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Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#69676: Nov 26th 2017 at 10:33:11 PM

What, like the red hair version? That sounds kind of like cheating to me. Or was he fighting in base/normal SS up to that point?

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#69677: Nov 26th 2017 at 10:36:45 PM

I haven't actually read it but I think the manga went the same way as the anime only instead of Kaioken Blue he just went normal God mode which is yes the red haired one.

Also no I don't think its cheating.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#69678: Nov 26th 2017 at 10:42:52 PM

In the manga, going Super Saiyan Blue twice reduces your power level to below 10%. Super Saiyan God is still weaker than Blue, but Goku uses God and Blue in the manga the same way he uses Kaioken and Kaioken x 10 in the anime, respectively.

edited 26th Nov '17 10:43:15 PM by PushoverMediaCritic

Zeromaeus Since: May, 2010
#69679: Nov 26th 2017 at 10:50:11 PM

The power escalation isn't as steep in the manga.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#69680: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:02:31 PM

Until Vegetto shows up and is compared to Beerus. Then, it's exactly the same.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#69682: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:08:23 PM

But doesn't normal SSG require outside help?

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#69683: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:09:58 PM

Thats only for the first time.

After that you can train yourself to reach it on your own because God Ki has become permanently embedded in your system.

edited 26th Nov '17 11:10:30 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#69684: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:12:03 PM

[up][up] Neither the anime nor manga explain how it became sonething they achieved through training.

But Goku shows it offagainst Hit by transforming into it like any other form.

edited 26th Nov '17 11:12:47 PM by Saiga

DarkHunter from New Mexico Since: Jan, 2001
#69685: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:18:35 PM

But doesn't normal SSG require outside help?

Apparently not, since Vegeta achieved it entirely on his own (offscreen and with no explanation).

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#69686: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:20:52 PM

With Vegeta its a lazy asspull, the logical extension of him first achieving Super Saiyan off-screen all those years ago.

Though with Goku I thought it was because since he did it the first time he can now generate God Ki naturally.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#69687: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:21:21 PM

Vegeta acquired Blue offscreen. I haven't seen him go Red, therefore I was assuming he skipped that stage.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#69688: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:23:36 PM

He gains red in the manga, but they do address it as something he specifically trained for in The Room so I wouldn't say it's an asspull compared to Goku busting it out.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#69689: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:23:41 PM

[up][up] Manga spoiler here: He does go Red in the arc after this one.

edited 26th Nov '17 11:24:04 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#69690: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:24:45 PM

For comparisons' sake, I think the manga is worth reading. It skips RF, and is muuuuuuuuch shorter.

It's alsonot as bad as the anime.

edited 26th Nov '17 11:25:11 PM by Saiga

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#69691: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:26:41 PM

The arts better at least.

Was impressed that Cabba is drawn with actual muscle.

Huh I should get the first volume. Canoniziing Jiren as the DB Superman truly proved the whole thing as worth it in my eyes.

edited 26th Nov '17 11:28:08 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#69692: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:43:10 PM

No no, don't you understand? I don't want to read a mediocre manga, I would to see how truly terrible Super is so I can have an informed opinion when I make fun of it.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#69693: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:43:49 PM

Also, it's exactly the same because either way, Ultra Instinct "Omen" Goku is comparable to Beerus and Vegetto. Blue Kaioken was never the biggest problem with power escalation, Vegetto was. All Kaioken meant was the difference between Vegeta keeping up with Goku, pre-Ultra Instinct, and not.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#69694: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:43:57 PM

Yeah but seeing what the manga does better gives more to laugh at in the anime

[up] Blue Kaio-ken means the difference between Blue Goku and Beerus has to be bigger which does effect the power inflation relative to Goku (the main character).

edited 26th Nov '17 11:46:37 PM by Saiga

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#69695: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:46:25 PM

So you know the villain of the next arc is an evil Goku right?

Oh thats something about the manga I didn't like. Removing Black's fighting narcissist traits & general style of finesse. Those really made him unique & just making him a brute is rather samey.

edited 26th Nov '17 11:47:43 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#69696: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:55:02 PM

[up][up]Doesn't matter. The difference between Goku and Beerus is the same in both mediums because the difference between Goku and Vegetto is the same.

edited 26th Nov '17 11:55:20 PM by PushoverMediaCritic

Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#69697: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:55:15 PM

To be fair, he is an evil version of Goku.

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#69698: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:57:41 PM

[up][up] uh, no it isn't. We don't even know the difference between goku and vegetto

Larfleeze Agent Orange Since: May, 2009
Agent Orange
#69699: Nov 26th 2017 at 11:58:10 PM

Black is a completely different (read: worse) character in the manga.

Do you know what people want the most? Something somebody else has.
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#69700: Nov 27th 2017 at 12:00:28 AM

I really didnt see much difference


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