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LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#60176: Jul 4th 2017 at 3:55:43 PM

Not really Android Saga has shown that they're team players. Even when Piccolo was top dog, after the kami fusion, he still worked together with the humans instead of doing his own thing.

Worked together to find Cell/the Androids. There was never any illusion that they were going to dog pile either of them, he was obviously going to handle that himself. Like he did when the Androids arrived and he went off, by himself. He also told the others to let him fight Andrid 20/Dr. Gero alone.

And the entire reason that Tenshinhan even wanted to let the androids arrive was so that he could test himself against them. Has he lost that mindset?

That they're willing to work together isn't the same thing as them being willing to fight together. Though in that area, Piccolo has shown himself to be more amenable than Tenshinhan.

edited 4th Jul '17 3:57:01 PM by LSBK

Shlugo_the_great King of Burgers from Far Far Away (On A Trope Odyssey) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
King of Burgers
#60177: Jul 4th 2017 at 3:56:54 PM

Well, it's not a horrible plan, given that they just need to not fall to contribute.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#60178: Jul 4th 2017 at 3:59:46 PM

Ya know there was some teamwork in the Android Saga, namely distracting Cell while they attempt to incapacitate the Androids.

Sad Krillen & Vegeta fucked that up & made Piccolo & Tien's sacrifices pointless.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#60179: Jul 4th 2017 at 3:59:52 PM

That's why I said, it gives the illusion they're contributing while still having Goku and Vegeta do everything. Its just like in the last tournament where despite having a 5 v 5, Goku & Vegeta were the only ones who actually pulled any sort of weight.

[up]That's...not really teamwork, it wasn't even a strategy. It was more "Get the fuck out of here while I distract him" You Shall Not Pass! or some shit.

Dragon Ball is the pure embodiment of the Battle Shonen genre, where most if not all disputes are settled with 1 v 1 fights. Shit like "strategy" has never been the focal point, ever.

edited 4th Jul '17 4:01:38 PM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#60180: Jul 4th 2017 at 4:02:46 PM

I image that this will be slightly different just because of how many participants there are. Goku and Vegeta will still probably due most things (just look at those spoilers), but a "bone" will be thrown to the others somewhat.

Also, Frieza will probably due a lot, so that's a third person getting weight. Although, I feel the vibe here is that he's already overexposed...

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#60181: Jul 4th 2017 at 4:03:42 PM

[up][up] Heh its you like you said this is not a teamwork series.

I'll take what I can get. tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#60182: Jul 4th 2017 at 4:07:45 PM

>Build up every member of the team within an entire cour of the Anime season

>Makes them fuck off for The Hero and The Rival to do all of the work, as well as the villain who had already came back before.

Dragon Ball Super everybody.

edited 4th Jul '17 4:07:53 PM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#60183: Jul 4th 2017 at 4:11:30 PM

They prolly should have kept the typical tournament format instead of making it a battle royal.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#60184: Jul 4th 2017 at 4:14:28 PM

One good thing about having Frieza back is that apparently having him on screen means they're going to put serious effort into everything. His transformation sequence was fantastic.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#60185: Jul 4th 2017 at 4:51:18 PM

Footage from the new 4D Broly God movie, even shows the fusing!

Also, a new commercial for Super DBH showing off the new characters!

hardcorefakes coolest_guy from probably America Since: Oct, 2015 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
coolest_guy
#60186: Jul 4th 2017 at 4:58:19 PM

[up][up][up]

Too many fights to animate though.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#60187: Jul 4th 2017 at 6:57:34 PM

Seriously, its been 1 episode and 1 minute into the tournament. There's no doubt in my mind that everyone on U7 is getting a fight for themselves here at some point. The episode everyone is complaining about, with Team Nerd trying a new formation while Vegeta tries to solo U6, is even titled after Krillin!

Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#60188: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:00:20 PM

That's also not how the scene was played. What's really weird about the teamwork being ineffective is that base Gohan was strong enough to hurt Lavender before his training and now his attack has no effect at all.

I guess the character's literally are as strong as the plot at the moment needs them to be.

hardcorefakes coolest_guy from probably America Since: Oct, 2015 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
coolest_guy
#60189: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:08:54 PM

Clearly Lavender has been using the same training regimen that Frieza used to become god tier.

Except it only took Lavender two days.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#60190: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:11:02 PM

He was also looking for more teammates along with his brothers in those two days.

