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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#39951: Jun 9th 2016 at 5:55:39 AM

Saiga, here's the thing, the 40 tons thing cannot be used because of the Bukujutsu thing; when someone is on the ground lifting something, they're also pushing off the ground with their legs to help counteract the force pushing them down, it's why "lift with your legs" is a thing. However, when you're flying in the air, there's no ground you can push against, so you're stuck having to completely relying on your arms (and your back, which is dangerous) to lift anything. Goku could easily be capable of lifting more weight on the ground since he'd be pushing against this; though this would really only apply to arm weights, it would still make the overall weight he could lift with his whole body greater on the ground.

So like do you not understand the meaning of the word "minimum" or...?

edited 9th Jun '16 5:55:52 AM by Saiga

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#39952: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:02:48 AM

[up][up]You can have Gohan guide them after they get him out of his lasting slump. He'd have something to fight for.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
plays capoeira
#39953: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:06:02 AM

Neko Majin Z showed that Goku still came home to visit his family while training Uub. GT's leaving for years thing was stupid.

You know it's bad when the gag manga shows the hero to be more considerate than the "actual" continuation.

Buldogue's lawyer
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#39954: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:11:39 AM

Of course he came to visit, even Goku likes his family.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#39955: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:11:57 AM

Yeah, that gag manga seriously fucked up Goku's character.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#39956: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:18:31 AM

How's it done that?

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#39957: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:20:01 AM

By making him care, I think.

Ramona122003 Since: Jan, 2001
#39958: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:27:24 AM

Goku is a bad father was a cute meme with some grain of truth given how Goku tends to leave his family on a moments noticed that has gone completely out of control. Now, people really think Goku is an utterly selfish asshole who doesn't care about his family.

What makes this odd is that apparently he's only seen this way in the US where in Asia and most Europe he's seen as a good or decent father. Even funnier, Goku spoils Gohan too much according to Japan which was why there was sub-plot with Gohan was becoming less spoiled as he grew up.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#39959: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:35:13 AM

Goku spoils Gohand?

Uh, when was that "what if" scenario?

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#39960: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:36:45 AM

I was only joking (I do think he's decent and mostly screwed over by circumstance), but that [up] is just going too far in the other direction. Gohan isn't spoiled at all.

GT portraying him as completely absent is not necessarily wrong though, as he has abandoned his family for training before (learning to teleport) and he doesn't understand familial commitments anyway.

edited 9th Jun '16 6:37:45 AM by Saiga

Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#39961: Jun 9th 2016 at 6:54:31 AM

Looks like DBH God Mission 9 is getting Adult Future Trunks, SSJBKK Goku, Time Patrol Goku (or some sort of Goku with a new Gi and Power Pole) and something that looks like Vegeta (?).

There's also a few other silhouettes and designs that are too small to make out, so I'll try to find out later.

edited 9th Jun '16 6:55:21 AM by Rinsankajugin

BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#39962: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:04:19 AM

Its mostly the Abridged series` fault that the "goku is a bad father" meme got started to be honest. People just took a joke and went full Ron the Death Eater with it and make Goku out to be the most selfish and neglectful father ever while praise the likes of Piccolo and Vegeta as "better" fathers. I'm kinda glad they're subverting it and have Goku and Gohan bond while in the Time chamber, but I think the damage is done...

It just kind of ignores the fact that most of the time Goku is absent is entirely due to circumstance and he does spend time with his family when he feels like it, even if he prefers to train and get stronger but that's just his saiyan instincts and there's no ill-will behind it.

edited 9th Jun '16 7:05:04 AM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
Ramona122003 Since: Jan, 2001
#39963: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:06:46 AM

I didn't say Gohan was spoiled. I said that he was viewed as spoiled in Japan and was called spoiled by Piccolo and even himself in the Japanese text.

Also, sorry for not reading your post as a joke. Hard to tell when someone is being serious or not on the internet.

