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sockpuppet1 Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#5926: Mar 23rd 2014 at 11:50:43 AM

Cooler's statement probably only applies to anime/movie scaling. Or it may just be an ignorable Toei hax line. Even assuming he was using an invisible KK x10, and assuming Cooler was referring to non-buff Freeza, that'd still make a pre-android arc Goku too strong.

I assume base Goku's at 60-80 million in the Buu arc (that's the range where most people who care about this place him) and 80-100 million at his lifetime max (BOG/EOZ).

edited 23rd Mar '14 11:51:58 AM by sockpuppet1

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#5927: Mar 24th 2014 at 7:31:50 PM

DBH Ultimate Mission 2 trailer:

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#5928: Mar 26th 2014 at 6:12:09 PM

Can Super Saiyan God use the Spirit Bomb?

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#5929: Mar 26th 2014 at 6:27:29 PM

Probably, but it seems like a bad idea to combine "form with limited time" and "long charge time" I wonder if it can absorb Godly genki, if such a thing exists.

edited 26th Mar '14 6:27:52 PM by Saiga

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#5930: Mar 26th 2014 at 6:31:48 PM

So if the East Supreme Kai is vastly stronger than Frieza, why does he freak out about Pui Pui and Yakon, both of whom are weaker than Frieza?

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#5931: Mar 26th 2014 at 6:34:45 PM

Because he's on an Escort Quest and he underestimates the AI outside of Super Mode.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#5932: Mar 26th 2014 at 6:36:25 PM

Ah.

What an idiot.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#5933: Mar 26th 2014 at 6:41:28 PM

AI?

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#5934: Mar 26th 2014 at 6:49:28 PM

Artificial intelligence. I'm referring to escort quests in games where you have to protect AI from enemies and they're usually far weaker than you and don't follow your commands. Which is exactly like the base Saiyan's in Pui Pui's ship, Kaioshin just didn't know that they suppress their powers in base form. He makes a comment about this when Vegeta beats Pui Pui.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#5935: Mar 26th 2014 at 7:32:48 PM

Well Kaioshin didn't know a lot truthfully.

Yeah, there's a reason for that, (all the people who could have trained him were brutally murdered, and he was forced to do Quadruple duty on the whole universe), but still, that boy didn't know shit.

One Strip! One Strip!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#5936: Mar 26th 2014 at 7:51:27 PM

When it came to the base Saiyans, though, he couldn't know shit. They're constantly suppressed below their base maximum, like how Goku arrived on Namek and was just 5,000 casually when his max was 90,000 before Kaio-ken. That's a huge difference, so Kaioshin only knew they were powerful as Super Saiyans and was understandably freaked out when they were being so casual without it.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#5937: Mar 26th 2014 at 7:57:41 PM

About how strong are Pui Pui and Yakon, anyway? Low six-digits? High five-digits?

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#5938: Mar 27th 2014 at 12:09:44 AM

NFI. Pui Pui does talk about 10Gs like it's a big deal, which it only was during the Saiyan arc. On the other hand, how someone handles gravity is based on their experience with it and not just power, as even in the Android arc Gohan was struggling under 10Gs. So it doesn't suggest a whole lot about strength, since Pui Pui only thinks 10G will be disadvantageous for Vegeta - he doesn't know Vegeta's already used to that.

For Yakon, given that Gohan felt he'd need to help Goku once Goku couldn't use Super Saiyan, I think that he's too strong for Gohan to take alone in base. But Goku seems not to have too much trouble with him, aside from the claws. I'd say Goku is stronger than Yakon, and Yakon is between the two Saiyans.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#5939: Mar 27th 2014 at 5:40:01 AM

So, more Battle Of The Gods questions because why not. Can Goku just sort of go Super Saiyan God whenever now, like He did to stop that one attack? Is each pure-hearted Saiyan one-use only, or can you use six pure-hearted Saiyans to make six Super Saiyan Gods? What was that thing about using the power of Super Saiyan God in the regular Super Saiyan state?

...And I sorta wish it was blue instead of red. Because red makes me think of the kaioken. And blue seems like a more divine color.

edited 27th Mar '14 5:48:16 AM by unnoun

nomuru2d Gamer-turning-maker from Port Saint Lucie, FL Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Longing for Dulcinea
Gamer-turning-maker
#5940: Mar 27th 2014 at 8:10:40 AM

It seems that SSG is a desperation move now that Goku has it unlocked.

