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IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#54201: Mar 16th 2017 at 7:57:33 AM

Toriyama does have a ridiculously distinctive style, though. To the point that people can generally recognize his influence on someone at a glance - similar to the art for the Jojo franchise.

Thing is, so many people have drawn inspiration from Toriyama and Dragon Ball, both in terms of art as well as the shifting of said art between a 'comedic' and a 'serious' style (I think that the One Punch Man anime is basically the best to exemplify why this is a technique that more artists should attempt to master) as the need demands, that nowadays, people think his style is generic manganime style.

Which it kind of is, but only because of how much influence he has.

Admittedly, he's not exactly Go Nagai, but then again, there's only one Go Nagai.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
Hobgoblin Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#54202: Mar 16th 2017 at 9:38:30 AM

Well, that topic about Bra's teenage proclivities was certainly a thing.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#54203: Mar 16th 2017 at 9:40:25 AM

Another video from Masako that I thought I'd post here and get your opinions on it:

Now this is entirely a what if so we shouldn't go too crazy on it.

As much as I hate to admit it, I agree that how much Piccolo would grow in strength would be determined by the story at that time. Nail said Piccolo might have been more powerful than Frieza if he and Kami had fused, but that was at a point where Frieza was supposed to be a monumentally overwhelming opponent. The reason it's even brought up is because at that point, it's impossible (there's also the fact that Nail doesn't actually know Frieza's full power, because he spends almost the entirety of Namek sandbagging).

That being said, I do think that if by some miracle, it happened earlier as Masako theorized, the Piccolo / Kami fusion would be scaled back to the approximate level he suggested, for exactly as he said: Goku needs to come save the day.

That being said, he did make one mistake. If he assumes Piccolo would be less powerful in order to not break the story, that means that, in order for them to be a threat, the Androids would have to be even more powerful than they were in canon (both the main universe and Trunks' time as well) and then our heroes would be pretty screwed.

One Strip! One Strip!
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#54204: Mar 16th 2017 at 2:00:17 PM

It occurs to me that even if it would only help their chances a bit, they should do the Super Saiyan God Ritual with Gohan. Ignoring any other variables with the choices, Trunks and Goten would be good for that too.

It stopped being special as soon as Vegeta did it just by training (that is a thing that happened right?) so might as well speed it along when the fate of the universe is at stake.

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#54205: Mar 16th 2017 at 2:10:07 PM

Actually, that video of Gogeta vs Vegito made me wonder, but what would happen if Super Saiyan 4 and the god forms did exist within the same continuity; which of them would wind up being stronger, and would SSG remain a one-time form leading up to Blue, since 4 could technically replace it in the hierarchy?

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#54206: Mar 16th 2017 at 2:20:22 PM

I also think another question would have to be asked.

Like were the original Super Saiyan & Super Saiyan God separate people or were they one & the same?

Cause I always imagine that 4 is what the original looked like cause of the primal aesthetic it has meaning 4 has you go back to how Saiyans used to look like thousands of years before.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#54207: Mar 16th 2017 at 2:30:39 PM

SSJ 4 and SSJG's place in the hierarchy would depend on which comes first. The one that comes first is weaker.

Unless one of them is explicitly a one-time thing.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
GAP Formerly G.G. from Who Knows? Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: In love with love
Formerly G.G.
#54208: Mar 16th 2017 at 4:18:28 PM

It isn't though that we know the multiplier for SSJG anyway as there any sense of, 'Omigosh Goku is ungodly powerful' as they cannot sense God ki.

"Mai waifu."
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#54209: Mar 16th 2017 at 6:32:11 PM

Which came first, the ginger or the ape?

The legend has returned.
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#54210: Mar 16th 2017 at 6:42:33 PM

The ape. The ape is a normal part of their physiology, insane alien physiology but natural nonetheless, while the SSJG comes from a ritual. One always happened, the other they had to discover how to make happen.

edited 16th Mar '17 6:42:53 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
plays capoeira
#54211: Mar 16th 2017 at 6:58:28 PM

I'm not sure the original super saiyan god was a person. I think that was a mistake on the part of the surviving saiyans, who probably weren't thinking straight in a life or death situation that couldn't be solved by hitting it really hard, they were already doing the ritual wrong until Whis pointed it out.

But in Battle Of Gods, Super Saiyan God explicitly disappears in that flashback. I'm guessing he/it was an entity born wholly out of righteous saiyan desire to defeat the enemy and the present saiyans channeled something similar into an extant body, which would explain why Goku not only didn't disappear but gained a power up sorts. In fact, it might be possible Sheron/Whis deliberately mislead/let them do it wrong because they knew it would be better that way.

