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theweirdKiddokun What a Wonderful World! from Last Place in the Race Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
What a Wonderful World!
#6376: May 6th 2014 at 12:49:38 PM

I also think he does not want to make another long runner I can't remember where I have heard that, but that could of of change.

edited 6th May '14 12:49:59 PM by theweirdKiddokun

The Reaper Games starts anew.
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#6377: May 6th 2014 at 1:03:27 PM

Toriayama: Became Disinterested in Fighting Manga, quote:

The greatest enemy fight in “Kai” is the sublime face-off with Majin Buu, and Majin Buu was also the final enemy in Dragon Ball's weekly manga serialization. The final enemy is round, strong, and very persistent! ...It was such a repetitious and violent fight that even me, the person drawing the manga, came to hate continuing the fight. Now that I've become an old man with high blood pressure and a liking for bland foods, I will not draw this kind of fighting again. Actually, I've lost the want to draw fighting manga ever since [the Majin Buu saga].

That makes me feel bad for him. That's partly why spin-offs don't bother me and why I've given up on searching for consistency. Battle of Gods just was. I feel like Toriyama's entering his Stan Lee period, where he's just making cameos in major blockbusters/feature films and not making a big storm about it. He's just calmly looking back on his life's work and poking at it with a fork and smiling.

I don't really fault Toriyama for coming up with the absurdity we saw in Episode of Bardock(?), or further issues with power levels. Everything after the Buu Saga has been comedy skit after comedy skit. If that's how he's easing into old age, let him. Hell, I think if I wrote an award winning fiction that gained such renown, I'd be poking fun at it in my later years the same way. With doujinshi like Dragonball AF and web comics like Multiverse, honestly, it's not like there aren't talented individuals who could produce a loyal, Expanded Universe reboot, if given the time.

Of course, if there were a reboot, and say Toriyama decided to pass on the reigns, I think a good number of fans would be waiting out on his (or the new director's) lawn with napalm and billy clubs. So if there is a possibility of a reboot, I hope he kicks into gear before he gets to the point where he plain can't sit down and draw for hours on end anymore.

Also:

Now that I've become an old man with high blood pressure and a liking for bland foods,

F-cking what? [awesome][lol]

[down]Absolutely nothing? We're not talking "he did the character designs and let them go to town". Regardless.

edited 6th May '14 1:44:55 PM by FOFD

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6378: May 6th 2014 at 1:14:34 PM

Actually, Toriyama had nothing to do with the Episode of Bardock thing.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
FireShadow (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#6379: May 6th 2014 at 1:22:00 PM

[up][up] You make a good point. I mean now that I think about it he has really become the Stan Lee of manga. He legacy will forever remain God-like and he doesn't necessarily have to make awesome contributions all time, just the little tidbit here and there.

That's probably why we've gotten so much exposition in the last few months that may see small to him but big to us.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#6380: May 6th 2014 at 4:21:03 PM

The contradiction in DB- is that Goku is sent to Earth as a three year old, in Saiyan armor, not as a baby, and that he apparently knocks Gohan out and eats all of his food. This is a point against DB-. It's a retcon, it's not consistent.

Not consistent with what? None of that is inconsistent with the manga, and it's not billed as being consistent with the original special or anime, nor does it have any reason to be.

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6381: May 6th 2014 at 4:35:37 PM

I think the biggest contradiction is that it removed Bardock's last stand against Frieza. Even in the manga, Frieza refers to Bardock as the Saiyan who stood against him when he destroyed Planet Vegeta, and yet Dragon Ball Minus makes absolutely no mention of that ever happening, and instead implies that Bardock died along with the rest of his race after the one month period doing nothing of significance.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#6382: May 6th 2014 at 4:42:46 PM

No it doesn't. Like it was said, there's still a month until Vegeta's destruction and Bardock already suspects Freeza. There's no reason to assume he just sat around until the planet exploded.

Fizzo Supervillain from Brazil Since: Jun, 2010
Supervillain
#6383: May 7th 2014 at 12:04:52 PM

[up][up]It did? On the contrary, stablished Bardock as the only Sayan that didn't trust Freeza summon, and so, when the moment comes, it will make perfectly sense that he will be the one who will rebel against Freeza and stand against him until the last moment.

Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#6384: May 7th 2014 at 1:39:20 PM

DB- is just a checklist. "Oh, I need to show Goku's mom. Moving on. Oh, I need to show baby Goku. Moving on. Oh, I need to show Raditz and Vegeta. Moving on. Oh, I need to show Frieza. Moving on."

DB- is legitimately awful. It's the first Dragonball-related thing Toriyama's done that I absolutely hate. I don't understand why he even bothered doing this when it was so shit compared to the Bardock special. As Saiga pointed out, the one good thing about DB- is it kept Bardock's power level low... but it still made him special in that he was a family man instead of the gruff soldier he'd most likely be.

