Look, I'm not trying to hurt anybody's feelings or start any flame wars or anything, but do you guys think that out of all the characters, Yamcha and Chi-Chi got the worst treatment overall?
With Yamcha, I understand he's not that well-liked in this forum very much, but guys, please, be honest here. I do believe he was treated very harshly in the show. DBZ took his Butt-Monkey status to Deus Angst Machina levels, and the guys didn't get thrown a single bone, and he did die the most humiliating way ever (killed by a Saibaman). He even lost his girlfriend to his own killer, and he remains a vagabond. Even his own voice actor thinks he's a wuss.
With Chi-Chi, I understand the fandom doesn't like her too much because of how flanderized she was in the anime with her annoying overprotectiveness and temper, but out of the females, she got it the worse. I mean, girl married a guys she barely knew (well, it is half of her fault, but it's not her fault for not knowing Goku and Gohan were saiyan), and he keeps on dying and he let to train Uub (no wonder she has anger issues lol). Sure you may say "but Bulma was just as bad behaving/worse than Chi-Chi!". That may be true, but Bulma was very useful, while Chi-Chi never got a role like Android 18, Bulma, and Videl did in the DBZ series. Even her own voice actress admitted that all she did was yell and bitch as Chi-Chi lol.
edited 15th Feb '14 6:13:27 PM by MsCC93
I think it's weird how most of the females were awful people and eventually useless.
There aren't many possible interpretations or imaginings or potential versions of Gohan's conception where Chi Chi wasn't basically molesting Goku. The odds of Goku knowing and understanding what sex was and how it worked are low, and even lower are the odds of him knowing the risks and possible consequences of sexual intercourse.
...Bulma's first appearance involved running over Goku and shooting him in the head then lying to him and trying to seduce him for her own purposes.
Launch was basically literally bipolar.
Android 18 starts off trying to kill Goku with her brother and 16. Not counting the future timeline.
edited 15th Feb '14 6:21:14 PM by unnoun
![]()
![]()
I'm kind of indifferent toward Yamcha.
Chi Chi, meanwhile, had a son who became part of a major corporation, or had a promising future ahead of him. Her nagging never annoyed me, because hell, short of the Androids, she was mostly right. Sure, Gohan could've kept fighting and training, and where would he be? Construction worker. Lab experiment. Astronaut? His fault for not balancing the two.
-
To interrupt, and be totally rude, because not-manners...
I was just watching the scene where Gohan transforms:
This is the only scene in the series that I prefer in Japanese, because of the way its set up, the song actually incorporating the flapping wings, and Gohan's silence, and Cell's reaction, and while I'm taking all this in I realize...
...Gohan is watching his own father and friends getting beaten by a group of sadistic Cell Juniors, and it's the destruction of #16 that actually makes him lose it.
I mean, damn. Goten didn't transform either and he actually saw Chi Chi turned into an egg and stepped on.
edited 15th Feb '14 6:29:53 PM by FOFD
![]()
![]()
I disagree with Android 18. She started off as a teenage delinquent along with her brother and Android 16 bent on murdering Goku, but she mellowed out. Many fans consider her the greatest female character of the show.
I agree. With Chi-Chi, I agree that she means well, but in the anime, she's flanderized to the point when she comes off as trying to control every facet of Gohan's life, when in the manga, she's still overbearing, but not as bad in the anime. I mean, even Toriyama admits that Gohan wants to be a scholar, and I have proof if anyone doesn't believe me. To be honest, I do find some of her complaining annoying, except her protests and complaints about the well-being of her children.
![]()
A teenage delinquent with plans of murder. Um. Yeah. No. Granted, she's not as bad as her future self.
I like her, but a moral paragon she was not.
Too many damn people die each year from "accidents". Watch the goddamned road when you're operating a motor vehicle.
Bulma was probably more evil than Android 18. Or Chi Chi. Maybe. I dunno, Chi-Chi maybe sorta raping Goku is pretty bad too.
The thing with consent is it has to be informed consent. You have to understand what the fuck you're agreeing to.
Which, I mean, Bulma definitely violated considering Goku thought he could keep the four-star dragon ball after the wish. The jury's out on Chi Chi but still. Kinda creepy.
edited 15th Feb '14 6:56:15 PM by unnoun
You're completely right. I sounded like a hypocrite/idiot. Yeah, I do agree that 18 wasn't any better. She's just the least tsunderish/loud out of all the female characters of the show, that's it. I love 18 too, but yeah.
