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I was unclear about which part of my post you were referring to. Although it doesn't really matter whether Saiyan Beyond God is widely accepted or not. There's far too much evidence for it to not exist at this point. It's like gravity, we see the side effects of it, and we can measure how strong it is and how it works, we just have yet to find any conclusive proof of what causes it or where it comes from (though there are theories).
I think what the series needs to do is establish some way for Humans and Namekians to get on god-tier power levels
like, it wouldn't be impossible. but until the series says "here's how they get to this power level" any attempts to bridge the gap will be pointless since it'll just be seen as Super trying to brush scaling under the rug
Super Saiyan God was the way to bridge that gap for Saiyans, Golden form Freiza for, well, Freiza (and all frost demons really). Now just add in, like, Divine Namekian for Piccolo and something for humans. though the series is really hesitant on giving humans any sort of cool things.
"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-MaeThe only humans who could probably use Kaioken without fucking up their bodies would probably be Uub, 17, 18 and maybe Krillin, and I don't know if they could go past the higher multipliers. It'd be easier to go through Elder Kai's ritual, just sit for a day and boom, ultimate power. That reminds me, why didn't Krillin use that power-up he got in episode 76 for the tournament? It's no Ultra Instinct, but it could've helped him a lot if he actually used it.
Piccolo could probably use Kaioken efficiently since his body regenerates, but I'm not sure if he has the stamina to do that constantly. Or he could just unlock the Red-Eye transformation, if they ever canonize that...
edited 25th Oct '17 8:24:33 AM by Rinsankajugin
I don't get how Kaioken fixes anything...it just multiplies your base power level, so they'd still be weak.
I've never seen a fanbase more obsessed with its side characters than Dragon Ball's lol.
Its also not canon.
edited 25th Oct '17 8:23:47 AM by BlackYakuzu94
A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
I think the hold up is that most of these side-characters weren't even side characters originally. Characters like Krillin were straight up main characters up through even most of Z.
So it sucks to see characters that used to get a lot of focus just not get focus anymore, and become more and more irrelevant as the plot's power scaling leaves them behind with no apparent way to catch them up or anything.
edited 25th Oct '17 8:28:11 AM by EpicBleye
"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-Mae![]()
So is Broly. Didn't stop anyone from referencing him.
edited 25th Oct '17 8:28:06 AM by LordVatek
This song needs more love.![]()
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Yeah, but nowadays, Kaioken x 20 would allow the humans to fight opponents who are slightly weaker than Super Saiyan 1 Goku. If Krillin had Kaioken x 20, he might've been able to defeat Frost. It wouldn't just be used to put them on the same level as the base Saiyans because they're already on that level right now.
Not with the spoilers: Kafla might.
edited 25th Oct '17 8:47:03 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
I'm guessing 113 is Goku vs Caulifla for the first half and Goku vs Caulifla and Kale for the second half.
The episode after that, 114, will be Goku vs Caulifla and Kale for the first half, then the U3 Megazord shows up and Kafla appears to beat it. Remember that 114 mentions a New Super Warrior, so Kafla's first appearance will be in that one.
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Frost was stronger than Piccolo back in the U6 arc, back when both were weaker than Super Saiyan 1 Goku. Nowadays, Frost had gotten a bit stronger (compare his performance against SS1 Goku to against SS1 Vegeta recently and there's a noticeable difference) while Piccolo has gotten enormously stronger, more so than Super Saiyan 2 Gohan.
edited 25th Oct '17 9:32:34 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
So, on the B-team, just have them deal with weaker antagonists. Chiaotzu worked wonderfully as Krillin's opponent in his debut, after all. I'm not saying everybody should get to Goku's level, as Goku is always a step ahead (and Vegeta catching up almost inmediately is quite refreshing as a concept). But seeing some sort of progress in the other martial artists wouldn't be unwelcome. After all, in the 23rd Tenkaichi, Goku and Piccolo were far ahead of everybody, but Krillin vs. Piccolo was an enjoyable fight and not a slaughter, and Tien vs. Taopaipai showed how far everybody had came, even if Goku was far ahead.
In my opinion, the non-Saiyans shouldn't feel fragile, but they shouldn't feel like a match for the main antagonist.
And, on Super's power scaling, after seeing the manga go with Toppo having God Ki, I think I'll wait for its take before jumping to conclusions.
edited 25th Oct '17 9:40:55 AM by Eriorguez
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Yeah, and I'm factoring in Saiyan Beyond God, so current Goku isn't that much stronger than he was during the Buu Saga. One only needs to look at Goku and Gohan's little spar at the beginning of Krillin's two-parter before this arc started for evidence. In it, Goku had a slight but not completely overwhelming advantage over Gohan when they were sparring in Super Saiyan 1.
edited 25th Oct '17 9:49:18 AM by PushoverMediaCritic
Ah yes, the elusive Sayian Beyond God.
Leaving that aside, it's obvious that Goku was just playing around with Gohan there and purposefully keep himself to his level. Because even if Goku was only slightly above his Buu saga level, Gohan was still rusty at that point and well below his own Buu saga level, so Goku should have stomped him regardless. So no, you can't really use that "fight" as a proof of anything.

Yes, consistency was kind of odd there.
A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.