Edit: About Bardock's ~10K power level in the special: In all honesty, they could just go back and change the scientist's dialog to say his power level was something like 1800, but climbing. It really doesn't affect his battle portrayal. When he faced the elites (re: mid-classes) Dodoria sent to kill him, he didn't overpower them, he outsmarted them. The next battle feat he had was barely surviving Dodoria's mouth blast. What that means is, apart from that scientist's one line, Bardock being a legit low-class-level Saiyan in the special is pretty much what's shown.

edited 7th May '14 4:58:17 PM by Cruherrx

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
Hey there! Having fun?
#6385: May 8th 2014 at 11:45:24 AM

That said, though, I'm kind of willing to accept the Strictly Formula Gine if the alternative is "strongest saiyan alive period" Hanasia. Shame that Gine did wind up being Strictly Formula, though.

I wouldn't've minded the whole chef thing if she was able to fight as well as that.

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#6386: May 8th 2014 at 6:50:07 PM

I really liked that Goku's father was some low-class trash. Made it feel like all he got he got on his own. Look at Naruto, who is descended from super special awesome people and has all these powers only they had, or Yusuke Urameshi, who is descended from the super special awesomest demon evah, and has super special awesome demon powers because of it, etc.

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#6387: May 8th 2014 at 7:52:01 PM

I totally prefer Gine to Hanasia. Her being a low-class fighter like Bardock (and not peaceful or gentle like a Saiyan shouldn't be) would be best though.

[up][up][up] One more thing about Toriyama's checklist:

"I need to shove a poorly placed reference to Battle of Gods in here that messes with continuity!"

edited 8th May '14 7:52:50 PM by Saiga

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6388: May 8th 2014 at 7:58:58 PM

Especially since Beerus himself didn't get a reference, despite the fact that he's the one who ordered Frieza to destroy the saiyans in the first place.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6390: May 8th 2014 at 8:11:40 PM

No to what?

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#6391: May 8th 2014 at 8:19:03 PM

He didn't order Freeza to destroy Vegeta. He just didn't bother destroying Vegeta because Freeza would do it himself.

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6392: May 8th 2014 at 8:21:52 PM

Didn't he tell Frieza to destroy the saiyans for him since he was too lazy to, with the plan that he would be going after Frieza next after he woke up from his hibernation?

edited 8th May '14 8:22:14 PM by Ssj3Gojira

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#6393: May 8th 2014 at 8:26:18 PM

Nope. He had plans to destroy Vegeta, but didn't because he was too lazy. He knew Freeza would destroy Vegeta eventually and so left it to him.

Cruherrx I say things. from my own little world Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
I say things.
#6394: May 9th 2014 at 7:15:58 AM

That was an early rumor/mistranslation about the film.

@DB-, Frieza randomly mentioning Super Saiyan God came right the fuck out of nowhere. And then he, in a rather shitty way, reference the lie he's gonna tell Vegeta and the other too about a comet.

edited 9th May '14 7:16:52 AM by Cruherrx

"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
Hey there! Having fun?
#6395: May 9th 2014 at 8:31:49 AM

I like the idea of the Original Super Saiyan being an SSG. But I also like the anime's brief depiction of him as a Golden Great Ape.

...Maybe he was a Red Great Ape.

And while we're on the topic, I saw a Youtube commentor suggest that SSG recursively makes Goku's sudden overwhelming powerup against Broly more watchable – he suggested that him absorbing Trunks', Gohan's, Piccolo's, and Vegeta's energy allowed him to briefly tap into the SSG's power. I'm not sure I entirely agree, but it's a pretty interesting theory.

edited 9th May '14 8:38:25 AM by BaffleBlend

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6396: May 9th 2014 at 8:52:16 AM

[up][up] About the Super Saiyan God thing, how would he have even learned about it? None of the saiyans knew about it, King Kai didn't know about it, the Supreme Kais possibly didn't know about it, hell the only people who knew were Shenron, which really doesn't make any sense, and Beerus; why wasn't he mentioned as at least the one who told him that.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#6397: May 9th 2014 at 9:17:50 AM

[up] It just doesn't make sense, and contradicts the film. Toriyama does a lot of that, like when he gave a contradictory explanation for why Beerus destroyed Kaio's planet to the reason the film gave.

[up][up] What idea? DB- didn't mean Super Saiyan God was the legend, and Battle of Gods is pretty clear that this is not the case.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#6398: May 9th 2014 at 9:34:44 AM

[up]

It seems like Toriyama is either incapable of keeping track of anything he does, or just doesn't care enough to bother.

Considering he's more about Gag Manga where Rule of Funny reigns over everything, it makes sense.

One Strip! One Strip!
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#6399: May 9th 2014 at 9:52:47 AM

To be fair, he's also never had that great of a memory to begin with, since he forgot Launch even existed even though he was drawing her during the fight between Goku and Piccolo Jr.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#6400: May 9th 2014 at 10:21:11 AM

Yeah, I know this has probably been asked before, but do we have 100% confirmation that he really just forgot about her?

One Strip! One Strip!

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