The thing with consent is it has to be informed consent. You have to understand what the fuck you're agreeing to.
Which, I mean, Bulma definitely violated considering Goku thought he could keep the four-star dragon ball after the wish. The jury's out on Chi Chi but still. Kinda creepy.
Umm, so why do you think Bulma's more evil than Chi-Chi (and Android 18)..and where did you get the idea that Chi-Chi "raped" Goku??
edited 15th Feb '14 7:30:24 PM by MsCC93
To be fair on 18, she and her brother were kidnapped by an insane scientist and forcefully turned against their wills into cyborgs, which must have been horrifically painful; she really is much more well adjusted than she should be considering that.
Also, Gohan's conception might be iffy, but that doesn't explain Goten's conception, which most likely happened during the ten day wait for the Cell Games.
Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!Because I'm not sure Goku was entirely sure what sex was the first time he and Chi Chi copulated. And I'm more confident that Chi Chi would have known more about it than he did. And that she knew anything about it and he didn't. And that raises some serious issues with consent.
And Bulma was a reckless driver, tried to murder a child, tried to seduce said child to steal his most prized possession that he believed was his grandfather, manipulated said child into being her enforcer, all under the false pretense that he would get to keep his most prized possession when she used it to get her wish.
I suppose the difference between Bulma's misdeeds and Chi Chi's is that I know about Bulma's, while Chi-Chi's are more supposition and Fridge Logic/Horror. I mean, I can't think of a way things would go that would be in-character for both her and Goku while still being ethically sound, but I suppose there might be a possibility. And yes Goten's conception would have been better for everyone all around.
Bulma was, in the series itself, prone to engaging in a lot of misconduct. It's how she and Goku met. She ran him over and fucking shot him. She lied to him for their entire journey together. So he could beat people up for her.
edited 15th Feb '14 7:28:17 PM by unnoun
I think I remember a fanfic that touched on that whole issue. Chi-Chi was mad because it was three months into the marriage and they hadn't sealed the deal, and Goku was stressed out because he wanted to, but didn't realize it was expected of him because living with Master Roshi made him think that sexual desires would just get him a slap to the face.
Never did find out how it ended.
edited 15th Feb '14 7:19:06 PM by RedM
The very best, like no one ever was. Check out my Spider-Man fanfic here! [1]
x3 Makes a lot of sense. Which may be the reason why I saw her as a delinquent at first. Also, it was very satisfying for them to give Dr. Gero his just desserts at the end when they attempt to reactivate Android 16.
That sucks. I wish I got to read that fanfic.
edited 16th Feb '14 6:13:15 AM by MsCC93
Anyway, let' move on to another topic. Has anyone played the Tenkaichi games, and what does everyone think of Beers? To me, I think he's a decent villain, despite being Affably Evil. He's also funny to boot, because of how he rages over petty things like pudding.
edited 16th Feb '14 8:05:21 AM by MsCC93
Welcome to Japan.
I mean, damn. Goten didn't transform either and he actually saw Chi Chi turned into an egg and stepped on.
Gohan is watching a group of people he knows are highly capable warriors, steadily losing their respective fights. He's a frightened child whose father always manages to pull insane victories out of his ass, and he's steadily clinging to hope that something will turn this fight around. 16 didn't matter more to him, he was just the first to die, and prove that hope is lost, everyone's going to die, and ONLY Gohan can stop it.
There are leagues of severity between the emotional response to, "Things are bad and people might die," and "Things are bad and people are actively dying right now." Crossing that threshold is where Gohan snapped.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.The numerous complaints about how females characters are always weaker than the males (often for no real reason at all) would attest to that.
Though we shouldn't act as if only Japan is sexist.
One Strip! One Strip!![]()
You mean the large lipped Black people?
Or is there something else ridiculously racist about Japan?
I sometimes wonder if I'm a little racist towards them (inadvertently) in my criticisms.
What Irony?
edited 16th Feb '14 11:22:44 AM by HandsomeRob
One Strip! One Strip!

Drop the "-key". Beers' assistant is named "Whis".
And I just noticed that, after fusing with Mr. Buu, GT Uub would technically be a good reincarnation of Super Buu. Explains why he became so much stronger and started showing a cunning side.
edited 15th Feb '14 4:33:53 PM by sockpuppet1