Goku will go a long time without seeing his family, but GT took it a too far by saying he went ten years without seeing anyone. Even in Z where he went five years without seeing his friends, he was with his family most of the time.

edited 9th Jun '16 7:10:30 AM by Ramona122003

Zeromaeus Since: May, 2010
#39964: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:08:16 AM

Piccollo is better? Maybe. Maybe not. With Gohan, I'm leaning not. Piccollo's training was insanely harsh to put a four year old through. Or anyone. Significantly more present during his formative years thanks to Goku being dead and therefore forming a special bond that endeared Piccollo to Gohan and vice versa. Yes.

edited 9th Jun '16 7:09:20 AM by Zeromaeus

Ramona122003 Since: Jan, 2001
#39965: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:16:41 AM

The Piccolo example is especially ironic since Piccolo get praised for always being there for Gohan unlike Goku, yet he throw a five years boy who had never been in a live battle before against two aliens who regularly performed genocide and chews Gohan out so badly that he was ready to leave in tears when he got scared. To rub salt in the wound, he agrees with Gohan that it's his fault that Tien died.

Goku does the same thing to Gohan during the Cell Games, because Gohan is the only one who can beat Cell, yet Goku is the most horrible person the world. Not to say what Goku did was completely right, he should have warned Gohan what was about to happen and not give Cell a Senzu, but Piccolo literally did the same thing and no one in the fandom calls him a bad person for it. In fact, the fandom calls Gohan a wimp for, gasp, acting his age and being scared shitless over fighting the Saiyans.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#39966: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:19:19 AM

That was when Piccoro was still a terrible person and kidnapped children.

But even Piccoro likes Goku's family.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Rinsankajugin Since: Feb, 2012
#39967: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:22:37 AM

Dragon Ball masks! Would ya want one?

Also, Vegeta gets pissy again:

edited 9th Jun '16 7:28:23 AM by Rinsankajugin

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#39968: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:42:55 AM

Goku does the same thing to Gohan during the Cell Games, because Gohan is the only one who can beat Cell, yet Goku is the most horrible person the world. Not to say what Goku did was completely right, he should have warned Gohan what was about to happen and not give Cell a Senzu, but Piccolo literally did the same thing and no one in the fandom calls him a bad person for it. In fact, the fandom calls Gohan a wimp for, gasp, acting his age and being scared shitless over fighting the Saiyans.

Nobody gives Piccolo a pass for it. Fans don't bring it up because they don't need to hold it against him; the show already does. That Piccolo was a rotten, dirty bastard whose heart was slowly changing by love for his surrogate child is the point, so pointing out that Piccolo was being a rotten, dirty bastard during his rotten, dirty bastard years doesn't have quite the same punch as when Goku screws up.

We expect villains to be assholes and Piccolo was still counted among that category until he gave his life to save Gohan. But Goku was the good guy, the pure-hearted beacon of innocence whose inherent pureness was a major plot point throughout the series. So when he f*cks up, the fandom's more critical of it than when Evil Asshole Piccolo is assholish.

Part of which is also because the fandom doesn't always interpret "pure of heart" in the right way, mind you.

edited 9th Jun '16 7:44:58 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
IndirectActiveTransport plays capoeira from Chicago (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Every rose has its thorn
plays capoeira
#39969: Jun 9th 2016 at 7:52:49 AM

If I were still of the tricker treating age(or if my residence got trick or treaters) I'd go for a Piccolo mask.

And Goku spoils Gohan? That's way too far in the opposite direction, but I understand where the sentiment comes from. Goku grew up in such a state of poverty he was reduced to using his grandfather's ball sack as a cushion. Gohan, by contrast, had his own room. The no good softie, Goku is clearly spoiling him! What people forget is that Chi Chi grew up in a palace. They forget about the other half of the marriage. And yes, Goku does let Gohan take breaks from his studies, but he also let Gohan take breaks from his training. Goku was taught the importance of breaks from an early age.

Buldogue's lawyer
Ramona122003 Since: Jan, 2001
#39970: Jun 9th 2016 at 8:22:51 AM

Again, I never said Goku spoiled Gohan. I said the Japanese saw him as spoiled and that was even a plot point in the original manga and anime that was downplayed in the English dub since Gohan's behavior doesn't comes off as spoiled to most western audiences. It's a culture different.

