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There's a difference between being passionate about a character you like, and being obnoxious and saying they "deserve" this or that because you like them.
I liked Gohan, and do you think I was not mad as fuck when he got swept aside near the end of Z and then Super comes around and punctuates it? I fucking hated that shit, but I didn't go around cursing at Toriyama and swearing everybody was against him and that he "deserves" the spotlight back. I'm happy he's getting focus again, but it's not like I was losing sleep over it either.
edited 5th Sep '17 5:44:18 PM by BlackYakuzu94
A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.Goku doesn't really "deserve" to be the main character, but he is because that's how Toriyama wants it be. If and when Toriyama or whoever changes their mind about that, it doesn't somehow equate to Goku being shafted or whatever.
"There is no such thing as characters being treated well or treated badly, only their role in the story" is certainly one way to look at it, but it's not the most legitimate way to look at it and a lot of people in this thread treat it like it is. Who deserves what is based on how the person views the character, that's why it's subjective.
Probably because people tend to frame their opinions as being more objective than they are, and other fans being idiots for not having the same view. (also it's a weird turnaround to say shutting down people who are shutting down people is actually the real bad thing)
I don't actually even like Tien that much lol. I just get annoyed at how obnoxious people can get about Tien fans.
edited 5th Sep '17 5:47:02 PM by Moth13
I feel like a lot of this can just be framed over good writing or not. Which, admittedly is largely subjective but still, if a character has a more or less satisfying ending to their character arc, it becomes harder for me to sympathize with a lot of the complaints.
Which is, again, why I better understand complaints about Gohan's situation than Tenshinhan's.
People shouldn't have to go "In my opinion..." for everything they say, that's not how people talk. Honestly, if that's something you have an issue with, I'd say the problem lies more with you than anyone else.
edited 5th Sep '17 5:48:49 PM by LSBK
Assholes will be treated like assholes. Tiens fans (not you or anyone here) are generally assholes, so they will be treated like assholes.
The difference between Gohan and Tien is that the former had way more involvement in the overall narrative. Yea, it's because he's "the main character's son", but that was the entire point of his character, he was designed to be the next generation after Goku.
That's way more important to the narrative than being simply another rival. Or more simply, Goku's had dozens of rivals, but he only has two sons...and only one of them has ever actually be relevant to anything.
edited 5th Sep '17 5:52:17 PM by BlackYakuzu94
A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.And anyway, it's not like I have something against Tenshinhan or anyone else doing things. It's just that as far as Super goes, they often do it in a way that I find convincing or well-executed.
And when that happens, I'm going to voice those thoughts, and I expect that others who disagree will do the same. That's how discussions work.
There have been sometimes that I have thought were executed well (enough).
edited 5th Sep '17 5:56:04 PM by LSBK
Seriously tho, the thing with Tien is that he has nothing going for him except martial arts and thats something he'll never excel at so he pretty much has nothing worthwile. Other humans have stuff to them that makes them interesting even if they can't keep up with the power levels, but Tien is just the guy who constantly trains to get stronger but can't catch up anyway. You see the problem?
The biggest difference between Gohan and Tenshinhan is that Gohan actually was being prepared for a larger role, held that role and when the prioritizes shifted the way they made Goku the lead again was really poorly handled and incredibly transparent. They struggled to justify it in-universe, and still struggle with what to do with him going forward because it doesn't make sense to write him out, unlike Tenshinhan who is a solitary guy and really easy to get rid off.
Small aside: I preferred Ten having a farm over a dojo. Both are good ways to retire his character, but the farm adds something to him beyond fighting.
Edit: Everything said on this is subjective. In fact, I'm someone who doesn't believe in objectivity (or at least, humans are incapable of truly perceiving it).
I do not believe anything I say is objective, but it's still possible to be confident about your subjective beliefs.
I don't think Yakazu is acting like only his interpretation counts either.
edited 5th Sep '17 6:07:14 PM by Saiga

Don't we have a trope for that?
"Mai waifu."