Long live Cinematech. FC:0259-0435-4987
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#5941: Mar 27th 2014 at 8:12:00 AM

Right before Super Saiyan God activates the second time, you can see the same Care-Bear Stare that powered Goku up the first time fly up to him from the planet. The Saiyans down below must have done the Super Saiyan God ritual again, presumably knowing that Goku needed them to because power sensing/telepathy/King Kai telling them to/insert reason here, because honestly, there's plenty of ways to explain it.

I found this moment to be utterly hilarious because of how much of a slap in the face it was, after Goku spent half the fight whining that he didn't like Super Saiyan God because he doesn't like relying on the help of others, and the other half suddenly being as powerful as Super Saiyan God without it for no good reason. The universe contorted itself to accommodate Goku's childish whining, and then turned right back around and made him use SSG anyway. The rules that govern the universe are a troll.

Regarding the Supreme Kai: I was pretty underwhelmed by him, honestly. He's so completely Overshadowed by Awesome from pretty much the moment he first enters the story, that he just winds up coming off as the Krillin of the gods. Sure, he's probably impressive in his own right, but by the time we meet him, it's just not good enough, and so he instead spends nearly the entire Majin Buu Saga gawking in awe at how powerful every other character in the story is.

He still serves a useful role and contributes plenty to the story, however. He's not useless, which is why I compared him to Krillin instead of Yamcha. He's just desperately outclassed by everyone as far as power is concerned, which is a little bit disappointing for the highest god figure in the story.

edited 27th Mar '14 8:20:33 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#5942: Mar 27th 2014 at 8:23:34 AM

Weird. Goku's never seemed to have a problem using the Spirit Bomb before.

edited 27th Mar '14 8:26:55 AM by unnoun

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#5943: Mar 27th 2014 at 4:05:31 PM

Well there was that stuff from the movies about him not being able to use it with Super Saiyan, I thought that's why you asked if it works with Super Saiyan God.

[up][up] That's because part of the point of the Boo arc is that Saiyans have become so overpowered even the Universe Can't Catch Up, so even Kaioshin can't catch a break despite being stronger than Piccolo.

Also, he's only the highest God because the higher ones got killed off. Depending on your view, South Kaioshin is potentially stronger than Goku or Pure Boo so there's that.

edited 27th Mar '14 4:06:36 PM by Saiga

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#5944: Mar 27th 2014 at 6:08:11 PM

Initially my question about the Spirit Bomb and Super Saiyan God had to do with not being able to use it in most Super Saiyan states.

But then it was mentioned that Goku wants to be powerful but doesn't like relying on other people's power like in Super Saiyan God.

...Except the Spirit Bomb is all about other people's power.

edited 28th Mar '14 6:10:25 AM by unnoun

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#5945: Mar 27th 2014 at 6:26:31 PM

Yeah, and he also relied on Piccolo's Special Beam Cannon to kill Raditz, and on Gohan's power to defeat Cell, and on Fusion and the Spirit Bomb against Majin Buu, not to mention his whole, "Goten and Trunks should defeat Majin Buu, not me!" shtick, or all the times he's relied on others such as Krillin, Gohan, Vegeta, Fat Buu, Piccolo, etc. to fight the villain while he charges the Spirit Bomb....

Battle of Gods kind of pulled that, "I don't like relying on others," bit right out of their ass to give Goku something to whine about during his fight with Bills. Since Gohan was born, Goku's relied on the power of others far more than his own. wild mass guessMaybe a little bit of Vegeta's egocentrism rubbed off on him after the Vegito fusion broke. Vegeta accidentally traded it for some of Goku's humility, which he displayed in the Pure Buu fight, and his dance number in Battle of Gods.wild mass guess

edited 27th Mar '14 6:30:27 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#5946: Mar 27th 2014 at 6:35:12 PM

Oh, right. Even with non-Spirit Bomb examples you can extend that further to the movies and GT where he basically does the Super Saiyan God ritual without Super Saiyan God, and has no problem with it.tongue Movie 4, is given Piccolo's energy. Movie 8, takes energy from everyone. GT, it is literally Saiyans holding hands in a circle like Super Saiyan God.

And he was an eager beaver for fusion throughout most of the Boo arc as well.

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#5947: Mar 27th 2014 at 6:37:52 PM

Is it possible to fuse the Spirit Bomb and the Kamehameha?

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#5948: Mar 27th 2014 at 6:40:16 PM

So an energy wave version of the Spirit Bomb?

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#5949: Mar 27th 2014 at 6:41:58 PM

I want to see a fusion of the Spirit Bomb and Dragon Fist. Movie 7 showed that absorbing the Spirit Bomb and packing it into a punch is possible, so...

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#5950: Mar 27th 2014 at 10:52:54 PM

Eh, the games already do a Spirit Bomb-induced Dragon Fist.


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