As for Gohan, fans really don't hold the kidnapping Piccolo pulled against him, or even the show really. They mostly just hand wave it and gets on Gohan for not 'maning' up. Even within the series it shows that Piccolo was right about Gohan needing to grow up and doesn't really paint Piccolo as wrong for bringing a five years into the battlefield. The only person who said anything is Chi-Chi, who is often painted as an overprotected mother hen.

But even if we discount that, Piccolo trained Gohan for the androids and he didn't protest when Goku took Gohan into the Hyperbolic Time Chamber to train. He didn't protest Gohan fighting until Goku sent him to fight Cell, and part of that is because he didn't believe Gohan was stronger than Goku, so some of Piccolo's protest comes off as hypocritical.

Also, up until that moment with Cell, Goku always sideline Gohan the moment he got on the battlefield. He never allowed Gohan to fight unless he was physically unable to like with Vegeta, Ginyu, and Frieza. With Cell, he made sure Gohan was stronger than him and fought first so Gohan knew how Cell fought. If could have, he would have handle Cell himself and never put Gohan on the battlefield. The two mistakes he made was not telling Gohan, although he did this so Gohan wouldn't worried or feel pressured, and given Cell a Senzu.

And to add one final bit of irony, in the Resurrection 'F' arc in Super, Goku tells Goten and Trunks to leave and this wasn't the place for children. The fandom called Goku a bad person for sending Goten and Trunks away because they can help, and Goku had no problem sending Goten and Trunks to fight Majin Buu. Never mind that the only reason that happened is because all the other powerful fighters were dead (at least thought to be), including Goku, and no one was really happy about it.

edited 9th Jun '16 8:29:43 AM by Ramona122003

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#39971: Jun 9th 2016 at 8:55:21 AM

[up]

Wow.

Goku is a much better father then we've all been giving him credit for.

And Japan has some interesting ideas about what does and doesn't spoil children.

One Strip! One Strip!
BlackYakuzu94 CHADhan Player. from Easy Coast/NY Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
CHADhan Player.
#39972: Jun 9th 2016 at 9:32:26 AM

Yea, Goku will only put his children in danger if he felt like he had no other choice, otherwise he's more than willing to step in for them.

By the time he fought Cell, Goku already knew Gohan was stronger than him but still fought Cell first anyway despite knowing he couldn't win. Partially because, its still Goku and he wanted his shot at Cell before he left things to Gohan, but I also think he didn't want to send his son out there if he had no other choice.

So when it became clear that Goku could not beat Cell, he respectfully gave up and left it to his son. While Piccolo was right to say that Gohan isn't like Goku or Vegeta and that he does not relish in the fight, I think his anger was kind of misdirected at Goku since he was just upset at seeing his surrogate son get beaten. That and Goku did the incredibly naive move of giving Cell a senzu, but Saiyans are really prone to making stupid mistakes like that for the sake of a fight, so its more biological than anything.

So yea, Goku loves his family and will not put them in harms way if he could step in himself, and the one time he did, he knew he fucked up and never did it again. (lol Buu) But he's biologically a race that prioritizes fighting above anything else, even over familial bonds.

edited 9th Jun '16 9:33:17 AM by BlackYakuzu94

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.
randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#39973: Jun 9th 2016 at 9:32:38 AM

[up][up]He's always been better, due to the exaggeration.

At one point in this lifetime you may have said Goku bit Gohand's head off and it would've meant the same thing as him being a terriblé padré.

[up]He fought Cell first as a demonstration of what Gohand would be up against.

edited 9th Jun '16 9:34:36 AM by randomness4

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
Arha Since: Jan, 2010
#39974: Jun 9th 2016 at 9:37:53 AM

Gohand, Gohan's deformed twin brother who was chained in the attic to avoid shaming Chichi in front of the neighbors.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#39975: Jun 9th 2016 at 9:42:04 AM

Hell, as stupid as it was, even the Senzu thing, in the long run made no difference.

Gohan was still infinitely stronger, so Cell being fixed by the bean, while still stupid in context, really didn't matter at all in the long run.

The most it did was make it clear that even when fully restored, Cell was still infinitely weaker then Gohan.

One Strip! One Strip!

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