent.

What matters is the emotion.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
hardcorefakes coolest_guy from probably America Since: Oct, 2015 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
coolest_guy
#70207: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:30:12 AM

A lot of people prefer flashy to "intelligence".

A lot of "intelligent" fights just end up being convoluted.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#70208: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:33:02 AM

Convoluted = Good?

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#70209: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:34:36 AM

Or you can be Jo Jo which is flashy *and* intelligent!... most of the time...

The thing is,the most intelligent fights are from the original DB most of the time, which usually required Goku to outthink a bunch of different techniques as has been said above.

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70210: Dec 1st 2017 at 6:30:17 AM

Not really? Like I said before, most of Dragon Ball's fights pre-Z just relied on a bunch of gimmicks that inevitably fell apart once they were figured out. Not really that interesting imo.

I think you're severely undermining most of the fights in this series if all you can take from them is just "Beam spamming"

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#70211: Dec 1st 2017 at 6:36:20 AM

Now, if we're talking the Saiyan saga, then yeah, but after that it just becomes a matter of who can get the best powerup.

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#70212: Dec 1st 2017 at 6:48:04 AM

Y'all might've seen this around, but a Dragon Ball Fusion Generator is too good to pass up.

Personally, I'd say the best results involve 1st Form Cell and/or 3rd Form Freeza.

edited 1st Dec '17 6:53:31 AM by PushoverMediaCritic

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70213: Dec 1st 2017 at 7:39:41 AM

[up][up] Nope. The first part of the Cell saga was more about finding out who the hell Cell was than simply beating him. That didn't come into play after he became Perfect.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#70214: Dec 1st 2017 at 7:48:18 AM

The first part of the Cell Saga they don't even care who Cell is. They're busy fighting androids. When it gets down to actual fights the only real strategy is in trying to acquire or deny potential powerups, and due to You Can't Thwart Stage One the latter tactic never works.

edited 1st Dec '17 7:48:56 AM by Sigilbreaker26

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#70215: Dec 1st 2017 at 8:56:41 AM

So, remember how our conversation kind of veered into talking about Saibamen for a little bit there? Well, the rest of the questions from the Saiyan Q and A were translated, and funny thing about that...

Question 7, about Saibamen.

Question 4, about whether Saiyans train.

Question 6, about Saiyan technology.

Question 10, about becoming strong like Saiyans.

Questions 1, 2, and 8, about Saiyan diet, problems, and whether or not they have holidays.

Fedetropes Call me Blast, not Fedetropes from Doomed universe Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Call me Blast, not Fedetropes
#70216: Dec 1st 2017 at 9:15:57 AM

All this saiyan lore we are learning recently...

¡PONLE QUE DIGA!:"¡HUMONGOSAURIO HASTA LA MUERTE!"
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#70217: Dec 1st 2017 at 11:54:54 AM

Jojo fights aren't intelligent at all. They're very, very dumb though they do have small parts within them that are clever.

Jojo fights are convoluted and use wacky powers, but that's not the same as being intelligent. Often fights are resolved or escalated from things that the viewer didn't know was possible from the established mechanics of the series.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#70218: Dec 1st 2017 at 11:59:02 AM

Even in the series with "intelligent" fights it's not like pure power isn't still important. More to the point, I find complaining about how *gasp* strength is important in a fighting series to be really weird.

It's good to mix things up now and then, but making things overly complicated and wordy isn't really any better than just boring punches or generic energy beams or whatever the "standard" is.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#70219: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:24:00 PM

I tend to see a rift between fans of Dragon Ball and fans of series like Hunter X Hunter and Jo Jo's Bizarre Adventure when it comes to fight portrayals. Since the approaches are different enough between them all, it's not surprising to see both sides dismiss or belittle how their opposing series operates.

TyeDyeWildebeest Unreasonably Quirky from Big Rock Candy Mountain Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: How does it feel to treat me like you do?
Unreasonably Quirky
#70220: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:31:21 PM

More to the point, I find complaining about how *gasp* strength is important in a fighting series to be really weird.

I don't mind strength being a factor; I just don't want it to be the only factor. When other factors are allowed to influence the outcome, you get more variety with the way fights are choreographed.

To cite a recent example, look at Hit vs. Dyspo, one of my favorite fights in the Universe Survival arc. You had someone who could skip time vs. someone fast enough to preempt his attempts to do so. So Dyspo dominated the fight early on, but Hit was able to turn the tables once he found a way to fake Dyspo out.

That's interesting, and it's not needlessly complex or convoluted. It just takes the idea of, "This guy controls time and this guy runs really fast; who wins?" and runs with it.

edited 1st Dec '17 12:33:11 PM by TyeDyeWildebeest

No beer?! But if there's no beer, then there's no beef or beans!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#70221: Dec 1st 2017 at 12:40:08 PM

I didn't say it should be the only factor but the backlash against acknowleging that yes, strength can be the deciding factor, has gotten a bit ridiculous, I think.

edited 1st Dec '17 12:40:38 PM by LSBK

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#70222: Dec 1st 2017 at 1:00:46 PM

I tend to see a rift between fans of Dragon Ball and fans of series like Hunter X Hunter and Jo Jo's Bizarre Adventure when it comes to fight portrayals. Since the approaches are different enough between them all, it's not surprising to see both sides dismiss or belittle how their opposing series operates.

Yea, I've noticed this too. Its kinda awkward since I'm a fan of both series`, so seeing people be so dismissive about one or the other never sat well with me. I suppose it just comes with the territory...and how one side will demean and belittle the other to make theirs looks better by comparison.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#70223: Dec 1st 2017 at 1:29:59 PM

[up] It's this whole idea that every series should follow the same type of model which I disagree with.

I mean yeah, Hunter x Hunter does offer more "strategic" fights compared to the average shonen series, but it also comes at the price of always have massive exposition dumps to explain how all the mechanics work and constant flashbacks within the battle itself to make sense of it.

I love Hunter x Hunter, but I also don't want every shonen to be just like it. At a certain point you kind of have to accept the elements that make up a series. I get the complaints, but it reaches the point where the constant "this should be different" is really about turning Dragon Ball into an entirely different series instead. tongue

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#70224: Dec 1st 2017 at 1:50:44 PM

[up][up][up][up] I don't know, several things in that fight still didn't add up to me. Like Hit had a really easy time beating up Dyspo with the fake out when Dyspo's speed should still be really hard for him to deal with, and it's hard to see how pretending to time skip but not doing so offers any actual advantage.

RJ-19-CLOVIS-93 from New Zealand (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#70225: Dec 1st 2017 at 1:55:34 PM

After seeing the Future Trunks arc, I kind of wonder how Cell would interact with alternate timeline versions of him. Like if for whatever reason he ended up in Trunks' timeline and met Future Cell. Maybe if he became perfect and won, then decided to explore Trunks' timeline


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