That's one hell of a training regime.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#60191: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:14:27 PM

Maybe one of the other dudes surrounding Team Nerd used some kind of secret technique to nullify the attack completely.

You know what I'd like to see for the next arc:

A Dragonball hunt...where the other side has motives that are as benevolent (or possibly even more benevolent) than our heroes.

The Pride Troopers are genuine heroes who just think Goku is a bad guy, but it would be interesting if they went up against people who's reason to use the balls is just as good as their, and both sides know it.

It's never happened in the series before, and say what you will about Super, I think it has churned out some unique scenarios in part, even if it's execution has been poor.

One Strip! One Strip!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#60192: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:21:46 PM

LSBK & Black, I think you are overstating the aversion to teamwork the characters have in the manga. While the series is mostly 1 on 1 fights due to being Shonen, most of the time that comes down to people being unable to help rather than the fighters not wanting it.

Goku may have wanted his friends to stay out of his 23rd Budokai fight, but that was because he didn't want to give up the Budokai in order to win. Even then, they made it clear that Goku's friends were helpless later in the fight. He was thankful when Ten saved him from Daimao, he teamed up with Piccolo against Raditz, and accepted help against Vegeta.

Most of the cast were fine with working together against Nappa, and only let Vegeta fight 18 alone because their combined strength isn't enough to make up for 17 joining the fight if they got involved.

Even Vegeta wanted to fight Freeza and the Ginyu Force with allies, but they went along with the Ginyu Force's rules because they were outnumbered. During the Android arc he's more prickly about receiving help because he became a LOT more egotistical.

I think the biggest contributor to the current "we don't work together" portrayal of the characters is the battle with Pure Boo, where Goku and Vegeta turn down fusion and take turns fighting him. However, that was because they didn't take Pure Boo seriously at all: Goku regrets breaking the potara and after his ephinany Vegeta tells Goku to forget his turn and just end it.

The manga version of the Fused Zamasu fight reminds me of this most, with the way they take turns except here they know they're outclassed but still act the same way. It only makes sense after they defuse and Vegeta has to stall followed by Goku being the only one able to fight.

The issue with the TOP isn't that they're having the characters try teamwork, it's that they're acting like they're strong enough to actually use it.

He's a strategist by the low standards of the show.

No, he isn't. He has an incredibly poor track record for planning & decision making and he does not use strategies signicantly more than the other cast members.

It's pure fanon. There's a big fallacy in the fandom that the weaker characters must be smarter/more skilled/have something that makes them special when there is nothing to back it up.

edited 4th Jul '17 7:27:01 PM by Saiga

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#60193: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:28:26 PM

My point was less that they wouldn't work together and more that they'd at least try and go at it on their own first. Or well, that's the point I wanted to make. Should have made that clear.

Also, I love that we're just calling the ones who stayed behind Team Nerd now.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#60194: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:31:16 PM

I don't get that, Gohan's the only one who could be called a nerd. Or is it because it's his team?

And I don't think Ten would try on his own because he knows by this point how useless he is (see Android arc). Realistically he'd eithr tell them to get someone else or try his best to go unnoticed so he doesn't reduce U7's chances by getting eliminated.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#60195: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:31:49 PM

What does "Team Nerd" even mean?

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#60196: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:32:50 PM

I don't really like it either. I think it's just because Gohan is the leader of the team.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#60197: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:33:01 PM

I'm assuming it's because Gohan is the "leader". It doesn't make much sense but it's still entertaining.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#60198: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:36:59 PM

One idea I've had since long before the tournament even started was that U7 would win solely because of Gohan and his group hanging in there until the time runs out. Like, Goku, Vegeta, Freeza, and 17 are all eliminated late in the tournament and Gohan's group is left standing at the end, giving U7 the victory by numbers.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#60199: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:37:52 PM

And you imagine that happening how?

edited 4th Jul '17 7:38:52 PM by LSBK

hardcorefakes coolest_guy from probably America Since: Oct, 2015 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
coolest_guy
#60200: Jul 4th 2017 at 7:38:02 PM

[up]x6

Hey now, you're assuming there isn't Tien-level fodder for him to face.

He'll face some jobbers, and then get ringed out. Same for Krillin and Roshi. Although it seems like Krillin's getting an episode dedicated to his "latent power", so who knows.

edited 4th Jul '17 7:38:14 PM by hardcorefakes


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