1718 makes about as much sense as 35. Given that 17 and 18 are treated more like proper names now, maybe even more sense.
Super!17 likely isn't stronger than Super 17, Toshio later stated that Goku held back and 17 is probably weaker than Gohan. Like I said, the dude flip flops constantly.
And yeah, Kuririn beating any angel is definitely "this has gone horribly wrong" territory. It isn't anything like their current prominence.
And with the way Super widened the gap between Goku and Beerus, anyone beating an angel would seem weird at this point. If they do turn out evil, it will take a lot of justification to beat them.
edited 4th Sep '17 6:29:08 PM by Saiga
A lot of things are being retconned it seems.
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I keep forgetting about Frieza, but he might actually be tied with either Goku for strongest, or Vegeta for second strongest.
One Strip! One Strip!Like I said, Toshio retcons everything, constantly.
He said 17 was the third strongest, and could fight on par with Blue Goku.
He later said Piccolo and Gohan had been training and may be stronger than 17.
He then said 17 was equal to Gohan, and both were stronger than Piccolo.
He also later said Goku going Blue was just to motivate 17.
Yeah, but that's true of the show as well
I feel like 17's retconned strength is probably what the tournament will go with. Right now he doesn't feel like a Blue level fighter.
edited 4th Sep '17 6:45:31 PM by Saiga
Hah, that's true.
But I think Toshio's retcons end up being more reasonable than what the episodes originally imply, like Roshi being powered up with Yurin instead of that just being the power he had been keeping secret (which Goku claimed in the episode).
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We can't really know that for sure. Which makes it no different to anything else in Super lol
edited 4th Sep '17 6:54:46 PM by Saiga
He said 17 was the third strongest, and could fight on par with Blue Goku.
He later said Piccolo and Gohan had been training and may be stronger than 17.
He then said 17 was equal to Gohan, and both were stronger than Piccolo.
He also later said Goku going Blue was just to motivate 17.
Oof, I didn't know it was that bad.
edited 4th Sep '17 6:55:11 PM by VeryMelon
I think it's a combination of both. Roshi was phenomenally stronger due to training and Yurin's magic powered him up even more past that. I mean, it made a bunch of losers who weren't even able to focus ki fly.
Besides, while Toshio may release slightly contradictory statements, those statements are supposed to fuction partially as advertisement for the upcoming episodes and he only knows what Toei and Toriyama have decided at that moment. Not to mention that they change to reflect the reality of the show on an episode by episode basis. They don't even decide on the episode names before only about 4 or so episodes prior.
Far as I see it, neither current Gohan nor current 17 are at Blue level and neither was ever at Blue level, but both are hovering around that tier. Maybe they're at the level of God, maybe Saiyan Beyond God, either way they're in-between Blue and 3.
How? I don't think they tell him enough for him to serve as a completely reliable Word of God.

It should be Android 35.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."