Original Super Saiyan disappeared too, granted, but in the 'destroyed planet currently on' sense, not the 'was easily winning fight but sudden faded into thin air' sense.

Buldogue's lawyer
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#54212: Mar 16th 2017 at 7:03:55 PM

It still bugs me that there were two great Saiyan legends - one with a rampaging Super Saiyan who side-B'd off the stage, and another about an even more unstoppable kind-hearted Saiyan who wasted his or her five minutes of fame by not eliminating the evil Saiyans.

Both legends revolve around someone pure of heart.

Not only does this species possess Zenkais, they have two Super Mode's one of which turns them into a deity and the other which mutates into even greater forms.

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
Gehayadren Bad Movie Binge Collector from A Garbage Fire Since: Jun, 2016 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#54213: Mar 16th 2017 at 7:07:59 PM

Super Saiyan 4 isn't even a Super Saiyan form at all. Also, at this point, GT might as well be Alternate Continuity.

edited 16th Mar '17 7:08:21 PM by Gehayadren

Ha ha ha. What a story, Mark.
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#54214: Mar 16th 2017 at 7:11:20 PM

GT can't function as an alternative continuity because it presents mortals stronger than Kid Buu, and we know there ain't any.

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#54215: Mar 16th 2017 at 7:11:41 PM

Well there legends & legends can get fucked over time so maybe the original Super Saiyan was also a God.

Also I just thought of something so does this make sense? The reason why SS 4 Gogeta has red hair at least now with the existence of the God form is because due to being a fusion of 2 SS 4's & the exponential power increase a fusion gives you his power is so great as a result Gogeta in that form is not a SS 4 or not just a SS 4 but he's already becoming a God. He even has a divine-ish battle aura so his Ki is already morphing into God Ki & the reason why he's not blue yet is because he's only a partial God & he hasn't mastered proper Ki control yet.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
IAmNotCreativeEnough himitsu keisatsu from asa kara ban made omae o miru Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: GAR for Archer
himitsu keisatsu
#54216: Mar 16th 2017 at 7:16:23 PM

Actually, considering that just before that, Goku was receiving power from a bunch of SSJ...

It would totally fit that SSJ 4 Gogeta was never SSJ 4, he was actually SSJG Gogeta and they never noticed it. That was why Omega couldn't tell how outclassed he was at a glance.

edited 16th Mar '17 7:16:51 PM by IAmNotCreativeEnough

himitsu keisatsu seifu chokuzoku kokka hoanbu na no da himitsu keisatsu yami ni magireru supai katsudou torishimari
MightyMatilda Mr. Clueless from New Jersey, USA Since: Jan, 2015
Mr. Clueless
#54217: Mar 16th 2017 at 7:21:26 PM

@Soble: Is there a trope for Mary Sue, but applied to an entire race?

De Romanīs, lingua Latina gloriosa non fuī.
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#54218: Mar 16th 2017 at 8:07:44 PM

@IANCE You say that as if half of the mortals that have shown up in Super, Frieza included, haven't already left Pure Buu in the dust.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#54219: Mar 16th 2017 at 8:12:41 PM

[up][up]There is but I'm not entirely sure if it counts when it really only applies to a handful.

This song needs more love.
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#54220: Mar 16th 2017 at 8:47:58 PM

To be fair they technically do represent their entire race at this point.

edited 16th Mar '17 9:02:19 PM by Soble

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#54221: Mar 16th 2017 at 8:57:32 PM

Okay I always knew the Super Saiyan 4 turned Goku from a child into an adult but today I found out that it also makes Vegeta taller, which is the greatest thing I've ever heard. Turns out GT is a masterpiece actually.

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#54222: Mar 16th 2017 at 9:12:35 PM

It makes Adult Goku taller too; guy stands above pretty much everyone not named Piccolo at that point.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#54223: Mar 16th 2017 at 9:35:36 PM

He was already that tall though...

If it actually made him taller, he should've at least been equal to Piccoro's height.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#54224: Mar 16th 2017 at 9:38:04 PM

Vegeta assimilated very well to Earth culture as he's seen wearing normal human clothing all the time instead of his Saiyan body-armor & jump-suit.

Did he ever wear the latter in GT?

edited 16th Mar '17 9:38:42 PM by slimcoder

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#54225: Mar 16th 2017 at 9:44:49 PM

Last I checked by the Buu Saga, Gohan was taller than Goku; in Super Saiyan 4 Goku is like a full head taller than him, even though he's only supposed to be at most 5'8".

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!

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