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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#6451: May 19th 2014 at 7:42:39 AM

And then Raditz never did anything with the knowledge until twenty years later?

The more I think about it, the more I realize there are a lot of either unanswered questions or just questions with answers I don't know about Raditz's arrival on Earth, the biggest one being, why now?

The impression I was under originally was that Raditz was sent to retrieve Kakarot because his mission was supposed to have been over, like, a long time ago. Is that still correct?

edited 19th May '14 7:44:38 AM by TobiasDrake

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BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
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#6452: May 19th 2014 at 10:24:23 AM

[up]Pretty much. It was supposed to have been over the first full moon after he was born.

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
RedM Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
#6453: May 19th 2014 at 11:36:57 AM

Well, guys, this is it! I'm leaving to be an LDS missionary in Peru. See you guys in two years, and take good care of Jim for me! Red out! cool

The very best, like no one ever was. Check out my Spider-Man fanfic here! [1]
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#6454: May 19th 2014 at 11:37:59 AM

~Salutes~

God speed man. God speed.

One Strip! One Strip!
Fizzo Supervillain from Brazil Since: Jun, 2010
Supervillain
#6455: May 19th 2014 at 1:18:16 PM

[up][up][up][up] Raditz never cared about Kakarott. He was only getting him 20 year later, because they found a planet that he, Vegeta and Nappa together couldn't defeat. And then they decided to call a fourth Sayan and give it a try...

...

...and then this planet is never mentioned again. What about these guys who could kick Vegeta's Ass? Could they resist Freeza to? What race is this? I never really thought about it before, but this failed sayan invasion could become a plot-point if Toriyama really thought about it.

edited 19th May '14 1:53:00 PM by Fizzo

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#6456: May 19th 2014 at 1:22:38 PM

I always chalked that up to Early-Installment Weirdness. Raditz talks like the three Saiyans are the only ones in this planet selling business so trying to get another one to help them with a particularly dangerous planet would make sense. This becomes strange when you realize that the Planet Trade Organization is really damn huge. They couldn't get help from any of the countless other aliens in it? It's not like Goku was incredibly powerful at this point. Most of Frieza's army probably could have kicked his ass so why go to him for help?

edited 19th May '14 1:30:44 PM by Kostya

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6457: May 19th 2014 at 1:27:56 PM

Would any of Frieza's men actually bother to help them, because I thought all of them looked down on the Saiyans, well everyone significant anyways.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#6458: May 19th 2014 at 1:30:12 PM

They can't have all hated the Saiyans and if Goku with a power level of 300 would be useful then a few random Frieza troops with levels of 1000 would make the mission trivially easy.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#6459: May 19th 2014 at 1:55:55 PM

Which brings us right back to unanswered questions.

Toriyama wrote by the seat of his pants, so it makes sense that there would be, I just never really noticed outside the Cell Saga before.

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Fizzo Supervillain from Brazil Since: Jun, 2010
Supervillain
#6460: May 19th 2014 at 2:14:13 PM

Vegeta probably thought that asking for another Sayan for help was less humiliating than asking for Freeza for help. Or the mission was just an excuse to get rid of Raditz.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#6461: May 19th 2014 at 2:25:43 PM

That might be it. Even when you accept that Saiyan pride prevented him from asking Frieza for help it's kind of odd that Raditz said Goku could be useful. What did they expect to deal with that Vegeta wasn't able to fight off? Goku would have been swatted aside like a bug by a Vegeta level opponent and anything weak enough for him to fight would have been no trouble for Vegeta. The entire scenario sounds like it was some kind of excuse for Raditz to go find his brother but he acts like that was the honest reason he came.

ScorpioRat from Houston, Texas Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: Forming Voltron
#6462: May 19th 2014 at 2:55:02 PM

Maybe Raditz assumed Goku still had his tail so he could at least transform into a Great Ape and have a Power Level of 3000 during a full moon.

Kaitenhammer Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
#6463: May 19th 2014 at 3:01:18 PM

Maybe they would beat up and heal Goku several times so he would get Zenkais (how did it worked again?) if he wasn't up to their expectations.

BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
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#6464: May 19th 2014 at 3:28:30 PM

And Raditz just plain didn't expect Goku to be so weak when he got there, if I'm remembering right.

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
Spirit Pretty flower from America Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Hooked on a feeling
Pretty flower
#6465: May 19th 2014 at 10:33:13 PM

Indeed.

edited 19th May '14 10:33:26 PM by Spirit

#IceBearForPresident
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#6466: May 19th 2014 at 10:48:24 PM

They also could literally grow Raditzes, in the form of Saibamen. And it's kind of unreasonable for Raditz to expect Goku to be stronger when he arrived on Earth; most of his strength came from his martial arts and various training and power boosts he picked up in his adventures around the planet. If everything had gone as planned and Oozaru Goku destroyed the Earth, he would have been substantially weaker when Raditz found him.

Power level escalation confused the hell out of this plot point. The Goku they could reasonably expect to find on Earth is so weak as to be completely and utterly irrelevant to anything they could possibly hope for him to do.

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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#6467: May 20th 2014 at 3:50:16 AM

Goku was weak for a Saiyan because he hadn't been exposed to Planet Vegeta's high gravity from birth. It makes sense for Raditz to be surprised he was so weak unless he's aware of how big a part the gravity they're used to plays in their strength. And Scorpio's right - he expected Goku to still have his tail. Which makes him even more valuable than the Saibaimen, who don't even grow in all conditions.

As for why not use Freeza's forces, well that depends on how you interpret that post-Freeza revelations. Saiyan to Freeza is one of the awkwardest transitions in the series, and some things need to be re-imagined to fit. The easiest way is probably to view Vegeta's group in a similar way to Ginyu's group - mercenaries paid by Freeza. And it sure as hell is a lot better if they can accomplish the job them-self rather than having their payer chip in.

FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#6468: May 20th 2014 at 8:40:47 AM

[up][up][up]

I thought that was one of those lame, ERB spin-offs. But no. No, it's really real. They did Rick vs Walter, and now Superman vs Goku.

[lol]

That is just fantastic.

BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
Hey there! Having fun?
#6469: May 20th 2014 at 9:20:18 AM

On the topic of Superman/Goku... I always thought Great Saiyaman REALLY wouldn't be out of place in a Western Silver Age comic. I'd like to see some kind of fanwork depicting him that way.

edited 20th May '14 9:22:59 AM by BaffleBlend

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#6471: May 21st 2014 at 7:16:34 AM

Sweet! Another next-gen game that I won't have to buy a next-gen console for!

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BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
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#6472: May 21st 2014 at 7:53:15 AM

Those stages are damn purdy.

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
bloodsquirrel Since: May, 2011
#6473: May 21st 2014 at 10:20:38 AM

Well,

  1. Radditz ddin't expect Goku to be so weak. He expected Goku to have spent his life exterminating the locals. Oozaru wouldn't do it 100%- it isn't controlled or methodical enough. Goku was behind the curve because he spent most of early life (11 years) not really fighting at all. He probably expected at least a pl of 1000, plus he'd have oozaru, giving him ~10,000. That's more than most of Frieza's men.

  2. The Saibamen didn't have oozaru. Also, there's a difference between having the same power level as Radditz and actually being as strong as Radditz. There is also skill to consider, and the Saibamen also kind of struck me as being a little fragile for their PL.

Of course, the real question is "An infinite number of lessers are no match for one elite" Vegeta would think to even bother with Radditz or Kakarot. I've always kind of wondered if it was Radditz' idea, with Vegeta just shrugging and saying "Yeah, whatever."

edited 21st May '14 10:26:35 AM by bloodsquirrel

BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
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#6474: May 21st 2014 at 10:38:12 AM

...it just occurred to me that Great Ape Vegeta was stronger than Captain Ginyu (180k vs. 160k). If Yajirobe hadn't come along, things would've been bad.

edited 21st May '14 10:39:05 AM by BaffleBlend

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#6475: May 21st 2014 at 11:19:04 AM

[up][up] How could Goku possibly achieve such a power level on Earth? The locals don't offer that much of a challenge. Kid Goku was running rings around the most powerful military force on the planet even without Oozaru, and he was much weaker than the Goku that Raditz actually found. The only reason Goku is as powerful as he is at the beginning of the Saiyan Saga is because he hasn't been exterminating the locals and instead has been on a wild adventure, learning the arts and abilities of Earth.

Evil Saiyan Goku's power level would have been a joke compared to post-Piccolo Goku. There just aren't enough enemies worth fighting on Earth to get him anywhere close to Raditz.

edited 21st May '14 11:20:08 AM by TobiasDrake

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